Lacquer question for medal/token/anyone folks. Plus a couple of photos of a newp.

Stork

This is a medal I've wanted ever since the first time I saw it...probably on a decade long want list. RARELY saw in on eBay (and before I know other places to hunt) and it is always very pricey. Nowadays my budget is better, but I never found the darn thing. I've seen silver with some different words on the reverse, what appears to be a slivered bronze with this reverse, and bronze.

Finally, This one turned up in the inventory of a place I made a successful sixbid purchase, and they added this to my invoice.

I could tell by the photos the 'skin' and color were a bit different, but it's the most affordable one I've seen that wasn't totally junked out. I'm guessing a lot of the appearance is lacquer--I've done searches here and other forums but really never saw some good pictures, so I'm asking for confirmation if this is lacquer...or if not, what else.

Normally I do an acetone bath on new things but I figured I'd better hold off until I knew what was going on. Oh, and as far as I know there are no restrikes of this one and the edge markings are consistent with an original.

First photo--shot more to show the normal 'in hand' look. A bit of variability in the color. I got the lighting a bit different obverse vs. reverse, but both are reasonable approximations of it's look.

Second photo--also a 'true shot'. I changed the angle of light and you can see the 'shiny' and the color is quite different. Same lights/camera settings etc. Only changed the angle of the lights (hence the 'hot spots').

In hand it's got a slick feel too.

So, lacquer? I was planning on leaving it alone but if that's not a good idea give me your thoughts. I'd send this in to a pro to take care of if that seems like a good idea. I've got the acetone but not sure I'm willing to try my first de-lacquering (if that's what it is) on a medal like this.

TwoKopeiki

Beautiful medal. I don't know much about lacquered copper to be helpful. Is your concern that the lacquer will damage the surfaces?

Stork

Damage and appearance both. It's just odd that it looks different in different lights, and I don't know if that is part of an aging lacquer issue, assuming it's lacquer. I know people talk about its removal from old time collections...to preserve? To remove a foreign material? It was used to preserve, but it's so frowned on now I'd like to learn more.

asheland

Beautiful medal indeed!
I'm not sure what to advise, I once bought a sterling silver bowl that had been lacquered and acetone removed the lacquer.
The question is was this lacquer original to the piece? I don't do medals, so I wouldn't know.

bosox

Always tough to tell from a photo, but I think it was lacquered. I base this upon what appears to be white residue in some of the crevasses (between the horse mane and her torso, in the swirls under the horse, etc.)

As you say, lacquer was used to preserve the pieces. In today's world the TPG's will generally body bag lacquered items. Lacquer can be removed from copper and bronze through the use of acetone, but it carries some risk. Acetone usually just removes the lacquer without affecting the copper or bronze. I have seen more than one case where a bronze coin turned purple when acetone was used, probably because of some other compound present on the surface of the coin.

I am not sure of the medal's value, but my advice, unless you are going to send it to a TPG, is leave it alone. If plan to use acetone, be careful as it can be dangerous to use. Good luck whatever you decide.

PatAR

A beautiful medal! I've long been a student of French art nouveau medals. Bottee is among my favorite artists and this is easily one his best works. To the best of my knowledge you are correct that there are no restrikes of this particular medal.

As bosox said, I would caution against attempts to remove surface contaminants. Many of the medals from this period received special treatments after striking and are sensitive to cleaning/contact. You may wish to consult a specialist in medals restoration at a major show and learn more. My recommendation is to leave as is.

amwldcoin

In my experience if a coin is lacquered correctly it does a very good job of preserving copper and is very easy to remove with acetone!

neildrobertson

I agree with amwldcoin. There's no reason to be scared of lacquer in the majority of circumstances. In many cases it's beneficial. Some types of lacquer have a practical life before they start to degrade, and you would want to remove it eventually with acetone or another appropriate solvent. There are circumstances where you'd want to remove or replace the coating depending on the type of coating and the age of it.

PatAR made a good point. It is not unheard of for coins to get a coating or surface treatment at the time they were made. You might want to check on that, but I suspect the medal was made before that became a practice.

I'm sorry I can't be more specific regarding that medal. I think one of the reasons TPGs have been generally against lacquering/coating is because of how complex and detailed its proper treatment can be. It's probably analogous to cleaning. There are ways to clean (conserve) a coin that aren't harmful, but they take a blanket approach against it because it can be done incorrectly.

Stork

Between this thread and one around the corner (not across the street so to speak) if nothing else I've learned laquering is a much more complex topic than I had imagined.

At this point I'm going to leave it alone--it's been that way for a long time I suspect--and next time I get to Baltimore or somewhere similar I'll take it along to show some of the medal folks. In all likelihood it will be left alone then too.

No matter what it's a medal I've wanted for a long time and right now I'm not spending the money for the silver version