So far --- Derrick Henry vs. Ezekiel Elliot in the NFL.
keets
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When these two were in there last year at their respective schools all the talk was Henry as he won the Heisman. I didn't see it that way.
Derrick Henry seemed to benefit from having an absolutely huge offensive line and from his stats and how he was used I didn't view him as anything more than a runner, though he was pure delight in that regard. Ezekiel Elliot struck me as a much more versatile and well-rounded player. He didn't leave games when it was a clear passing down because he was more than adequate as a receiver and also blocked very well. I saw that as a bonus.
When the NFL Draft came to be Dallas grabbed Elliot in the first round, I think it was pick #6. That was a surprise to many but the real surprise to me was that he was the only RB chosen in Round 1. Derrick Henry went to Tennessee in the second round and was about the 42nd player taken and the second RB.
Dallas had a greater need at the position and Elliot has filled it nicely with a few 100+ yard games and a steadily improving performance. Henry seems stuck in a supporting role on a Team that has a solid RB, so his time has been limited. That makes a true comparison difficult but thus far Ezekiel Elliot seems like he was taken first for a good reason, by a Team that knew what it needed and he has been up to the task.
Do you think Derrick Henry will go the route of so many other Heisman Trophy winners, or do you think he'll blossom when/if he gets the chance??
Al H.
Derrick Henry seemed to benefit from having an absolutely huge offensive line and from his stats and how he was used I didn't view him as anything more than a runner, though he was pure delight in that regard. Ezekiel Elliot struck me as a much more versatile and well-rounded player. He didn't leave games when it was a clear passing down because he was more than adequate as a receiver and also blocked very well. I saw that as a bonus.
When the NFL Draft came to be Dallas grabbed Elliot in the first round, I think it was pick #6. That was a surprise to many but the real surprise to me was that he was the only RB chosen in Round 1. Derrick Henry went to Tennessee in the second round and was about the 42nd player taken and the second RB.
Dallas had a greater need at the position and Elliot has filled it nicely with a few 100+ yard games and a steadily improving performance. Henry seems stuck in a supporting role on a Team that has a solid RB, so his time has been limited. That makes a true comparison difficult but thus far Ezekiel Elliot seems like he was taken first for a good reason, by a Team that knew what it needed and he has been up to the task.
Do you think Derrick Henry will go the route of so many other Heisman Trophy winners, or do you think he'll blossom when/if he gets the chance??
Al H.
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in a nutshell, I think Zeke was a more finished player and got drafted into a system that needed him right away. both players should have long and successful careers, at least that's what I expect.
Dallas just might have the best OL in football. Actually they do have the best O line in football.
As for Henry I wouldn't have used a second round pick on him.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Blocking and receiving look solid.
The first game or two he was out running his blocks. Getting nowhere.
As Troy A. said, he now seems to be in a better rhythm with the O-line.
I saw in the 49ers game where, during a timeout, he came out on the field to encourage the defense at a critical point of the game.
Being a good teammate is one of those things that can't be measured at the combines.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
Edit: I did not follow the Heisman race and as you know, it rarely translates much to the NFL.
I'm glad the Heisman has zero to do with the NFL.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Edit: I did not follow the Heisman race and as you know, it rarely translates much to the NFL.
I'm glad the Heisman has zero to do with the NFL.
mark
Agreed. It's nice it's for the (arguably) best college player. Any given year there are players who may be more deserving and there are usually players that will be better pros. However, it's a college award for a college player. Mccafrey and Jackson in a battle this year.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
don't let the OSU hate creep in and remember that JT Barrett is a red-shirt Junior(I think) who missed almost a full season. he should be at least considered and I think his injury and battle back with time watching from the sidelines has made him a better passer. to be honest, though, I think the Heisman Trophy is sort of like a beauty contest and gets awarded to the highest profile player that typically plays on one of the top ranked Teams. it is steeped in tradition and will probably never change.
No question JT Barrett is in the conversation this year. However, at this point it would seem the other guys are a short step ahead of him in the race. However, there is a long way to go and that could easily change.
Also, I agree with your thoughts on the award in general. That's one of the reasons JT is in the race because Ohio State will likely be in the running all year.
It's like a lot of awards. The system isn't perfect. Sort of like the MVP in most sports. Is it the most valuable to a good team or most valuable to a bad team? Usually a good team.
Since the Heisman is so important, would you rather have four different Heisman winners in four years or one National Championship in four years? The Heisman is a popularity contest imo. Coach Bryant won a bunch of National Championships but never had a Heisman winner, never bothered us at all, we didn't even whine about it. I'll take championships every time and if it comes with a Heisman winner, it's just gravy.
No question 1 championship. As a UCLA fan I just want one national championship in my lifetime!
Since the Heisman is so important, would you rather have four different Heisman winners in four years or one National Championship in four years? The Heisman is a popularity contest imo. Coach Bryant won a bunch of National Championships but never had a Heisman winner, never bothered us at all, we didn't even whine about it. I'll take championships every time and if it comes with a Heisman winner, it's just gravy.
No question 1 championship. As a UCLA fan I just want one national championship in my lifetime!
I hope y'all get one Larry.....
UCLA 38
OSU 9
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Looks like people are fed up with the NFL going politically correct. NFL ratings are down this year.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
Looks like people are fed up with the NFL going politically correct. NFL ratings are down this year.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
Agreed. I can't ever remember turning on a game to watch a national anthem.
Now that Brady is back all is right in my universe
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
if you look at the three "Prime Time" games it seems clear that the NFL schedules with a tilt towards who they want to be the face of the League with little regard for a competitive game or a traditional rivalry. there are plenty of rivalries that I think fans would rather see than Pittsburgh, New England, Seattle, Green Bay or one of the other "marquee" Teams whooping somebody.
remember when the NFL told us that Dallas was America's Team??? give me Kansas City vs. Oakland again.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
if you look at the three "Prime Time" games it seems clear that the NFL schedules with a tilt towards who they want to be the face of the League with little regard for a competitive game or a traditional rivalry. there are plenty of rivalries that I think fans would rather see than Pittsburgh, New England, Seattle, Green Bay or one of the other "marquee" Teams whooping somebody.
remember when the NFL told us that Dallas was America's Team??? give me Kansas City vs. Oakland again.
You know what else they do that pisses me off? I watch the Patriots at 1 , it ends and they don't show me a 4 o clock game. They go to a press conference of Bill scowling at the podium then cut to bull riding.
Who wants to watch rodeo if there are football games being played , and whop watches a stupid after game press conference? Maybe after a playoff game but after the team gets shut out?
I wanted to see the Pats and of course I wanted to see the Dallas San Fran game....that is a big rivalry. I think it depends on the area you are in sometimes as to which games you get.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
if you look at the three "Prime Time" games it seems clear that the NFL schedules with a tilt towards who they want to be the face of the League with little regard for a competitive game or a traditional rivalry. there are plenty of rivalries that I think fans would rather see than Pittsburgh, New England, Seattle, Green Bay or one of the other "marquee" Teams whooping somebody.
remember when the NFL told us that Dallas was America's Team??? give me Kansas City vs. Oakland again.
We did get Pittsburgh vs Kansas City Sunday Night. I'm not sure if anyone told the Chiefs that. They laid down like a dog. TV's went click by the second quarter
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Looks like people are fed up with the NFL going politically correct. NFL ratings are down this year.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
Agreed. I can't ever remember turning on a game to watch a national anthem.
Now that Brady is back all is right in my universe
mark
According to a recent poll, one third of viewers are turning the channel over the anti American protests during the national anthem.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Looks like people are fed up with the NFL going politically correct. NFL ratings are down this year.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
Agreed. I can't ever remember turning on a game to watch a national anthem.
Now that Brady is back all is right in my universe
mark
According to a recent poll, one third of viewers are turning the channel over the anti American protests during the national anthem.
As they should, it's a joke that they are using the televised coverage of a game to throw their political beliefs down people's throats that litterly just want to relax and enjoy a game.
Looks like people are fed up with the NFL going politically correct. NFL ratings are down this year.
No they are fed up with bad games . Sunday, Monday, Thursday prime time games have been awful.
Agreed. I can't ever remember turning on a game to watch a national anthem.
Now that Brady is back all is right in my universe
mark
According to a recent poll, one third of viewers are turning the channel over the anti American protests during the national anthem.
As they should, it's a joke that they are using the televised coverage of a game to throw their political beliefs down people's throats that litterly just want to relax and enjoy a game.
They shouldn't even put them on camera. They shouldn't get 1 second of air time. That's what they want is attention......DON'T GIVE IT TO THEM!!!
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
I'm with you both perk dog and dime man. I can't believe goddell is putting up with that garbage. So many upset people are boycotting the NFL.
I just read an article on why viewership is down and it's not because people are boycotting the NFL because of Kapeenick or protests. Sorry it doesn't fit your narrative.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I'm with you both perk dog and dime man. I can't believe goddell is putting up with that garbage. So many upset people are boycotting the NFL.
I just read an article on why viewership is down and it's not because people are boycotting the NFL because of Kapeenick or protests. Sorry it doesn't fit your narrative.
mark
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/social_issues/are_americans_tuning_out_the_nfl_over_protests
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
I'm with you both perk dog and dime man. I can't believe goddell is putting up with that garbage. So many upset people are boycotting the NFL.
I just read an article on why viewership is down and it's not because people are boycotting the NFL because of Kapeenick or protests. Sorry it doesn't fit your narrative.
mark
http://www.rasmussenreports.co..._the_nfl_over_protests
Why TV viewership is down.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I'm with you both perk dog and dime man. I can't believe goddell is putting up with that garbage. So many upset people are boycotting the NFL.
I just read an article on why viewership is down and it's not because people are boycotting the NFL because of Kapeenick or protests. Sorry it doesn't fit your narrative.
mark
http://www.rasmussenreports.co..._the_nfl_over_protests
Why TV viewership is down.
Fewer people are watching the NFL on TV, and no one really knows why.
The NFL Players Association admits that the trend is an obvious concern. The league has kept quiet, likely fearful that talking about the situation would lend credence to the dynamic, possibly causing other fans who are still watching the games to say, “Maybe I should stop, too.”
The decline has become a mystery, for the media and surely for the NFL. The league’s failure to discipline more aggressively players who have engaged in off-field misconduct possibly has turned off some fans. A perception that the league reacts too heavy-handedly in other matters (like #DeflateGate and the Saints bounty scandal) could cause others to think the NFL hopes to steer certain teams toward success and to make it harder for others to succeed.
These two dynamics have contributed to an intense sense of disdain by plenty of fans for Commissioner Roger Goodell. It’s odd, however, to think that fans are choosing not to watch the NFL on TV because they don’t care for the man whose name appears on the football. (That said, it’s likely no accident that Goodell largely stays out of view.)
The disconnect between the images televised across the country in high definition and the things seen by the naked eye in real time by seven officials interspersed with young, strong, large, fast men in armor remains a far bigger problem than the league office ever would admit. The NFL seems to have a general reluctance to fully embrace technology in order to get the calls right. At some point, however, the league must take more seriously the impact of fan frustrations arising from the sense that what everyone else sees is missed by the small group of people whose vantage point is the most important.
The ongoing desire to expand the NFL’s reach to other countries likely alienates some fans as well, given the potential belief that the league is taking the domestic audience for granted as it tries to spread the pro football virus around the globe. The mere mention of, for example, an international franchise or a Super Bowl played beyond borders of the U.S. sparks a strong negative reaction from plenty of fans.
Meanwhile, viewing habits have changed, dramatically. The younger generation no longer congregates around a large box; they carry small ones everywhere they go, constantly staring at them like zombies peering in to a sardine can full of brains. Many members of Generation Z don’t feel compelled to take the time to witness the flow of a game, the shifts in momentum, the nuances that set the stage for game-changing moments in the fourth quarter. They just want the highlights and the stats, so that they can see how their favorite team and, perhaps more importantly, their fantasy team performed.
Speaking of fantasy football, consider the perspective of kids who were born after the rise of what once was a collateral consideration to traditional rooting interests. With the pieces of a fantasy team spread over various NFL franchises, plenty of fans may not have the same zeal about one specific team, with the us-against-the-world mindset inherent to pre-fantasy fans fully undermined by the reality that, for example, an ardent Panthers fan may have Saints quarterback Drew Brees on his fantasy team.
Some would say the election is a factor, but if anything the political consternation should be causing people to more fervently embrace their diversions. Apart from the conflicts between prime-time games and two of the presidential debates, fans should be regarding NFL games as an escape from the political nonsense.
The quality of the early-season matchups could be an issue, due in large part to a lesser number of star players on great teams. Peyton Manning has retired, Tom Brady is suspended (his team nevertheless had two of its first three games televised nationally), and some of the best quarterbacks remain largely unknown and/or unaccomplished.
The concussion crisis, and the reality that football has become the pin cushion for criticism even though plenty of sports and other activities entail a risk of head injuries, likely has caused some fans to feel guilty about watching or enjoying football. In turn, the league’s efforts to make the game safer probably has influenced others who want big hits and who don’t care about the physical consequences to lose interest.
Some are suggesting that the anthem protests are causing fans to boycott the NFL, but it’s hard to see a connection between the objections to the behavior of a small group of players and the decision of significant numbers of fans to deprive themselves of something they enjoy. The NFL has made its position on the anthem clear, and the vast majority of players continue to stand at attention.
Even with the decline, nothing brings a live audience together like the NFL (except for The Walking Dead). But it’s clear the NFL has reason to worry, and that it has work to do. A more aggressive and creating marketing push could be needed, along with a willingness to consider significant changes to the rules and the officiating procedures.
Whatever the reasons, and there surely are many, the NFL has billions of reasons to figure them out and to begin the process of addressing the problem. Publicly ignoring the issue is fine. If they’re privately paying no attention to it, the league will be in or a rude awakening when the time comes to negotiate the next set of TV deals.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Sounds about right. I'd lay more blame on fantasy football though . Eventually the way the NFL is focusing on that garbage will kill the sport.
1. I think a lot of the "growth" in the past few decades has been with women and I really don't think that as a group they are long term fans.
2. MNF was too successful and led to TNF, SNF and games in London. now things are too watered down and spread out.
3. constant "Rule" changes which make it virtually impossible in some instances to know what's going on or why something was called a penalty, incomplete pass, etc.
4. the above is one I know has affected viewers. along with "instant replay" and "challenges" I can tell you that I know people who are really turned off.
5. all the BS "showmanship" and player "celebrations" that are commonplace. as Paul Brown so clearly told his Team, "When you score a Touchdown act like you've been there before."
6. the aging fan base that is the heart and soul of the game is being replaced by a younger group which uses technology to keep up, much like what Mark's post alluded to. gone are the days when a man would spend most of Sunday afternoon and early evening watching games for the pure joy of seeing his Team and his Team's rivals play each other.
There is not proof of causality between the peaceful protests by some NFL players and the league wide ratings declines. It reminds me of all the folks in the 2012 election predicting that gasoline prices were going to soar if Obama was re-elected. In the week or two after the election there was a mild uptick in prices but in the long run prices plummeted from 2012 - 2016 (note avg price of gasoline in 2012 was $3.60 /gal, avg price of gasoline for 2016 is $2.08 /gal). People find the relationships they want that bolster their argument even if there is no actual proof said relationship exists. Let's see how the ratings play out for the whole season and beyond before jumping to conclusions.
Robb
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I would always root for my team and not fantasy players if they are playing my team.
Rule changes....ARGH!!!!.....first they move the extra point way back.....now they bring a TB out to the 25 instead of the 20. LEAVE THE RULES ALONE!!! Heck why not just move the bases in Baseball to 80 feet instead of 90. Nobody would be caught stealing. It would be like Little League....if you get on 1st.....it turns into an automatic run.
RANT OVER!!!
please explain to me what a "Football move" is so I know what's happening during games this weekend.
A "Football move" is what Dez took in '14 against GB and they STILL didn't call it a catch!!!!
I assume that you consider players kneeling in prayer, players crossing themselves, pointing into the air or thanking God after victory all examples of them using televised coverage of the game to throw their religious beliefs down people's throats?
Robb
I see no reason for a man of faith to make a public spectacle by "witnessing" just because the camera is on him, and I find it even more repugnant that they do the same regarding a political position. they stay at home and make millions while other men of the same age serve.
where oh where is Roger Staubach??
" it's a joke that they are using the televised coverage of a game to throw their political beliefs down people's throats "
I assume that you consider players kneeling in prayer, players crossing themselves, pointing into the air or thanking God after victory all examples of them using televised coverage of the game to throw their religious beliefs down people's throats?
Robb
You assume wrong, I'm talking about exactly what you know I'm talking about, not your spin on it.
speaking about the "marquee" Teams that the NFL wants to be its face in the prime-time games --- does it make sense to have the Giants play last Monday and now be on this Sunday Night???
Robb, are you familiar with the Pharisees? their rituals and the way they made public showings of their observances were widely criticized, even by Christ. I have always been struck by the similarity in these athletes "showing" us their faith on the stage whenever they can. it always rings hollow with me, not that they have faith but that it is important for them to let us know.
I see no reason for a man of faith to make a public spectacle by "witnessing" just because the camera is on him, and I find it even more repugnant that they do the same regarding a political position. they stay at home and make millions while other men of the same age serve.
where oh where is Roger Staubach??
And the Cardinal player that gave his life. He could have stayed and made millions, but didn't!
Again....they shouldn't even put the camera on them.....attention is what they want!
I'll get to see Henry next week first hand when the Browns lose their 6th game of the season to Tennessee. and while we're on the subject of rookies, has anyone seen what Amari Cooper has been doing?? holy crap!!