@RYK said:
Sidestepping the dispute going on in this thread, the humble ex-collector that I am. I believe that Heritage has been a force that has commoditized the coin market, whereas DWN has been a counterforce that has effectively decommoditized coins in his niche. It's a constant battle that Heritage fights with many specialists, and one worth fighting for both sides.
This is not to say that Heritage is bad (or represents a negative position), bit their position in the market is as the ultimate market maker. Collectors buy coins for their unique attributes that hopefully defy the pull of being generic or fungible. (Not sure if that gibberish made any sense
Why would an auction firm want their product commoditized? The more unique the product, the more value they can add, and the more they can charge for their services.
I do not believe that the intention of Heritage was to commoditize coins, but when you go to an auction viewing and hold four Stellas in your hand at once, that is what has been accomplished (IMO). It is an unintended consequence of their meteoric success.
I don't necessarily think the Stella issue is one with Heritage. With over 400 minted, at least the 1879 flowing hair is not a rare coin. There was recently a photo of one collection with more than four Stellas in it. If Heritage is showing that it's not rare, I think of that more as reality than commoditization. The other date/types are rare but if they many are for sale that is also saying something. Rare also does not mean unavailable given demand. For example, many rare tokens are inexpensive and available. In terms of how to handle this, my understanding is that coins can be pulled. Some options are to look at what else is being offered and pull a coin if a similar piece is being offered, or use a different venue.
You can yell at me all you want about how I’m stupid, but as my economics professor said in college, “If the theory does not work in the real world, it is not a good theory.” High buyers’ fees benefit the auction house and sometimes the consigners if they get a kickback. They make life more expensive for successful auction bidders in many cases. That has been my real world experience.
We shall agree to disagree on this point.
Auctions are designed to make people act foolishly. There's a recent report of someone bidding 50% over "market" for a B- coin and getting blown away by two even "Greater Fools".
And then, scoring a solid B coin of a much more desirable issue when overpaying less than 25%.
My advice: buy something you like at a number than makes you slightly uncomfortable. Figure it like a new car just driven out of the dealer's lot. Then enjoy . . .
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell
Why would an auction firm want their product commoditized? The more unique the product, the more value they can add, and the more they can charge for their services.
I get the sense they're trying to make it up on volume.
HA's product is, to my thinking, their service. Which includes the disposition of a multi-faceted "inventory" to a critical mass of buyers. Each quasi-differentiated "unit", of whatever rarity, like an 1880-S $1 MS67 or an XF Mountain $20 (or a Birkin Himalayan bag), is tossed to a very knowledgeable (market-adjusted) hungry pack of Internet wolves and their agents. Some read labels, some don't.
Archimedes himself re-introduced me to the term disintermediation DW saw this earlier than most. Way earlier. He's earned his marque.
Heritage did not commoditize Stellas. Increased market information brought buy-sell spreads down to where levels, except for the gorgeous, fluctuate within a tight range. I bought my first Stella for $23K in late '82 and had a tough getting $25.5K at FUN a few months later. Bad example nonetheless. Flowing Hairs have always been common.
Think about the VIX action on MS63 MCMVII $20 spreads. $350 opening or tightening would be how many standards of deviation? I've made $750 per a piece for two of them so far this year. That's a 3% brokerage (or agent's) fee. And I paid for shipping
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell
Comments
I don't necessarily think the Stella issue is one with Heritage. With over 400 minted, at least the 1879 flowing hair is not a rare coin. There was recently a photo of one collection with more than four Stellas in it. If Heritage is showing that it's not rare, I think of that more as reality than commoditization. The other date/types are rare but if they many are for sale that is also saying something. Rare also does not mean unavailable given demand. For example, many rare tokens are inexpensive and available. In terms of how to handle this, my understanding is that coins can be pulled. Some options are to look at what else is being offered and pull a coin if a similar piece is being offered, or use a different venue.
Auctions are designed to make people act foolishly. There's a recent report of someone bidding 50% over "market" for a B- coin and getting blown away by two even "Greater Fools".
And then, scoring a solid B coin of a much more desirable issue when overpaying less than 25%.
My advice: buy something you like at a number than makes you slightly uncomfortable. Figure it like a new car just driven out of the dealer's lot. Then enjoy . . .
HA's product is, to my thinking, their service. Which includes the disposition of a multi-faceted "inventory" to a critical mass of buyers. Each quasi-differentiated "unit", of whatever rarity, like an 1880-S $1 MS67 or an XF Mountain $20 (or a Birkin Himalayan bag), is tossed to a very knowledgeable (market-adjusted) hungry pack of Internet wolves and their agents. Some read labels, some don't.
Archimedes himself re-introduced me to the term disintermediation DW saw this earlier than most. Way earlier. He's earned his marque.
Heritage did not commoditize Stellas. Increased market information brought buy-sell spreads down to where levels, except for the gorgeous, fluctuate within a tight range. I bought my first Stella for $23K in late '82 and had a tough getting $25.5K at FUN a few months later. Bad example nonetheless. Flowing Hairs have always been common.
Think about the VIX action on MS63 MCMVII $20 spreads. $350 opening or tightening would be how many standards of deviation? I've made $750 per a piece for two of them so far this year. That's a 3% brokerage (or agent's) fee. And I paid for shipping