Opinion on a return I recieved

Matt0224

I sold this '66 Philadelphia Bart Starr and just got it returned. I think the guy even got a steal for the card quality. He was upset that I described it at EX-MT what do you guys think? I just took the return as I regretted selling at the low price after I accepted the Best Offer of $14. While it very well may not be an EX-MT and I over graded I think he got a pretty great card for the price

ymarea

My opinion is that he was right to return it regardless of the price. He believed he was getting an Ex-Mt card and got something less. It's always best to describe/grade cards accurately.

secretstash

If you put this high of a resolution of picture up I would just block him and move on. The picture should be plenty to depict the condition of the card. As far as the grade, I don't think it is EX-MT, but likely EX or just under. I would recommend with lower graded cards to just let the picture speak for itself.

miwlvrn

@secretstash said:
I would recommend with lower graded cards to just let the picture speak for itself.

Great sentiment, but, doesn't always work though. I had a buyer file return request today that I accepted since there is nothing else you can do, but I disagree completely with his opinion on why he chose to do so. I put up high resolution / high quality scans of front and back. The card was a PSA-graded VG 3 card that is small in size and pre-war. Sometimes the holders PSA puts those in have the wrinkle effect within the plastic framing space around the card's area even if the card part is clear and smooth itself, meaning, the space between the outer edges of the holder and the inner frame spacers. It seems like approximately 1 in 15 or so of the pre-war small size cards in PSA holders have this look to them. Not ideal but just a trait of the holdering process sometimes, even if the card can be viewed without impairment. Well, here is the comment registered in the complaint:

**_Here's what the buyer said:

Reason

Arrived damaged

Comments

The interior of the PSA container is wrinkled and complete eye sore! No mention of this in description. Pictures show possible glare, so I would have no idea until received, as seller did not mention this major flaw! _**

Sorry, no need to mention this in the description in my opinion because the scans showed what the holder looked like. Item most certainly did not arrive damaged but I suppose he had to choose a box to check on the form even if it's false. Heck, I don't even notice this type of holder much anymore as it is so relatively common, and as long as the card views correctly I don't care very much even if it is a little disappointing to open a sub box and find they holdered your cards like this. I'm chalking it up to the buyer just not having experience with graded cards enough to know what he's talking about, but my point being, with sufficient scans, the customer is not always right. Regardless of them being wrong, you still have to suck it up and take the return graciously and just block them from future business.

Matt0224

I always upload a 600 DPI scan of both front and back. Do I miss things when i self grade of course... most of us do. In the end I am not really upset about it. Just want to make sure I am not unknowingly misleading someone. I mean the amount of cards i see of some guy holding it 3 feet away in a shadow described as "NM or better" sold you would think looking at a HQ scan you should be able to get a really good idea of quality and if your opinion differs than just move on. Why waste the time and money shipping a card half way across the country and back. Also he may not have been familiar with the Philadelphia set. Terrible cutting and it looks like they used a butter knife to cut a lot of these cards and it was printed on a "inferior" quality paper anyway. Just a tough tough set.

Matt0224

@miwlvrn said:

@secretstash said:
I would recommend with lower graded cards to just let the picture speak for itself.

Great sentiment, but, doesn't always work though. I had a buyer file return request today that I accepted since there is nothing else you can do, but I disagree completely with his opinion on why he chose to do so. I put up high resolution / high quality scans of front and back. The card was a PSA-graded VG 3 card that is small in size and pre-war. Sometimes the holders PSA puts those in have the wrinkle effect within the plastic framing space around the card's area even if the card part is clear and smooth itself, meaning, the space between the outer edges of the holder and the inner frame spacers. It seems like approximately 1 in 15 or so of the pre-war small size cards in PSA holders have this look to them. Not ideal but just a trait of the holdering process sometimes, even if the card can be viewed without impairment. Well, here is the comment registered in the complaint:

**_Here's what the buyer said:

Reason

Arrived damaged

Comments

The interior of the PSA container is wrinkled and complete eye sore! No mention of this in description. Pictures show possible glare, so I would have no idea until received, as seller did not mention this major flaw! _**

Sorry, no need to mention this in the description in my opinion because the scans showed what the holder looked like. Item most certainly did not arrive damaged but I suppose he had to choose a box to check on the form even if it's false. Heck, I don't even notice this type of holder much anymore as it is so relatively common, and as long as the card views correctly I don't care very much even if it is a little disappointing to open a sub box and find they holdered your cards like this. I'm chalking it up to the buyer just not having experience with graded cards enough to know what he's talking about, but my point being, with sufficient scans, the customer is not always right. Regardless of them being wrong, you still have to suck it up and take the return graciously and just block them from future business.

Yeah I have the same exact problems with some of the 1968 topps game set. Looked even worse in a BVG holder

Tabe

@Matt0224 said:
I sold this '66 Philadelphia Bart Starr and just got it returned. I think the guy even got a steal for the card quality. He was upset that I described it at EX-MT what do you guys think? I just took the return as I regretted selling at the low price after I accepted the Best Offer of $14. While it very well may not be an EX-MT and I over graded I think he got a pretty great card for the price

I would say you overgraded it. It's got a tilt, multiple touched corners, and what looks like a crease on one back corner.

I can't speak on whether he got a good deal or not - I know diddly-poo about vintage football pricing.

SmithAuctionCo

Unfortunately, no matter what you say or picture on eBay, the buyer can try to return an item for any reason.

The Bart Starr does look to grade EX or lower, but if the scans posted here were used, then the buyer knew exactly what condition the card was in before bidding. It wasn't going to magically look better when it arrived.

There is no shortage of "bad" buyers on eBay - you just have to learn to deal with them and move past them as quickly as possible. Not worth going back and forth over $14.

And wow about the buyer returning the graded card because of the inner sleeve being wrinkled. Sounds like that buyer is a couple cards short of a full deck.

miwlvrn

@SmithAuctionCo said:

And wow about the buyer returning the graded card because of the inner sleeve being wrinkled. Sounds like that buyer is a couple cards short of a full deck.

Yup, agreed. I don't mind conceding that it isn't the best looking way that PSA holders cards, but I was peeved by the accusation that I failed (or intentionally omitted) to disclose some sort of flaw in the description. But, I'm again pretty sure that it was just that the buyer is clueless rather than malicious. Will be happy to pass along the user ID to add to your block list if anyone wants to PM.

dontippet

@miwlvrn said:

@SmithAuctionCo said:

And wow about the buyer returning the graded card because of the inner sleeve being wrinkled. Sounds like that buyer is a couple cards short of a full deck.

Yup, agreed. I don't mind conceding that it isn't the best looking way that PSA holders cards, but I was peeved by the accusation that I failed (or intentionally omitted) to disclose some sort of flaw in the description. But, I'm again pretty sure that it was just that the buyer is clueless rather than malicious. Will be happy to pass along the user ID to add to your block list if anyone wants to PM.

Very interesting. As I was reading your original description, I wasn't exactly sure what you were talking about. As I scrolled down to the see the card, I saw the "wrinkling", but didn't realize that common issue was what he was talking about.

handyman

"

Nice centering does not negate the bent / creased corner. VG-EX, in my opinion.
"

This

demondeacs

If no indents or wrinkles are hidden it's a 5. Bent corners have never been treated as creases. There are 5's like this all over ebay.

mtcards

The guy who returned the card because he didnt like the wrinkles on the PSA card is an idiot.

tbonewilly

@mtcards said:
The guy who returned the card because he didnt like the wrinkles on the PSA card is an idiot.

Matt0224

I just gave him the refund definitley not worth stressing about. Card came back in same condition so no real problems. I just hope he doesn't leave a neg review. Yeah i definitley always post 600 dpi scans on vintage new cards i sell that are pack fresh I might just snap a front back photo because its pack fresh and if there are any dings I usually won't bother selling it.