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PCGS SAMPLES - - GENERATIONS 4-5 (Updated 8-31-23)

LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,335 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited August 31, 2023 3:08PM in U.S. Coin Forum

The Samples Generation 1-5 thread got too big so today, 9-18-17, Generations 4-5 were split off.

SAMPLES SAMPLES SAMPLES

So, if you buy into the PCGS generations I proposed in another thread PCGS Generations - an attempted update, it makes organizing PCGS samples easier. The scheme presented here is based on the PCGS generation labels as a foundation initially proposed by Conder101. After all, it only makes sense that samples were distributed at the same time as the generations listed above to promote them (well, there are some exceptions, but they will be noted in each section). It's real strength is in being able to find a sample quickly and efficiently and knowing whether you already have it or need it.

Cameron Kiefer (CK) was the pioneer who started organizing samples from many TPG's and it's a great asset that can still be found at Sampleslabs.com (referred to as SS from here on out). The weakness is that his generations relate more to when the sample was discovered by him rather than how they relate to each other by generations. Since it hasn't been updated for several years, it makes organizing more recent samples difficult. Other schemes involve the generation of the plastic holder (PCGS Museum of Holders) or organizing first by denomination (David Schwager).

Rarity This is somewhat subjective and is based on what I and a few friends have seen. Also, if not on SS (up until it was no longer updated), it's probably at least scarce!

There are special issues that defy simple classification by generation. The more recent European and Asian issues for example will be organized by their date of issue rather than by generation.



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In the Generations threads, the 4.0 Generation is the Regency holder. In this samples thread, it is the 3.5 label style now with the 1 piece holder, the PCGS logo on the plastic no longer on the outer ring. I guess it could be called 4.5 but that might be even more confusing!






Sample 4.1 I'm listing this as the first of the Sample 4.0 generation since it follows the same nonsense numbers for the coin number and serial number as the preceding generation. Just like the other OGH label, the color isn't stable so they can be found with yellow, green or blue labels like this one. Other than the change to a 2 piece holder with PCGS now in the lower right "field" of the holder rather than the rim, it's the same layout as the Sample 3.5 This has to be by far the most common sample slab seen offered - dates range from 1955 to 1964. I've only seen two coins in the holder not match the label in this generation, a 1964-D with a 1964 label and a 1962-D in a 1962-P holder (above). In the 1960's, the 1963-P is the key for a date run.
MS64 - 55-D, 56-D, 59, 59-D, 60, 60-D, 61, 61(64-D), 62(62-D), 62-D, 63, 63-D, 64, 64-D.




Sample 4.1b This is probably a transitional sample as the MS65 grade/label is common in the 3.5 samples but rare in the generation 4 samples. Not sure why but the MS64 grade was favored in the Sam. 4 generation.
MS65 - 61-D, 62, 62-D, 64-D.




Sample 4.1c Interesting twist in this generation, a small "c" after the denomination. Discovered by "Echoes" on the PCGS forum. It took some time to find another, this one purchased Dec. 2020. Every one that I've seen has been a 1962.






Sample 4.2 Now this is a cool Sample! I think it fits best here as it's very similar to the preceding Sample (coin number and serial number). I'll let CK speak for this one, copied from SS. As of May, 2004 this is the highest price sample ever sold - a record holder! It sold for $265 at the end of April, 2004 on eBay and beat the HALLMARK price of $250 set just a few weeks before that on eBay. It is the only known sample right now with a Franklin half and suprised all collectors when it came up for sale. The coin is a nice Mint State piece despite the "Circulated" label. This is a type to look out for at shows or in dealers cases. As of July 2017, there are only 3 Franklin half samples known!




Sample 4.2 This Morgan is very different than the more common Morgan samples in having the nonsense coin number similar to the Franklin 50c above. Not sure how rare these are or if they have simply been overlooked. I think both this and the preceding Franky are Sample 4.2's, just different denominations. LMK if you think it deserves a number of it's own.




Sample 4.2 Another rare example of the 4.2 style with a 23-S Peace dollar. In June 2018 muddonk, a well known sample collector, started selling some very rare samples. Initial BIN was $1644.76. Several of us made offers and muddonk sent counter offers. I was busy at work so before I could check email and respond, someone accepted the $1400 counteroffer. Not sure if it's one of a kind but it's the first I've ever seen offered. Pictures updated as I bought it from the Ebay buyer 7/20.




Sample 4.3 This is an unusual sample and best fits here because of the coin/serial number. Not sure why the non-sense coin number and grade are reproduced above the serial number? See the sample that follows as well. One sold for $190 in Nov. 2019 - seems a very reasonable price considering the rarity. Another selling on Ebay 11-1-20 was a bargain at $77!




Sample 4.4 Now this is a rare one for 2 reasons! First, odd that the nonsense coin number and grade are duplicated above the serial number and the truly nonsensical coin number (6564321), no . or / before the typical (for generation) serial number. Second, the only Mercury dime seen so far in a PCGS sample slab! If we follow the EAC guidelines, this one might be NC (considered non-collectible and not needed for a complete set).





Sample 4.5 Sample has been moved to the middle and "War Nickel" added. The coin number has been added and so far as I've seen, the coin number is correct for the coin in the holder. These are fairly scarce and a complete date run would be a nice accomplishment. A seldom seen 1942-P was offered with a 45-S on ebay 3/9/21 and went for $330. This from SS: "Some of these samples still have the paperwork accompanying them from Tangible A$$ets Gallery who gave them out to clients to acquaint them with a “Sample PCGS Certified Coin.” The nickel I have is really beat up and I think they could have used a better example. More people would have saved them had this been the case."
42-P, 43, 43-S, 44-P, 44-D, 45-PDS.




Sample 4.6 The Liberty nickel found in this generation is pretty well worn. Not sure why this coin was chosen?? The coin number matches the coin in the holder but just like the war nickel, it's ungraded. Not sure what the date range is on this one - dates I've seen include 1902, 03, 10 and 11 - if you have other dates, let me know. A 1911 sold for $213.50 May 2015.
1902, 03, 10.




Sample 4.7 A 1964 Kennedy is found in this generation, the label the same whether it's a P or D product. This is a common sample slab that can be found almost every day on ebay. This from SS - "This sample was a dealer only sample to show them the new label. They were given to PCGS dealers and not the general public. It contains a 90% silver half dollar and I think they did this so the slab had a better chance of staying intact or not being thrown away by the dealers."





The 1963 Franklin fits in this section nicely - sold at auction for $1009 on ebay 3/22/18. The next day the seller listed another for a BIN of $1250 and it sold a day or 2 later for that number!




Sample 4.7.1 This type with the MS shifted just to the left of sample is somewhat less common. Actually, MS has remained centered and everything below it has shifted one way or the other, the coin/serial number now better centered on the barcode. In addition, the coin number is for a 1963 Proof Franklin! The label is the same whether the coin is a P or D.




Sample 4.8 This generation features a 1921 Morgan dollar. The quality of the $1 is so-so, many appearing cleaned and polished, hence the word "Circulated". The label is the same with the coin number for a 1921-P Morgan but these labels are seen with all 3 mint marks, P, D and S. A set of all 3 MM's in this holder is needed for the most avid sample collector. image These come in green and blue labels - haven't seen a yellow one yet, personally. Many come with the inner holder yellowed. According to SS, these were dealer only slabs. In August 2014 20 were offered as one lot on ebay - all 1921 on the label with a variety of label colors, mostly a variety of green, 1 blue - pictures were such it was hard to make out the MM's. Several were more worn than typically seen.

Sample 4.8.1 A small minority of the coins in this generation have the D MM on the label. Note the slight shift of the coin/serial number, now centered on the bar code, same alignment as the 21-S below.



Sample 4.9 These are 2 of the tougher samples to find. The coin number matches the coin. The grade is center and SAMPLE has been shifted to the left. Alignment of coin/serial number similar to Gen. 3.5 but in a later Gen. 4.0 holder. An example of the 25c sample sold for $237 on eBay June 2015, the dime for $29 July 2016 (a nice cherry pick!).

Sample 4.10 This is a variation of the preceding sample with the coin and serial number shifted to the right. Another scarce to rare sample. This from CK:This type was not known until November of 2003, when a small hoard came on the market from a private collector. It is unknown how many were made. Instead of a Roosevelt dime, this sample type has a Washinton quarter inside. The label is a yellow tint, although a few of the pieces I have seen have faded to a light yellow color. Every sample is graded MS-64. One of these sold for $223 on ebay June 2015, $252 in March 2021.

Sample 4.11 This is similar to the layout of Sample 4.5 but Sample now shifted to the right. This is a scarce to rare sample as I finally acquired the 1960-D on 6-6-16! The 1963 was added 3-10-21, replacing a pic borrowed from SS. eBay price 6/16 for the 1960-D was $154. A 3rd example sold on Ebay on 11-1-20, a 1961-D dime for $128.50. The 1963 was acquired in a lot of 3 coins, 2 common, for $170. Still a very hard sample to acquire.

Sample 4.12 I struggled with how to number this one and it seems to fit here best. Sample to the left, MS centered. The coin grade "00" after the coin number is the only difference from 4.9 above.

Sample 4.13 This sample was offered to me in April 2017 and fits best here, similar to 4.12 but with MS64 in the center, grade "00" after the coin number. Gasket cut and slightly warped.
image

Sample 4.14 Unusual sample that appeared Sept. 2016. Coin number 5128, grade "00", SAMPLE centered. I assume the sample was given out at a show in 1993 based on the sticker but haven't been able to figure out which one. Interesting reverse sticker noting date of storage. image




Sample 4.15 This is also one of the more uncommon samples featuring a Swiss coin. IIRC, these all have the same date. Cameron notes this is the first time a world coin appeared in a sample slab and may have been a promotion in the early 1990's to promote PCGS's foray into certifying world coins. Sometimes these sell for a reasonable price, but one sold for $167.50 August 2015 on ebay!




Sample 4.16 Another rare one as noted by CK. I had to borrow a picture until June 2018 when ebay seller muddonk started selling some rare samples, this one bringing just under $200. This description is borrowed from SS: "Another world coin in a PCGS sample slab! This sample has the green colored label compared to the yellow label of PCGS 9. It was made around the same time period and this is the one and only one I have ever seen. The coin is in Mint State condition, and the slab has the standard "12345678" for the serial number like the other more common dime samples. This is definately one you want to look for!"



Sample 4.17 This is a legendary sample owned by Oreville. I had a chance to see and photograph it at the 2016 FUN show sample display. Here is the story behind the sample as posted by him 2-21-16.



"I received this pm from Exojunkie about a month ago:

Hi. I've been enjoying the thread started by Lakesammman about the FUN sample slab display and wanted to send you a note regarding your "unique" Morgan dollar with the pre-/post-OGH characteristics. I'm 99% sure I used to own it and I thought you might want to know its origins. I also noticed the unique Franklin half sample, which I also used to own and was the original eBay buyer back in 2004 or so, paying a then record price when it appeared. I had a collection of 200+ samples as I recall, including these two PCGS samples, and sold the collection intact in late 2004-early 2005 to a guy (can't remember his last name), who is "gus6390" on eBay (you aren't him by chance are you???).

Anyway, assuming the Morgan sample is the same one, without keeping you in suspense any more I can tell you it is definitely unique as I "made" it at PCGS. The story (as best I remember it 10+ years later) is that I bought an OGH Morgan dollar sample on eBay. It arrived damaged/cracked by USPS. I sent it to PCGS for reholdering and asked them if they could duplicate the holder -- essentially, if they could restore it to its original type/condition. As I recall, they said they didn't make that type of holder anymore, but they would reuse as much of the label as they could. To make a long story short, it came back as you have it now -- a hybrid of two different types. So ... you will never find another one, as it was a one-time deal between me and PCGS. I'm glad both it and the Franklin half found their way into a top-tier collection, although more than once I wish I still owned them........ "



4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5-4.5



image



This is a fascinating slab offered by Mike Kittle on eBay ending 9-18-16. It is the only known Regency slab with "Sample" on the label. According to Mike, it was made by PCGS for someone wanting to show the consignors of the Byron Reed collection how special the coins could look in a PCGS slab, specifically a Regency slab. It saw spirited bidding and finally hammered on eBay for minimally under $3500!



55555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555





Sample 5.1 These follow the Generation 5 style. They tend to be harder to find than other generations. I have no clue in what order they were issued so will begin with a Buffalo nickel for the fun of it. As noted by Cameron, these first appeared in 2004 and are hard to find. Virtually all are dateless, the only one known with date a 1928-S shown above. The coin number 3914 corresponds with nothing! The Buff 5c series begins with 3915 so it might be a "Type coin" number reserved by PCGS. Interesting label orientation, "PCGS SAMPLE COIN" with a space between 3914 and .00 "grade". New reverse label with "PCGS Copying Prohibited" added, seen on all Sample 5.0 slabs. One of these sold on eBay March 2014 for $507.99 with a warped or melted insert. It may have been a 1913 type 1 coin that I overlooked at the time??









Sample 5.2 This style has the Grade centered between PCGS and the coin/serial number with SAMPLE shifted to the left. The coin numbers are correct for the coin in the holder. The nonsense serial number 1-8 as on earlier issues, no / through the 0 of 10C. These are at least scarce and the 5c/25c pieces are rare. All dimes seen before 9/17 were 1956-D, the 1961 appearing on eBay 9-16-17. The 1946 dime picture was sent to me by a fellow collector 9-4-18 and I was able to acquire one in Dec. 2020 along with the 1955-D. Added the 1968-D 5c 10-26-20, appeared in a lot of 5 coins on Ebay, "sample" not mentioned in the title - was happy to hit the BIN!
5c - 68-D: 10c - 46, 55-D, 56-D, 59-D, 61: 25c - 64 P65





Sample 5.3 Very similar to the preceding but with a MS Jefferson nickel, SAMPLE in the middle with the grade following the coin number. Scarce/rare, so borrowed from SS. The 1c sold on ebay Feb. 2022 for $305.




Sample 5.4 This one has SAMPLE centered between PCGS and the code, the 10c lacking the slash through the 0 as on prior generations. The code 5121 belongs to a 1960-D Roosevelt dime! The nonsense serial number ends at 7 rather than 8 for some reason. There are very few samples with a 7 digit serial number. Obviously this slab wasn't owned by a sample collector, the hologram on the reverse abused. Very similar to Camerons' "5.4" but different in that his had the correct coin number for a 1961-D dime and graded "00" (see below). The sample shown here came from England - if only slabs could talk. image


Sample 5.5 Similar to prior but the grade is .00. Another interesting sample with the serial number ending in 7 - tough to find. One sold for $75 December 2015, another for $128 4/19 on ebay.


Sample 5.6 This has the same nonsense code as the preceding samples so it's placed here. Cameron describes it best, so I'm just going to paste his comments here. "Now this is a neat slab! I am calling this slab a sample for several reasons but PCGS doesn’t even remember making it! Instead of the word sample in the middle of the label this one has “Specimen”. The coin is a normal MS-68 silver eagle and not a special strike or proof specimen. The serial numbers have “500000.00” before “/1234567” (which is very similar to the 12345678 on the normal green label samples). Could it be the 500,000th coin graded? Maybe. Could it be a sample? Most likely." An example sold for $515 on ebay October 2015. A more recent price for a piece with yellow crud on the obverse of the coin was $395 on 9/24/19.


Sample 5.7 Style of Generation 5 with a 1921 Morgan graded MS64. Coin Number correct, grade follows the coin number, nonsense serial number 1-8. This is the only one of these I've ever seen and it's not represented at SS, far rarer than the Morgans in the Sam. 4 generation. If you have one of these let me know. This sold for $182.50 March 2015.


Sample 5.8 Unlike the previous coin, this is unlikely to be a sample but since it doesn't fit in anywhere else and it's such a cool holder/label that I've decided to put it here anyway. image

Coin number is correct, grade .00 is very rare for anything other than a sample. "CIRC" rather than "CIRCULATED" is rare. Cert verification at PCGS notes the correct coin number and year with a grade of VF30. If you have any info about this style, I would appreciate a PM.



This one is very similar but with "Circulated" spelled out. It appeared on eBay 9/17 and was advertised as a sample bringing $445! It also grades VF30 when checking the cert verification.





Sample 5.9 Now this one is really cool! It appeared on ebay Nov. 2015 as a BIN for $49.95 and was quickly snapped up, just beating another forum member who let me know of it's existence. The coin number is correct for a 1933 $20! Don't know how many of these there are (3 known so far as of 7/17) but it could become the holy grail of PCGS samples!




Sample 5.10 Interesting sample that appeared on eBay 6/16, similar to sample 5.5 above but with the 8 digit serial number. Different from 5.4 with the ".00" grade. I thought a $200 bid would be plenty but was wrong, this selling for $202. Another appeared 7/16 and sold for $75.

Style of Sample 5 but not a PCGS Sample


This from SS: This slab was once thought to be scarce. It might still be semi scarce if no one saved them, but recently I found out from David Hall who told me “These were an item in a Random House marketed Scott Travers "Coin collecting starter kit. "I believed we did either 50,000 or 100,000 of them.” If this is the true production numbers, this is the largest number of samples made for any time from any of the services! Most samples don’t even have 1,000 made of one type.

The Back of the slab is Green and white and does not have the hologram. The dates I have seen range from 1918 through 1929 and each coin is in Fine through Extremely Fine condition. Group lots of 4-8 of these samples can easily be found. This type could still be a challenge for a “short set” of sample slabs by trying to get one of each date.


Since CK wrote about this, a small number of 1917's have shown up. Also, the date 1922 probably was not produced in the 1917-1929 date run and has not been seen to date. 1921 is rare, 1917 and 1929 scarce. It's unusual to not see these on eBay on any given day.




Keep an eye out for reverse holdered examples (above) with PCGS on the rim of the holder on the reverse side - worth a modest premium.




BStrauss3 posted this picture on 1-18-15 on the US Coin forum. Nice addition to this section.




A different friend (RP) sent a picture of the reverse 3/11/18 to be included in this thread - pretty cool!

"My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko.

Comments

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    TreashuntTreashunt Posts: 6,747 ✭✭✭✭✭

    wonderful post, and research.

    Thanks for posting

    Frank

    BHNC #203

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    dbldie55dbldie55 Posts: 7,722 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 18, 2017 9:19AM

    For the Liberty Nickel sample slabs. You list the 1911 that sold for $213.50 in May 2015.

    Another seller had multiple coins auctioned around the same time. (here is the coin date, Ebay #, seller and price realized)

    1899 ( 391165137860 ) rs10554501 US $103.50
    1901 ( 381286657697 ) rs10554501 US $102.50
    1906 ( 391165140164 ) rs10554501 US $107.50
    1907 ( 381286659939 ) rs10554501 US $113.06
    1911 ( 391165143112 ) rs10554501 US $102.50

    So, you can add 1899, 1901, 1906 and 1907 to the dates (02, 03, 10, 11) that you listed.

    Here is one of these (I saved images from all of the Ebay listings)

    Collector and Researcher of Liberty Head Nickels. ANA LM-6053
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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Great Post! :#

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    CoinCrazyPACoinCrazyPA Posts: 2,899 ✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for this very interesting post.

    Positive BST transactions: agentjim007, cohodk, CharlieC, Chrischampeon, DRG, 3 x delistamps, djdilliodon, gmherps13, jmski52, Meltdown, Mesquite, 2 x nibanny, themaster, 2 x segoja, Timbuk3, ve3rules, jom, Blackhawk, hchcoin, Relaxn, pitboss, blu62vette, Jfoot13, Jinx86, jfoot13,Ronb

    Successful Trades: Swampboy,
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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 6, 2018 6:42AM

    @Lakesammman , thanks so much for including me!
    Steve~

    Sample 4.1c (1962 Small 'c' 10c)

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,335 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Added a tough 5.2 sample today, 1968-D 5c piece. :+1:

    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko.
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    SeattleSlammerSeattleSlammer Posts: 9,964 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 26, 2020 9:23PM

    Cool stuff! Now that I’ve seen the prices realized details ... makes me want to find some sleepers out in the wild... 🤠

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    BochimanBochiman Posts: 25,330 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Man - I wish I had some of the rarer plastic...just so I could tease you with it!

    I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment

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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Lakesammman said:
    Added a tough 5.2 sample today, 1968-D 5c piece. :+1:

    Nice... :#

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
  • Options
    LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,335 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Added 3 samples this month to include the 5.1c and the 1946/1955-D 5.2. It's getting harder to find samples not already in the sample threads! :+1:

    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko.
  • Options
    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Lakesammman said:
    Added 3 samples this month to include the 5.1c and the 1946/1955-D 5.2. It's getting harder to find samples not already in the sample threads! :+1:

    One more date for the 5.2's 1959-D

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    bob48bob48 Posts: 454 ✭✭✭

    Nice update on the listing.
    I am happy to see the reverse of the Morgan dollar 4.17 (SS 8.2) slab and the story is a nice touch. As Sample slabs did not show the reverse of his listings. I do have a blue label like that one but now I know for sure it is not the 8.2 but only the 8.0 with a color changing label.
    The 4.17 is a combination of Generation 3.0 obverse and Generation 4.0 reverse label. I am thinking that the green reverse label is part of the obverse label (just folded in half) installed, as the 4.0 has a blue label. With the original insert saved and reused, all PCGS had to do was put on the new hologram strait side PNG logo label. I guess they could not find any of the old hologram with gold PCGS logo for the reverse.
    And because they used the original label, the reverse PCGS was gold and not black.

    Bob

    *
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    LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,335 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Was able to add a 1942-P War Nickel today thanks to a tip from a friend! Not often seen and, as is typical, scuzzy looking. :+1:

    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko.

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