Options
Walter Breen's Most Over-The-Top Claim
planonit
Posts: 525 ✭✭
My understanding is that Breen was quite emphatic that 1964 Franklin existed in private collection and he had a chance to examine one but was on vacation or something. It is strange story.
What are your favorite "Breen Tales" that you read and go "Big Fish Tale".?
What are your favorite "Breen Tales" that you read and go "Big Fish Tale".?
I have plans....sometimes
0
Comments
Didn't he claim not to be a pedophile once?
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
He claimed rarity on lots of coins that were not rare. One being the 1839-O shattered rev. Dime.
And this one as well--the 1846/46 quarter, which may have been "scarce" or "rare" at the time, but which is now considered common.
Tom
I believe that there were times of his life when he was so bored with being considered a numismatic genius that he deliberately made declarations with the intent to draw attention from challengers, for his own entertainment.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
Didn't he claim not to be a pedophile once?
OP walked right into that one.
I could well be wrong though, but it seems hard to believe.
Especially when you consider that PCGS pops in MS of the coin total 35, many of which may be repeat submissions.
I would think if 300 MS coins existed out of a single hoard, most would have been certified by now.
I always thought his claim that Col. E.H.R. Green had more than 200 mint state 1796 quarters (100 of which were "more or less prooflike") was total baloney.
I could well be wrong though, but it seems hard to believe.
Especially when you consider that PCGS pops in MS of the coin total 35, many of which may be repeat submissions.
I would think if 300 MS coins existed out of a single hoard, most would have been certified by now.
Was not aware of this. That is absolutely ridiculous.
Enjoyed numismatic conversations with Eric P. Newman, Dave Akers, Jules Reiver, David Davis, Russ Logan, John McCloskey, Kirk Gorman, W. David Perkins...
Free Trial
That was actually Abe Kosoff who stated it.
So Kosoff told Breen about the alleged 200 coin hoard and then Breen printed it as fact?
Breen talks about the hoard in his "Encyclopedia" but only says Kosoff sold the coins, but it certainly makes sense that Kosoff was the source of the information.
The "Encyclopedia" is where I got my quotes.
Breen goes on to say "A. Kosoff and Andre DeCoppet dispersed many of these [1804 MS quarters] to date and type collectors during the 1940s. Decades of publicity about the alleged rarity of this single-year type coin managed to push prices into the five-figure level."
PCGS has it online:
"Next on the auction block was Part II of the World's Greatest Collection, which made history on March 3, 1945. Among the coins offered in Part II were four 1796 quarters. An Uncirculated example with a prooflike surface fetched $100 and a piece described as a superb Proof brought $160. Little fuss was made about these pieces, although decades later the appearance of even one 1796 quarter in a higher grade would be a cause for excitement within the collecting fraternity. Abe Kosoff had every reason to be blase about 1796 quarters in 1945. Years laters in his reminiscences he explained:
"Lest our dear readers be overwhelmed by the inclusion of four choice quarters of 1796 in the World's Greatest Collection, let me divert for a moment and tell a little tale. It was well known that the fabulous Col. E.H.R. Green Collection contained many hoards. Green used to travel by automobile quite extensively. He loved to buy, and quantity did not deter him. Stories are told of how he would stop at an antique shop and end up buying the entire place!
"Among his hoards was one containing 1796 quarters. Burdette G. Johnson, the St. Louis dealer, had an 'in' on the Green estate. There is no doubt in my mind that this 'in' came about through Fred Boyd's influence. Boyd had been in charge of appraising the coins in the Green estate and invited Burdette G. Johnson and Joseph Barnet to assist him. They spent about five weeks on the job.
"I was not yet Fred Boyd's 'fair-haired boy,' so these were things I didn't know about at the time they happened but learned later during our Tuesday lunch date. At any rate, Johnson got his hands on the Col. Green quarters, and James G. Macallister, the well-known Philadelphia dealer, went out to St. Louis to transact for these and other items.
"When Macallister reached New York City on his return trip he stopped in to see me at the Numismatic Gallery. Mac used to wear a homburg hat and a heavy overcoat. From one inside pocket he took out a narrow package about 15 to 18 inches long, wrapped in brown paper. On the show counter he unwrapped it and displayed row after row of 1796 quarters, everyone Uncirculated. 'Ninety bucks, take your pick,' he said. Before the 'wow' got out of my mouth, out of another inside pocket Mac took another package, very much like the first. 'These will cost you $125 each,' he advised. This group contained the so-called Proof 1796 quarters, brilliant gems, each and everyone. The first parcel contained the frosty coins. I don't recall how many I bought, perhaps five or six of each. All in all I would say that there were about 100 pieces, possibly a few more or less."
Note to "plan on it" I hope my intrusion didn't sidetrack your post. If I had something to post on Breen I would. Well, wait a minute...my friend, who discovered the 1821 B-6 quarter dollar variety actually has a Breen letter tucked away about his discovery piece. Maybe one day I can obtain a copy....
Enjoyed numismatic conversations with Eric P. Newman, Dave Akers, Jules Reiver, David Davis, Russ Logan, John McCloskey, Kirk Gorman, W. David Perkins...
Didn't he claim not to be a pedophile once?
Convicted and died in jail of liver cancer...hope he suffered. A lot.
Unfortunately, the Johnson inventory of the Col. Green quarters has not been located.
From his daughter
siliconvalleycoins.com
Guy was as close to evil as a human can be.
https://askthebigot.com/2015/0...a-greyland-guest-post/">From his daughter
Link fixed (new CU software is stupid about "https" links)
Wow. I've always known he had a sordid past, but never really read the details.
can't we stick to Numismatics??
to that end, I have always enjoyed Breen's Encyclopedia and find it to be a wealth of information. until someone can undertake a revision and correct his mistakes, accidental or intentional, it will have to be accepted as it is and we can each interpret it as we learn more. I think that at the time it was written many of today's accepted errors were accepted fact. as time passes we can learn and correct them to the Hobby's advantage.
now, go out to the garage and get the rope.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
That was actually Abe Kosoff who stated it.
Right! It would be great to see some of that hoard.
another fine example of a Numismatic Urban Legend.
I don't see the initials "AW" ; so readers may have to picture this in their mind.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
typical Walter Breen thread that took exactly one post to remind us all that he was a pedophile. before y'all get out the rope to hang me, together with my Girlfriend we have raised six children and crime of Breen was despicable to say the least, but it is old and doesn't really need to be rehashed and discussed in a thread about his Encyclopedia and Numismatic accomplishments, does it??? perhaps every time one of us makes a coin related post or asks a question about something related to the Hobby we should be reminded of our past transgressions so members know who they're responding to. it gets old quick, for me at least, but maybe some members get satisfaction from continually and perpetually running Breen into the ground and reminding us all of what he did.
can't we stick to Numismatics??
to that end, I have always enjoyed Breen's Encyclopedia and find it to be a wealth of information. until someone can undertake a revision and correct his mistakes, accidental or intentional, it will have to be accepted as it is and we can each interpret it as we learn more. I think that at the time it was written many of today's accepted errors were accepted fact. as time passes we can learn and correct them to the Hobby's advantage.
now, go out to the garage and get the rope.
Gee, thanks for making up our collective mind for us, keets. Past transgressions, LOL!
I was trying to identify a Roman coin and found it in an old German ancient coin book.
I discovered later that the book's author was a fanatical Nazi, a member of the SA, SS, and Ahnenerbe (an SS Aryan historical group).
Does that mean that one can not use his numismatic books for research?
The Mysterious Egyptian Magic Coin
Coins in Movies
Coins on Television
I was involved in a similar situation with another numismatic author in 2010.
I was trying to identify a Roman coin and found it in an old German ancient coin book.
I discovered later that the book's author was a fanatical Nazi, a member of the SA, SS, and Ahnenerbe (an SS Aryan historical group).
Does that mean that one can not use his numismatic books for research?
Was the SS guy later found to have made up his own facts and passed them off as truth ?
no need for thanks, let me know when you locate your conscience.
But I'm not sure the book will ever be replicated or replaced. Just a HUGE undertaking to get that much information, photos, etc. into one volume. I'd buy a "new and improved" edition or replacement reference in a heartbeat if anyone made the effort....
that he was the Lindbergh baby. A biographical story from many years ago
another fine example of a Numismatic Urban Legend.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
it isn't that it's "not to my liking" at all, it's just that your post resembles the sort of thing that Breen repeatedly gets hammered for in his Encyclopedia. you understand that much, right??
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Guy was as close to evil as a human can be.
From his daughter
web site not found.
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
Guy was as close to evil as a human can be.
From his daughter
web site not found.
Rob fixed the link. It's a strange and disturbing read.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
typical Walter Breen thread that took exactly one post to remind us all that he was a pedophile. before y'all get out the rope to hang me, together with my Girlfriend we have raised six children and crime of Breen was despicable to say the least, but it is old and doesn't really need to be rehashed and discussed in a thread about his Encyclopedia and Numismatic accomplishments, does it??? perhaps every time one of us makes a coin related post or asks a question about something related to the Hobby we should be reminded of our past transgressions so members know who they're responding to. it gets old quick, for me at least, but maybe some members get satisfaction from continually and perpetually running Breen into the ground and reminding us all of what he did.
can't we stick to Numismatics??
ty sir. i didnt have the energy to say it this time.
is there anyone in numismatics that DOESNT know. sheesh.
a wild claim, by a human. no way jose.
how about the one about an unc s-79? it has kept me up at night(s) wondering where i may go look for it.
darn humans and their rumors~
.
Just one look at the guy and it's pretty obvious he was a wackadoodle. Surprised he had the time to do research and write given his other hobby interests.
Fwiw, they'd probably say the same thing today about how the elderly Ben Franklin looked.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
Kevin
I like the 1917 proofs
Stewart Blay showed me the 1917 Lincoln cent Breen called a proof, it still had the cert with it, I scoped it, the inside edge was artificially cut.
Kevin
I finally had a chance to examine a 1917 with that die crack. Been looking to see one for over 25 years ever since his book came out. It is a proof!! You cannot explain away the wide rims which are brilliant/polished WITH NO ROUNDING / BEVELING except by a proof striking. It is what is
despite the fact that it will never be slabbed by Hertz or Avis.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
In Breen’s monumental encylopdia of US coins (which weighs about 20 pounds!) he said that there are 1917 matte proof buffalo nickels, a few, around 8 and that some of them have a die crack from the rim down past the L in LIBERTY and into the field.
I finally had a chance to examine a 1917 with that die crack. Been looking to see one for over 25 years ever since his book came out. It is a proof!! You cannot explain away the wide rims which are brilliant/polished except by a proof striking. It is what is
despite the fact that it will never be slabbed by Hertz or Avis.
Cool, can you point me to the coin if you know where it still is
Thanks
And I have looked at many hundreds of 1917 buffs over the past 25 years and nary a single coin with the die crack until this one.
There is another 1917 nickel which now resides in an anacs ms60 details coin (cleaned) that has another diecrack in LIBERTY but it is not a proof. Die crack is in a completely different location.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"