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1922 weak D
BIGDAVE
Posts: 1,764 ✭✭✭
ok first Howdy it has been a long time .
ok Help the first picture is a 1922 weak D ngc holder CAC verified .
This is mine in a pcgs holder ms63 bn
I have less of a D so is NGC and CAC wrong ??????
or did I score ????
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Both coins are weak "D's" one is weaker.
Yup! Both are weak D's.
Agreed they are weak D's
Coins for sale at link below
https://photos.app.goo.gl/TyJbuBJf37WZ2KT19
CAC doesn't verify varieties I was told. That NGC weak D would never be called a weak D at PCGS!! Check out Heritage archives for PCGS Weak D's. The D's often are not even evident.
PCGS can do whatever they wish. Compared to a normal 22-D 1c, the NGC coin is weak although (as you indicate) stronger than most. Some folks even divide these coins into "weak" and "very weak."
This is From Heritage archives
Looks like more of a D than Mine
Are you saying yours (the 2nd one) is graded as a 1922-D and not a weak D? If so, then I think you might have scored. But you will have to convince PCGS.
Or are you asking if your 22 weak D is somehow more valuable because it is even weaker than the first example?
A better lit photo of the date would help us.
Lance.
Mine is Graded 1922-d ms63Bn
here is another pcgs weak D
As long as the "Weak D" comes from the documented dies that produced the No D Cents, they are all good. On the 3 dies with weak reverses, the mintmark faded in and out, resulting in various stages of weakness,
Here are all 4 obverse dies for comparison:
The above images were found online.
Pete
Before I had it reholdered. PCGS MS63 'weak D'
Those are surprising PCGS attributions. I once had 1922 weak D grade set from AG - MS 63 R&B. Generally speaking - If you can see a D, its not a weak D. It was always on a tilt you could see a remnant D. PCGS consistently graded Weak D's that way and I say that after trying to have many graded. Granted, early die states Vs Later Die states were part of this determination and they are what adds to the complexity of the determination. But in my humble opinion, those 2 Heritage coins would not grade as weak D's if resubmitted. Unless of course, PCGS has relaxed the standards on these like they have on grading in general.
drwstr123 helped me a lot in building the set, so he knows what I am talking about.
WS
I was surprised to see the designation of those coins.
Here's one prior to slabbing, PCGS AU 55...
Nice !!!
IMO, this thread is going into the weeds by trying to make something very easy into something difficult. This is some history for anyone not around in the 1960's and 1970's. I was there.
At one time, virtually every 1922 dated cent that had to be tipped just right in the light to make out a raised "shadow D" was bought and sold by EVERYONE as a 1922 Plain cent. So there were 1922 strong "D's" and 1922 "D's" like the NGC coin above with less than strong "D's." This group made up the 1922-D cents. All the others brought a premium as 1922 Plain coins. The 1922 Plain Die 2 was unknown and was lumped in the group where you had to hunt for the "D." I learned that the early authenticators in DC began to see a difference in the 1922 Plain cents that were sent for authentication. Eventually, they felt like they were playing "God" sometimes because on some coins bought/sold/and authenticated there was no trace of a "D" and there was a progression as the "D" could be found to get stronger and stronger in this "NO D" group until a mound under the date was easily seen with the naked eye and the coin went into the 1922-D group.
I credit the ANA authenticators in CO during the late 70's or early 80's with publishing a detailed study of these coins and then an update. Then as now, only Die pair 2 is considered to be the "real" Plain variety. In one way that is a shame as the other die pairs can be found on occasion with no trace of a "D." Lot's of folks were left holding coins bought as 22 Plain that became virtually worthless in a very short period after ANACS and INSAB (the two major authentication services) stopped authenticating them as the plain variety.
Very nice you have a winner...
Hoard the keys.
Good stuff, Insider. Today those "real plain varieties" are divided into 1922 no D "strong" and "weak" reverses, simplifying things.
Here are a couple of "strong reverses". (Weak reverses suffer financially and I never sought one.) And finally, a '22 strong D simply called 1922-D
Lance.
That's quite a collection. Both the 22 Plain coins look to be VF's. what are they graded?
Right you are.
30 and 20. I like the 20 better.
Lance.
Thanks, a lucky guess. I grade these by the reverse.
I neglected to say this was purchased in a PCGS OGH as a 1922 D MS63 cent and submitted asking for 'weak D' designation.
Is this correct information on No D and Weak D
If so mine is a weak D
Die Pair #2:
Second 2 in date is sharper than the first 2.
All letters in TRUST are sharp.
WE is only slightly mushy.
L in LIBERTY butts up against the rim.
Reverse is sharp.
I thought only the "TR" of trust is sharp?
Here is mine 1922 No-D Strong Reverse
