You mean there has been doubts as to whether Shaq is the best center in the league?...He's the reason for all (soon to be 3) of LA's rings..I did'nt know anyone had ever doubted Shaq daddy..It's Kobe that raises the eyebrows as to whther his hype is justified...Phil Jackson's Triangle offense has always relied heavily on the center..Even back in the days of the Bulls first run..The first 3 quarters he they would feed the inside to Bill Cartwright and then in the 4th Jordan would clean up..The league will change for sure when Shaq retires no doubt about that..He's a monster
Actually, you just proved my point. I've always said "Shaq is the man in LA" in which these die-hard Kobe fans disagree. Apparently, you haven't been paying much attention. That's what all the debate has been about. They always giving Kobe the credit for everything, yet Shaq doing majority of the work.
no this is for a post from a week ago.. in which you were talking about Shaq being nothing but a big man who uses his size to score.. this has nothing to do with Kobe.. Shaq already is the best center of all-time, yet a lot of ppl disagree.. be he has already proven everything and more than any other center..
<< <i>no this is for a post from a week ago.. in which you were talking about Shaq being nothing but a big man who uses his size to score.. this has nothing to do with Kobe.. Shaq already is the best center of all-time, yet a lot of ppl disagree.. be he has already proven everything and more than any other center.. >>
Ohh... when we were comparing Shaq to Jordan? That article said Shaq could be the best CENTER in NBa history, not best player in NBA history.
O'Neal had this to say about Bryant: "He's the best player in this league. The scary thing about that is he doesn't think he is and he wants to get better, and he will get better."
O'Neal decided yesterday that there is only one thing lacking in Bryant's game. "I think sometimes he needs more room to operate," the big man said.
ARGUE WITH SHAQS STATEMENTS NOW AUTO AND AI3
SINCE YOU HAVE SO MUCH RESPECT FOR SHAQ!! RESPECT HIS OPINION KIDS.
<< <i>did shaq win a title without kobe yes or no?
bye bye kobe haters >>
He could now. With Orlando, he and Penny were bumping heads to who would be the star and fighting over the ball. Now tell me this, if Shaq was in Charlotte with Baron Davis, do you still think Lakers would win a Championship? I would bet my entire collection that 2 things would happen. Lakers wouldn't get past Sacramento and Charlotte would win the Championship. As long as you have a good shooting guard and Shaq, that = championship. Look how much fight the Kings put up with a good PF and a good shooting guard (the rest of the team was cold as ice).
<< <i>O'Neal had this to say about Bryant: "He's the best player in this league. The scary thing about that is he doesn't think he is and he wants to get better, and he will get better."
O'Neal decided yesterday that there is only one thing lacking in Bryant's game. "I think sometimes he needs more room to operate," the big man said.
ARGUE WITH SHAQS STATEMENTS NOW AUTO AND AI3
SINCE YOU HAVE SO MUCH RESPECT FOR SHAQ!! RESPECT HIS OPINION KIDS. >>
Respect his "opinion"? I respect facts, not "opinions".
I've watched Shaq throughout his career, he is a dominating force, but the best center ever? I wouldn't go that far. I don't think he will ever capture the scoring or rebounding avgs. that Wilt did. Wilt is the greatest center of all time, no doubt.
Ilove-"did shaq win a title without kobe yes or no?" Did Kobe win a title without shaq? Put shaq on ANY team with a quality SG(Guys like Tmac, Bonzi, VC, or AI) and you have got yourself a Championship team. For a championship team, you need a quality big man downlow and somebody who can throw it up beyond the arch or drive in the lane and put it away.
I think you could put Shaq on a even with lousy guards and he would pull down a couple of rings. All they would have to do is dish it into him, because he has no competition. The majority of centers today are weak. Bring back Jabaar, Chamberlain, Russel, Ewing, and Olajuwan in thier primes, now that would be some competition.
Olajuwan already showed Shaq the way in the 1995 NBA Finals. The "Dream" sweeped Shaq and the Magic 4-0. The "Dream" in his prime embarassed Shaq. Shaq was young though. It would be interesting to see today's Shaq play against him or any of the past great centers in their prime.
Regardless. Kobe is nothing without Shaq. Kobe is smart. He won't leave Shaq. He will leave Shaq when Shaq retires, then we will really see how good Kobe is.
Kobe hasn't proved anything. He is walking in Shaq's footsteps, or even better he is riding Shaq's coat tails like the rest of the Lakers team.
Looking for former University of Arizona NBA RC's in PSA or BGS 9's/GEM MINT grades. Die hard University of Arizona and Bay Area Sports fan.
<< <i>Olajuwan already showed Shaq the way in the 1995 NBA Finals. The "Dream" sweeped Shaq and the Magic 4-0. The "Dream" in his prime embarassed Shaq. Shaq was young though. It would be interesting to see today's Shaq play against him or any of the past great centers in their prime.
Regardless. Kobe is nothing without Shaq. Kobe is smart. He won't leave Shaq. He will leave Shaq when Shaq retires, then we will really see how good Kobe is.
Kobe hasn't proved anything. He is walking in Shaq's footsteps, or even better he is riding Shaq's coat tails like the rest of the Lakers team. >>
"The Dream" had range outside the point. Had a nice 20 ft. turnaround jumper.
jep.. the dream was great, I loved to watch him play.. and indeed.. Shaq was young, and we can only imagine what it would be if the great centers of all time like Mikan, Wilt, Russell, Kareem, David Robinson, Olajuwon, and some others play against each other.. yet that will never happen.. every single one of them had their weaknesses, Wilt couldn't pass, couldn't shoot FT's AT ALL, Kareem wasn't the imosing giant a dominant center normally is, Russell couldn't score, and so on.. so taking notice of the fact that Shaq's FT's have gone up to about 65%, he now really is the best center of all time to me, and a lot of others too
it's not because of the FT's on their own.. it's because that was his only weakness.. I mean.. the man is a great passer, has a SUPERB body controll, is one of the best defensive players in the league and has the best post game in the league, for the past 10 years and for many years to come
and the argument that center's aren't supposed to shoot FT's is just lame to me.. that would be the same as if you'd say that they shouldn't be able to pass, or that a guard shouldn't be able to post up
<< <i>jep.. the dream was great, I loved to watch him play.. and indeed.. Shaq was young, and we can only imagine what it would be if the great centers of all time like Mikan, Wilt, Russell, Kareem, David Robinson, Olajuwon, and some others play against each other.. yet that will never happen.. every single one of them had their weaknesses, Wilt couldn't pass, couldn't shoot FT's AT ALL, Kareem wasn't the imosing giant a dominant center normally is, Russell couldn't score, and so on.. so taking notice of the fact that Shaq's FT's have gone up to about 65%, he now really is the best center of all time to me, and a lot of others too >>
Kareem?? What's? Look at how many points he have. That skyhook was rarely blocked if ever.
He has no competition, that is why he is so dominate. Who is he up against, Shawn Bradley, Divac, Mutumbo, and Olowakandi. Come on, of course he is a beast against them.
If you put that 320lb frame on Olajuwan I think you would see a much better center then Shaq is. Granted Shaq doesn't need an outside shot nor does he need the graceful footwork Olajuwan had. Shaq's game is inside. If there was anyone in the NBA who could stop his inside game then he'd have to devolope a more polished game like Olajuwan had. Until that day comes Shaq will always dominate the NBA. There's no stopping him no matter what team he goes to next or what players the Lakers bring in or trade out.
Looking for former University of Arizona NBA RC's in PSA or BGS 9's/GEM MINT grades. Die hard University of Arizona and Bay Area Sports fan.
Penny didn't have what it takes to win a ring...he wasm't injured until Shaq left, and he is no where near Kobe's status. What kills me is people act like Kobe has NO part in the championships that the Lakers have won. Kobe is definitely a clutch and he makes many plays happen. I do admit that if there were no Shaq...then there would be no championships...BUT, it's vice versa as well....if there were no KOBE, then there wouldn't be any rings either...Kobe has DEFINITELY contributed in these past 3 seasons of the championships...just look at the awesome stats he's put up, not to mention his defense is underrated. He's the best overall player in the NBA...said by MJ himself, Michael Wilbon, Jack Ramsay, Charles Barkley, Phil Jackson, and even SHAQ has said it...I mean, it's no secret...there's just people who like to hate on him because he's either a Laker, or they just don't like his attitude...which I don't see why they'd dislike his attitude because he's actually a well rounded guy come to think of it...It's one thing to hate on someone, but to not give them credit for the greatness that they have and what they contribute is just plain out lame in my opinion...Shaq needs Kobe as much as Kobe needs Shaq...they need each other to win titles...bottom line.
Put today's Shaq on any team with a decent scorer and they win a championship. Kobe helps but he's not the one making the difference. Shaq owns the opposition. He's unstoppable. His 3rd NBA title and third NBA Finals MVP speak more then words.
Didn't Bryon Scott say Shaq could win a title with the Grizzlies??
Looking for former University of Arizona NBA RC's in PSA or BGS 9's/GEM MINT grades. Die hard University of Arizona and Bay Area Sports fan.
Chamberlain's Career feats: 2 Finals rings 100 points in one game against the Knicks March 2, 1962 7 NBA scoring titles 11 NBA rebounding titles 4 NBA MVP A 55 rebound game in 1960 50.4 PPG in 1961-1962 season 27.2 RPG in 1960-1961 season
Career Avgs.: PPG-30.1 RPG-22.9 FG%-54% FT%-51%
Those are some stats to chew on dead man. Show me how Shaq's better. Wilt had better compeitition back then as well.
Shaq changes defenses, when ever you have to double and triple team one man it leaves a wide varity of offenses. Kobe has a sweet turn around but when it comes to a clutch shot I dont have that much confidence in him. Shaq has got to be ONE of the sweetest passers and smartest assist men in the game. It also doesnt hurt that he outweights everyone by 50+ lbs. Now if he was just more dependable on the free throw line! Thats a big weakness, but he is getting better.
agreeing with memphis here.. his FT's were falling @ more than 65% in the play-offs, + ppl are smarter now than they were back then, as they use the Hack-A-Shaq, I never heard of a Hack-a-Wilt. If Shaq takes 30 shots a game like Iverson does, he will score 38 points per game EASILY, as he has lead the league in points per 48 minutes for the past 6 or 7 seasons. + Shaq GETS HIS TEAMMATES INVOLVED. That's a fact Wilt never heard of, so yeah.. he still is the best ever to me, and in 4 or 5 years, you'll agree
Was hard to hack-a-Wilt. Have you seen any footage of him playing? He had a sweet turnaround finger roll which was like he was just dropping the ball in the basket.
Shaq's in his prime now. Most big centers are only good for around 12 years. I don't see Shaq being the best ever. He is the best playing in the league right now, I don't see him getting any better stats wise than he was last year and this year.
Memphis-Teams use to triple team Wilt all the time, he still got it done.
I'm pretty sure that Shaq was probably at his prime last season, whenever the injuries start bothering you that's a sign you're usually on your way down. He will probably still be the best in the league and unstoppable a few more seasons then he will start feeling the age kick in look at Ewing, Robinson, Olajuwan they all lasted about 10 years give or take a season or 2 but then they went from scoring 20 a game to struggling to score 12-14 a game. Olajuwan is out of gas he should of quit last season before he left Houstan. Ewing well same thing, he should have quit while he was still with the Knicks and David Robinson is still decent but not much better than that, he was on of the top centers in the league and now he is just a roleplayer. Shaq's got 3-4 more unstoppable seasons then he will drop off. Overall I'd say he's the 3rd or 4th best center ever behind Wilt Chamberline, Bill Russell, and possibly Karrem Abdul-Jabbar. That is if he can continue to produce. Chris.
lol no no no Shaq will never be a 37 year old, beat down center who refuses to retire for some dumb reason remember Kareem? he was 42 and still an all-star, Shaq will be just like him, that is if he still plays at that age, which I doubt.. he'll prolly retire in about 4 or 5 years
I dunno if this has already been pointed out (I just read the article and a couple posts and scrolled down...lol). But:
ilovecoins...
<< <i>did shaq win a title without kobe yes or no? >>
Why don't you read the article, he said that Shaq could take the GRIZZIES to the championship. That I agree with. I mean c'mon, read the article before you post!!!
<< <i>Shaq's in his prime now. Most big centers are only good for around 12 years. I don't see Shaq being the best ever. He is the best playing in the league right now, I don't see him getting any better stats wise than he was last year and this year.
Memphis-Teams use to triple team Wilt all the time, he still got it done. >>
True but I was not compairing Shaq with Wilt. Both were and are great centers, to say that Shaq is the greatest is yet to be seen! Even though its a team sport can anyone tell me who else has 3 consec. rings? and is still active? Define what makes someone the greatest in their sport! HMMMMMM makes ya think, huh!
Hate to tell ya but Shaq is no Kareem. Shaq will be outta the game by 34, if he's smart. Show me some of Shaqs' feats and Avgs., I want to see the Wilt/Shaq comparison.
God i hate these post all anyone talks about is how kobe is better then... or shaq is better then.. and jordan and so on. WHO CARES there in the nba they are of a very few. If you are in the NBa you are the best in the world. Yes Kobes great do i as a fan like him Hell No. But i dont like shaq or jordan eather. You know why because of this Crap. in two years you will be adding mr L.James to this convo.
<< <i>Shaq's in his prime now. Most big centers are only good for around 12 years. I don't see Shaq being the best ever. He is the best playing in the league right now, I don't see him getting any better stats wise than he was last year and this year.
Memphis-Teams use to triple team Wilt all the time, he still got it done. >>
True but I was not compairing Shaq with Wilt. Both were and are great centers, to say that Shaq is the greatest is yet to be seen! Even though its a team sport can anyone tell me who else has 3 consec. rings? and is still active? Define what makes someone the greatest in their sport! HMMMMMM makes ya think, huh! >>
Gee Shawn what part dont you understand? To say that someone is the greatest you are right you must compare stats, what you are saying is that Russell is the greatest center because he has the most rings? If you read the post I said that is yet to be seen, and how many of the players you mention are still active? The define what makes someone the greatest in their soprt was not directed at you but to clarify this post so it doesnt get into one of those posts that people argue that dead players are better than active players. HMMMMMmakes ya think, huh. is a comment made to try to open the eyes of people that Shaq could possilbly be one of if not the best center in the game. Maybe not now but when your perception of great kicks in! I wonder what it would have been like if Shaq had been playing in the days of Russell? yeah your right Shaq couldnt hold a candle to any of the people you mention. Yeah right!
Mike I will not get into a arguement so this is my last post in this thread.
Comments
<< <i>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A34774-2002Jun11.html
eat this auto.. >>
Actually, you just proved my point. I've always said "Shaq is the man in LA" in which these die-hard Kobe fans disagree. Apparently, you haven't been paying much attention. That's what all the debate has been about. They always giving Kobe the credit for everything, yet Shaq doing majority of the work.
Personal Collection
bye bye kobe haters
<< <i>no this is for a post from a week ago.. in which you were talking about Shaq being nothing but a big man who uses his size to score.. this has nothing to do with Kobe.. Shaq already is the best center of all-time, yet a lot of ppl disagree.. be he has already proven everything and more than any other center.. >>
Ohh... when we were comparing Shaq to Jordan? That article said Shaq could be the best CENTER in NBa history, not best player in NBA history.
O'Neal decided yesterday that there is only one thing lacking in Bryant's game. "I think sometimes he needs more room to operate," the big man said.
ARGUE WITH SHAQS STATEMENTS NOW AUTO AND AI3
SINCE YOU HAVE SO MUCH RESPECT FOR SHAQ!! RESPECT HIS OPINION KIDS.
<< <i>did shaq win a title without kobe yes or no?
bye bye kobe haters >>
He could now. With Orlando, he and Penny were bumping heads to who would be the star and fighting over the ball. Now tell me this, if Shaq was in Charlotte with Baron Davis, do you still think Lakers would win a Championship? I would bet my entire collection that 2 things would happen. Lakers wouldn't get past Sacramento and Charlotte would win the Championship. As long as you have a good shooting guard and Shaq, that = championship. Look how much fight the Kings put up with a good PF and a good shooting guard (the rest of the team was cold as ice).
<< <i>O'Neal had this to say about Bryant: "He's the best player in this league. The scary thing about that is he doesn't think he is and he wants to get better, and he will get better."
O'Neal decided yesterday that there is only one thing lacking in Bryant's game. "I think sometimes he needs more room to operate," the big man said.
ARGUE WITH SHAQS STATEMENTS NOW AUTO AND AI3
SINCE YOU HAVE SO MUCH RESPECT FOR SHAQ!! RESPECT HIS OPINION KIDS. >>
Respect his "opinion"? I respect facts, not "opinions".
Ilove-"did shaq win a title without kobe yes or no?"
Did Kobe win a title without shaq? Put shaq on ANY team with a quality SG(Guys like Tmac, Bonzi, VC, or AI) and you have got yourself a Championship team. For a championship team, you need a quality big man downlow and somebody who can throw it up beyond the arch or drive in the lane and put it away.
I think you could put Shaq on a even with lousy guards and he would pull down a couple of rings. All they would have to do is dish it into him, because he has no competition. The majority of centers today are weak. Bring back Jabaar, Chamberlain, Russel, Ewing, and Olajuwan in thier primes, now that would be some competition.
Olajuwan already showed Shaq the way in the 1995 NBA Finals. The "Dream" sweeped Shaq and the Magic 4-0. The "Dream" in his prime embarassed Shaq. Shaq was young though. It would be interesting to see today's Shaq play against him or any of the past great centers in their prime.
Regardless. Kobe is nothing without Shaq. Kobe is smart. He won't leave Shaq. He will leave Shaq when Shaq retires, then we will really see how good Kobe is.
Kobe hasn't proved anything. He is walking in Shaq's footsteps, or even better he is riding Shaq's coat tails like the rest of the Lakers team.
sweeped = swept grr typos....
<< <i>Olajuwan already showed Shaq the way in the 1995 NBA Finals. The "Dream" sweeped Shaq and the Magic 4-0. The "Dream" in his prime embarassed Shaq. Shaq was young though. It would be interesting to see today's Shaq play against him or any of the past great centers in their prime.
Regardless. Kobe is nothing without Shaq. Kobe is smart. He won't leave Shaq. He will leave Shaq when Shaq retires, then we will really see how good Kobe is.
Kobe hasn't proved anything. He is walking in Shaq's footsteps, or even better he is riding Shaq's coat tails like the rest of the Lakers team. >>
"The Dream" had range outside the point. Had a nice 20 ft. turnaround jumper.
Personal Collection
and the argument that center's aren't supposed to shoot FT's is just lame to me.. that would be the same as if you'd say that they shouldn't be able to pass, or that a guard shouldn't be able to post up
Personal Collection
<< <i>jep.. the dream was great, I loved to watch him play.. and indeed.. Shaq was young, and we can only imagine what it would be if the great centers of all time like Mikan, Wilt, Russell, Kareem, David Robinson, Olajuwon, and some others play against each other.. yet that will never happen.. every single one of them had their weaknesses, Wilt couldn't pass, couldn't shoot FT's AT ALL, Kareem wasn't the imosing giant a dominant center normally is, Russell couldn't score, and so on.. so taking notice of the fact that Shaq's FT's have gone up to about 65%, he now really is the best center of all time to me, and a lot of others too >>
Kareem?? What's? Look at how many points he have. That skyhook was rarely blocked if ever.
If you put that 320lb frame on Olajuwan I think you would see a much better center then Shaq is. Granted Shaq doesn't need an outside shot nor does he need the graceful footwork Olajuwan had. Shaq's game is inside. If there was anyone in the NBA who could stop his inside game then he'd have to devolope a more polished game like Olajuwan had. Until that day comes Shaq will always dominate the NBA. There's no stopping him no matter what team he goes to next or what players the Lakers bring in or trade out.
Nuff said...
Put today's Shaq on any team with a decent scorer and they win a championship. Kobe helps but he's not the one making the difference.
Shaq owns the opposition. He's unstoppable. His 3rd NBA title and third NBA Finals MVP speak more then words.
Didn't Bryon Scott say Shaq could win a title with the Grizzlies??
2 Finals rings
100 points in one game against the Knicks March 2, 1962
7 NBA scoring titles
11 NBA rebounding titles
4 NBA MVP
A 55 rebound game in 1960
50.4 PPG in 1961-1962 season
27.2 RPG in 1960-1961 season
Career Avgs.:
PPG-30.1
RPG-22.9
FG%-54%
FT%-51%
Those are some stats to chew on dead man. Show me how Shaq's better. Wilt had better compeitition back then as well.
If Shaq takes 30 shots a game like Iverson does, he will score 38 points per game EASILY, as he has lead the league in points per 48 minutes for the past 6 or 7 seasons. + Shaq GETS HIS TEAMMATES INVOLVED. That's a fact Wilt never heard of, so yeah.. he still is the best ever to me, and in 4 or 5 years, you'll agree
Personal Collection
Memphis-Teams use to triple team Wilt all the time, he still got it done.
Shaq will never be a 37 year old, beat down center who refuses to retire for some dumb reason
remember Kareem? he was 42 and still an all-star, Shaq will be just like him, that is if he still plays at that age, which I doubt.. he'll prolly retire in about 4 or 5 years
Personal Collection
ilovecoins...
<< <i>did shaq win a title without kobe yes or no? >>
Why don't you read the article, he said that Shaq could take the GRIZZIES to the championship. That I agree with. I mean c'mon, read the article before you post!!!
I'm back - you better believe it
<< <i>Shaq's in his prime now. Most big centers are only good for around 12 years. I don't see Shaq being the best ever. He is the best playing in the league right now, I don't see him getting any better stats wise than he was last year and this year.
Memphis-Teams use to triple team Wilt all the time, he still got it done. >>
True but I was not compairing Shaq with Wilt. Both were and are great centers, to say that Shaq is the greatest is yet to be seen! Even though its a team sport can anyone tell me who else has 3 consec. rings? and is still active? Define what makes someone the greatest in their sport! HMMMMMM makes ya think, huh!
I do know of another very popular team who's ring streak ended last season, and will start again this season. I'm a very big fan of that team(YANKEES)
I believe Russell's Celt's had 11 rings in 13 seasons. Thats a lil' better than 3 in a row.
Ill leave with this
Glenn Robinson is better then all thoses fools
Glenn Robinson Auto Collection 7/21
<< <i>
<< <i>Shaq's in his prime now. Most big centers are only good for around 12 years. I don't see Shaq being the best ever. He is the best playing in the league right now, I don't see him getting any better stats wise than he was last year and this year.
Memphis-Teams use to triple team Wilt all the time, he still got it done. >>
True but I was not compairing Shaq with Wilt. Both were and are great centers, to say that Shaq is the greatest is yet to be seen! Even though its a team sport can anyone tell me who else has 3 consec. rings? and is still active? Define what makes someone the greatest in their sport! HMMMMMM makes ya think, huh! >>
Gee Shawn what part dont you understand? To say that someone is the greatest you are right you must compare stats, what you are saying is that Russell is the greatest center because he has the most rings? If you read the post I said that is yet to be seen, and how many of the players you mention are still active? The define what makes someone the greatest in their soprt was not directed at you but to clarify this post so it doesnt get into one of those posts that people argue that dead players are better than active players. HMMMMMmakes ya think, huh. is a comment made to try to open the eyes of people that Shaq could possilbly be one of if not the best center in the game. Maybe not now but when your perception of great kicks in! I wonder what it would have been like if Shaq had been playing in the days of Russell? yeah your right Shaq couldnt hold a candle to any of the people you mention. Yeah right!
Mike
I will not get into a arguement so this is my last post in this thread.