Announcement Regarding United States Philippine Coins (USPI) 1903-1945

wondercoin

Beginning this evening, my son Justin (his eBay handle is "monstercoinmart") will feature weekly no reserve auctions for very interesting USPI (as well as Philippine pattern coins post 1945) collector coins as well as some Buy It Now Offerings on these coins. More and more USPI coins will be added weekly. If this is an area of collecting you are interested in, I urge you to mark as a "favorite" Justin's eBay handle (and his website by the same name (www.monstercoinmart.com), which will be launching later this month).

The vast majority of these coins will be coming from the landmark "Justhavingfun" USPI collection that I oversee. Of course, some of the great coins will continue to be sold at major auction events (like the one that took place this week in Long Beach where a half dozen incredible USPI coins were auctioned off). And, before that at Stacks auctions as well. I expect that these great auction houses will continue to offer JHF coins in the months and years ahead.

But, there will also be something for everyone in Justin's weekly eBay auctions and BIN offerings in the weeks and months ahead. USPI (and Philippine pattern) coins retailing for as little as $20 or so (and opening at 42 cents with no reserve) all the way up THE rarest USPI coin in existence - a Unique 1907 Proof Peso grading PCGS-PR65 which Justin will be photographing next week and offering shortly thereafter (at a Buy It Now price) on eBay.

This 1907 Proof Peso is so extremely rare, Coinfacts does not even list it at the present time and shows the proof Peso collection as 1903, 1904, 1905, 1906 and 1908! Justin will also alert Coinfacts of the existence of the Unique 1907 Proof Peso (already in a PCGS gem holder) so they can include it in their roster of proof Pesos struck by the US Mint and stamped "United States of America" on the reverse. These 1903-1945 coins are part of United States coin collecting we believe, which is why Justin will be offering these coins and discussing them wherever possible under United States coin forums, etc (and not the World Coin section).

Since Justin is not a member of these boards, if anyone has any questions regarding any of the coins Justin offers on eBay (or even possibly on his website beginning next month), feel free to send me a PM and I'll quickly get a response from Justin. I have no doubt, collectors will be "scoring" great Registry coins from Justin on eBay that will truly be wonderful additions to their collections. And, I also expect that JHF's amazing #1 Registry Sets of nearly every USPI denomination will begin to be sold off sometime in 2017. Feel free to send me a PM if you have any questions about those sets.

You heard it hear first USPI collectors!

Wondercoin

pruebas

Interesting. Now I know where the 07 Pattern Peso ended up. I was an underbidder.



If by "post-1945 patterns" you mean those 1960s Tupaz creations, you do know that they are being restruck from original dies, right? I have photos of the dies as they were offered to me years ago and I declined.

wondercoin

Pruebas ... I have absolutely no information on the history of the modern patterns other than what NGC detemined on each individual holder (which Justin entitles each auction). I can tell you they are all being listed at a starting bid of 42 cents with no reserve by my son and bidders can make their own determination as to their value. Most of the USPI coins are also being listed that way as well. I can see that the NGC holders are many years old on those modern patterns ... if you have information that they are currently being restruck from original dies perhaps you should let NGC know so they can recognize that information on future holders that they slab.

It is nice to know you were an underbidder on the 1907 Peso. The immediate underbidder contacted me yesterday as well.

Wondercoin

brg5658

Seems this should be in the BST section. Unabashed "self"-promotion...

Zohar

Originally posted by: brg5658

Seems this should be in the BST section. Unabashed "self"-promotion...

I agree. The post is purely commercial with no numismatic insights to the forum membership. I am fine with highlighting an upcoming sale/collection when there is no direct economic benefit to the OP.

wondercoin

Sorry guys if this "self" promotion involving my son offended anyone here. But, I do believe this post greatly benefited serious USPI collectors as evidenced by the PM's I have already received. First, I identified the existence of the rarest USPI coin known (not even on COINFACTS Yet) and even a USPI "expert" told me yesterday he was unaware of this coin. Second, I provided an update on JHF's collection- a collection I get asked about by serious USPI collectors nearly every month.

That said, I will not be posting USPI information over here again as I also mentioned we will be treating these coins in the future as the United States coins we believe they are.

Could I have posted this on the World BST board just as effectively. I suppose so. My apologies again if this offended anyone.

Wondercoin

edited to add ... I was just alerted that I did not even correctly mention my son's eBay handle on the original thread (which I have now fixed). I can't even get the "self" promotion right!

brg5658

Originally posted by: wondercoin

Sorry guys if this "self" promotion involving my son offended anyone here. But, I do believe this post greatly benefited serious USPI collectors as evidenced by the PM's I have already received. First, I identified the existence of the rarest USPI coin known (not even on COINFACTS Yet) and even a USPI "expert" told me yesterday he was unaware of this coin. Second, I provided an update on JHF's collection- a collection I get asked about by serious USPI collectors nearly every month.



That said, I will not be posting USPI information over here again as I also mentioned we will be treating these coins in the future as the United States coins we believe they are.



Could I have posted this on the World BST board just as effectively. I suppose so. My apologies again if this offended anyone.



Wondercoin

Thanks for the clarification Wondercoin, but this should really be in the BST.



Best,

Zohar

Wondercoin - no offense and your acknowledgement is appreciated. We just try to keep the promotional side and numismatics separate.

wondercoin

Thank you both.

Wondercoin

edited to add ... I was just alerted that I did not even correctly mention my son's eBay handle on the original thread (which I have now fixed). I can't even get the "self" promotion right!

Swampboy

From my point of view; if a new dealer/player throws his/her hat in the ring, a one time forum PSA is timely, newsworthy and welcome.



Edit typo

marcmoish

Dunno about this guys - me thinks you both were unduly harsh - while I get your points it's not like we get hundreds of posts, many don't visit the BST often either.....and this was a one time thingy from a litesider with info that is def numismatic-ally interesting AND relevant to some I bet.



Personally Wondercoin handled this better then I expected - we havent had a full blown war of words or breakdown for a long time, and I thought you'd both get nuked by his response - alas peace on the darkside remains

wondercoin

"Personally Wondercoin handled this better then I expected"

I read "Lord of the Flies"

Wondercoin

Zohar

Originally posted by: marcmoish

Dunno about this guys - me thinks you both were unduly harsh - while I get your points it's not like we get hundreds of posts, many don't visit the BST often either.....and this was a one time thingy from a litesider with info that is def numismatic-ally interesting AND relevant to some I bet.



Personally Wondercoin handled this better then I expected - we havent had a full blown war of words or breakdown for a long time, and I thought you'd both get nuked by his response - alas peace on the darkside remains

It is a peaceful place. I took a recent peek on the lite side and that's a real battlezone. Maybe we need to spice it up here to get the traffic

wondercoin

"It is a peaceful place. I took a recent peek on the lite side and that's a real battlezone. Maybe we need to spice it up here to get the traffic"

I'll post a new thread next week updating everyone on how Justin's first week went selling USPI coins on eBay HAHAHA.

Wondercoin

pruebas

Originally posted by: marcmoish

Dunno about this guys - me thinks you both were unduly harsh - while I get your points it's not like we get hundreds of posts, many don't visit the BST often either.....and this was a one time thingy from a litesider with info that is def numismatic-ally interesting AND relevant to some I bet.



Personally Wondercoin handled this better then I expected - we havent had a full blown war of words or breakdown for a long time, and I thought you'd both get nuked by his response - alas peace on the darkside remains

I agree. Yes, there was a little self-promotion, but no worse then Mike Byers with his "magazine" or Dennis Tucker with his new Whitman books "that ANA members can borrow from the ANA Library" nonsense. These guys throw in a little information in with their self-promotion.



wondercoin did provide useful info to me, and I would never have seen it in the BST as I never go there.



Who would have guessed that he was involved with the JHF collection?

wondercoin

"Who would have guessed that he was involved with the JHF collection?"

Many might have guessed myself as I also recently sold off JHF's World Class SLQ and Shield Nickel collections as well his Liberty nickels, Jefferson Nickels, Three Cent Silvers, Two Centers, CN Three Centers, Patterns, finest known 1894-S Dime, etc. etc.

But, virtually no one would have guessed that monstercoinmart on eBay was handling the sale of thousand+ of slabbed USPI dupes. That's for sure.

Wondercoin

brg5658

Originally posted by: pruebas

Originally posted by: marcmoish

Dunno about this guys - me thinks you both were unduly harsh - while I get your points it's not like we get hundreds of posts, many don't visit the BST often either.....and this was a one time thingy from a litesider with info that is def numismatic-ally interesting AND relevant to some I bet.



Personally Wondercoin handled this better then I expected - we havent had a full blown war of words or breakdown for a long time, and I thought you'd both get nuked by his response - alas peace on the darkside remains

I agree. Yes, there was a little self-promotion, but no worse then Mike Byers with his "magazine" or Dennis Tucker with his new Whitman books "that ANA members can borrow from the ANA Library" nonsense. These guys throw in a little information in with their self-promotion.



wondercoin did provide useful info to me, and I would never have seen it in the BST as I never go there.



Who would have guessed that he was involved with the JHF collection?

Other **expletive** doing something is not justification for one more person to join in. Especially Wondercoin -- he's on PCGS' board of experts and should know better. He's not exactly a newbie to these forums given 17,000+ posts and 15+ years of presence.



I'd rather this forum be slow than chalk full of advertisements that belong in the BST. Call me "harsh" if you want, doesn't change the reality that this is unabashed self-promotion. Period.

LochNESS

OK, well, since the thread is here I will comment here.



I have been looking for the "right" proof peso for quite some time. I was the under-bidder on many a few years ago, when a major collection went to auction. I'm hoping that I will win one this time around.



Glad to have been made aware of the auction(s).

pruebas

Originally posted by: brg5658

Originally posted by: pruebas

Originally posted by: marcmoish

Dunno about this guys - me thinks you both were unduly harsh - while I get your points it's not like we get hundreds of posts, many don't visit the BST often either.....and this was a one time thingy from a litesider with info that is def numismatic-ally interesting AND relevant to some I bet.



Personally Wondercoin handled this better then I expected - we havent had a full blown war of words or breakdown for a long time, and I thought you'd both get nuked by his response - alas peace on the darkside remains

I agree. Yes, there was a little self-promotion, but no worse then Mike Byers with his "magazine" or Dennis Tucker with his new Whitman books "that ANA members can borrow from the ANA Library" nonsense. These guys throw in a little information in with their self-promotion.



wondercoin did provide useful info to me, and I would never have seen it in the BST as I never go there.



Who would have guessed that he was involved with the JHF collection?

I'd rather this forum be slow than chalk full of advertisements that belong in the BST. Call me "harsh" if you want, doesn't change the reality that this is unabashed self-promotion. Period.

brg5658, you are certainly entitled to your opinion. But the consensus here seems to be that the post was ok. Just because you say so, doesn't make it so (the self-promotion accusation). Many of us appreciated the post and forgave the self-promotion for the information gained.

pruebas

Originally posted by: wondercoin

"Who would have guessed that he was involved with the JHF collection?"



Many might have guessed myself as I also recently sold off JHF's World Class SLQ and Shield Nickel collections as well his Liberty nickels, Jefferson Nickels, Three Cent Silvers, Two Centers, CN Three Centers, Patterns, finest known 1894-S Dime, etc. etc.



But, virtually no one would have guessed that monstercoinmart on eBay was handling the sale of thousand+ of slabbed USPI dupes. That's for sure.



Wondercoin

Sorry wondercoin, I don't know you from Adam. Nor do I know those collections or where/how they were sold. I do seem to remember that JHF had a great SLQ collection that was sold, but that's it.



I do seem to remember an 1894-S 10c that Laurie flew transcon with it in her pocket. Or maybe I got that one mixed up too.

PBRat

I like this thread. Things I learned ...
1. There's a unique Philippine Proof 1907 Peso. I don't have a lot of interest Philippine coins, but a unique coin is interesting.
2. The Philippine Proof Peso's cover the years from 1903 to 1908. I saw a few PR67 Proof Peso's in a recent Heritage auction, and the looked like nice coins. Maybe I'll buy one someday.
3. There are some post 1945 Philippine pattern coins. If I ever am considering one, I should google Tupaz to try to get the full story before buying.

In my opinion, wondercoin can keep self promoting as long as I'm learning.

wondercoin

Purebas... Yes, you got that wrong as well. We sold the coin to JF, who flew it home in his top pocket.

Brg... I believe my posting was fine. Since I had no plans to post here again concerning USPI coins, I elected to simply apologize to those couple offended board members with my announcement. You have posted 1,700 posts to my 17,000 posts in the same period. Yes, I believe you may spend a great deal of time ATS, which is great.

I am not sure now if this will be my last announcement concerning USPI coins in light of all the positive PM's I have received. I know many of you greatly appreciate the heads up I have given you on acquiring these seldom seen high grade USPI coins.

Wondercoin

wondercoin

LochNess, PBRat...

I will try to give you heads up the next time we release a wonderful PR67 Peso from the collection. I sent over most, if not all, of the the wonderful Peso coins just sold at Heritage. And, I sold them in a U.S. coin auction (where they belong) as opposed to being auctioned in a World sale where they have been sold traditionally. They did fabulously well. The 1904 in PR67 fetched $11,750 and even the 1905 in PR65 realized more than $11,400! I released a 1908 Peso in what I believe may be the only ever auctioned PR67+ Peso grade. That did very well too as did the 1906 Peso in PR67. But, what surprised me was the roughly $40,000 that the 1912-S in MS64 realized! I believe collectors are realizing that if these were Morgan Dollars, they would likely be worth multiples of these Peso prices and in this overall soft coin market this is an area of the market where perceived value is being seen in these Peso coins.

Many of these coins have also not seen a (re)grading service in upwards of 10 or more years. Keep an eye out for the older holders that are appearing at major auction (and will start appearing on eBay in Justin's offerings). When we consign the coins, we often know that the coin we are consigning is an easy + candidate if not a full 1 point (or more) upgrade candidate. But, we are confident collectors will pay for quality. We have never sent them over to NGC to try to capture an easy point or so upgrade and then a possible cross back. Just like collectors did last week for the wonderful quality PR65 1905 Peso that sold for as much money (in excess of $11,400) as the last PR67 that Heritage auctioned (and I bought for JHF). And, the prior sale of the same PR65 grade 1905 Peso at Heritage was $5,875 at the 1/16 Heritage Fun Sale auction. This time $11,400- which is PR67 money!

Send me a PM if you have been looking for that special USPI coin and I can give you some information on when an example might be appearing next at auction.

As always, just my two cents.

Wondercoin

brg5658

Originally posted by: pruebas



brg5658, you are certainly entitled to your opinion. But the consensus here seems to be that the post was ok. Just because you say so, doesn't make it so (the self-promotion accusation). Many of us appreciated the post and forgave the self-promotion for the information gained.

I realize you may not be aware of wondercoin's continued and rampant self-promotion in other venues. ATS he only visits basically to promote wares he has a financial interest in promoting. He also often self-promotes on the US side of this forum.



Nonetheless, this will be my last post in this thread, as apparently wondercoin's sales thread in the World Forum has pleased many of you.



Best,

wondercoin

Brg5658... Now that very tall tale about ATS does require a reply. I was contacted by a board member here that there was a thread ATS about a PCGS top pop coin I was selling on eBay for a customer. I was told its quality for the grade was being attacked over there. I will have No Part of that when it is entirely undeserving. Off to the NGC boards I went to properly defend the PCGS coin (my consignor's coin). A place by the way I had posted a couple dozen times total in 10 or 15 years I recall. Defending PCGS graded coins ATS is not the easiest task, but I stuck with it and in the end made a few "new friends" in the process. But, obviously not a "friend" in brg I am afraid.

But, you can't please 100% of the world 100% of the time.

On the merits, if you think about it- ANY announcement of virtually anything involves some degree of self-promotion. if the rule was made that no announcements of any kind could be made on this forum, that would solve the "problem". But, for me personally that would be like winning the battle and losing the war as I would sure like to know (as a collector) about new major developments in the coin series I collect through whatever announcements anyone wants to make. And, rest assured my announcement here was a major announcement for USPI collectors as will clearly be shown in the weeks and months ahead.

As always, just my two cents.

Wondercoin.

SYRACUSIAN

I believe that the whole discussion is unnecessary. The Darkside prides itself on being a self moderated forum,and wondercoin's post belongs here IMHO because, like pruebas, I rarely ever visit the BST and even if I do, I wouldn't have opened a thread concerning the sale of USPI coins.



JHF's collection was a landmark in its field, so it's newsworthy, unlike some dupes sold off by members at the BST, but besides that, if you read wondercoin's posts, you will notice a very high level of posting. In fact, I was just about to email the link of this thread to a friend of mine who collects truly high end USPI coins and I'm proud to have offered him a 194something raw dime, with blazing luster and unbelievable toning that ended up grading PCGS MS68. For the record,I had bought this coin raw from ajaan for $10 the minute I saw it in an SSP thread here,or in our old weekly BST thread.The older members surely remember that before the W&A's BST separate forum, we used to have a weekly BST thread in this very same forum.



As for my friend Z., I vote that we name him the new Darkside sheriff, a position that's been empty ever since cacheman has stopped posting here.

Zohar

It's very simple Dimitri - you basically have rules or not. I have seen prior threads where people were told to shift to bst. Here you ask for an exception as it is an area of interest for the collector base. What would have been your response had I posted a link to my coins for sale which no one cares about? I personally don't know or care about the coins promoted.



If we only take in promotional posts we like then what do we do with the promotional material we do not like? For me it's about consistency not stirring up the pot. It's about forum rules being consistent for all.

wondercoin

Zohar ... To my point ... are you saying you would vote for NO announcements of any kind here since EVERY announcement has some degree of self interest, self-promotion or benefit to someone in it? Yes or no?

Wondercoin

wondercoin

"JHF's collection was a landmark in its field, so it's newsworthy, unlike some dupes sold off by members at the BST, but besides that, if you read wondercoin's posts, you will notice a very high level of posting"

Thank you Syracusian.

Look ... the reality is, with respect to some of the USPI coins my son will be posting on eBay, this material is seldom offered anywhere in the world even over a 5, 10 or 20 year period. For example, the 1906 50 Centavos specimen he is posting later today on eBay in the grade of PCGS-PR67 is a coin that my quick check of Heritage revealed has never been offered by them in decades at that PCGS grade level - not even at a one grade under PR66 graded level by PCGS (best I could see in their search tools). My intention of the post here was a simple "Announcement" to anyone that might care about USPI coins to give them a "heads up" on something they might even be quite suspect about at first blush (i.e. how does one fairly new account seller on eBay have such incredible USPI merchandise for sale all of a sudden in such quantities). And, again, every Announcement has a degree of self interest in it by definition.

That said ... I do value the less expensive coins offered on the BST board as well ... there is no threshold limit where this dollar amount is OK to "announce" about while this cheaper level is not. The key here is that PCGS coins (repeat PCGS coins) that in many cases have virtually NEVER (or quite rarely) been available to serious USPI collectors in these grades will start to become available on eBay in addition to any regular consignment venues I send them to that USPI collectors are accustomed to expect there. I thought that was newsworthy enough to make a single Announcement thread about.

Wondercoin

Zohar

Originally posted by: wondercoin

Zohar ... To my point ... are you saying you would vote for NO announcements of any kind here since EVERY announcement has some degree of self interest, self-promotion or benefit to someone in it? Yes or no?



Wondercoin

I say eliminate the BST section and just let everyone promote their goods....You didn't point to a 3rd party sale you pointed to your own self determining that your sale was important enough to announce. The minute you subjectively determine that it loses objectivity which means anyone here can do the same.



I sense you have been emboldened by the collector support here to go on the attack. I don't answer to you as I don't to anyone here - I simply follow the rules as defined.

SYRACUSIAN

It's very simple Dimitri - you basically have rules or not.





I couldn't agree more Z. But wondercoin's thread is undoubtedly the exception that confirms this rule IMHO.



I've seen countless attempts to post selling threads here,not always by mistake. I remember a couple of lame attempts by members

with a post count less than 10 or 20 , who have "mistakenly" posted their BST thread here, and left it as is for a couple of days, even after one or more members told them to move it to the BST. They'd log in at the weirdest hours (but they didn't know that I'm 7 hours ahead of East Coast and 10 hours ahead of West coast, and therefore awake when everyone else sleeps)and the rest of the time they pretended to be off line. Then, a couple of days later, after having ensured that a certain percentage saw it, even if CU has long stopped showing the number of views per thread and rightly so, they'd reappear and edit it. The best response to them, was no response at all. Within hours (there was more traffic back then), their thread had left page one, we used to call that "let the thread die or sink" , I can't remember exactly.



I'm not interested in buying USPI coins either, I've only opened this one to mail it to my serious USPI collector friend. But I remember the excellent posts by JHF, educational, polite, well written and extremely modest. The way wondercoin has handled this, shows me that he's very much alike with JHF. And in case you haven't noticed, even if his sigline contains info about his website or other, it's not clickable like mine for instance, which is an indication that it's addressed only to the members who are really interested in buying or watching these coins.



Everything is not black and white. From a simple traffic violation,to a serious alleged crime whose handling and final decision is left at the discretion of a judge, there's plenty of room for bending some rules, without breaking the law. Also, the majority of the members who posted tends to agree with me that this thread belongs here. And to my knowledge, the small minority of posters, usually reflect the opinion of the vast silent majority who prefers to watch rather than post. The last time I've seen a "BST" thread here, was when wybrit sold his fantastic Victorian silver minors, and he was not the one who was the OP. No one complained back then either.



But your objection is duly noted.Because democracy isn't about enforcing the majority's will, but instead to let the minorities speak and express themselves freely.

Zohar

My sole post came earlier stating the forum rules as I know them ...then the debate on right/wrong kicked in where the majority voted to let wondercoin market his goods. He apologized for listing the post and then I acknowledged his action. I sat silent until Mr. Wondercoin embraced the supportive forum posts went on the attack in his post as follows: "Zohar ... To my point ... are you saying you would vote for NO announcements of any kind here since EVERY announcement has some degree of self interest, self-promotion or benefit to someone in it? Yes or no?"



In the name of "Democracy" as you define Dimitri, I will remain the minority vote here and will not answer to Mr. Wondercoin who must feel as he won some major battle and needed to stick it back to the ones that questioned his commercial post. I accept the will of the majority yet he feels he need to make a point to conclude, while a human tendency, I don't care much for it as I really don't seek a lecture from someone I don't know, If this little win makes Wondercoin happy - that's great. We need joy in this world.

wondercoin

Zohar. I believe you elected to not answer my simple question because, if answered honestly, it would have confirmed that my announcement was quite acceptable. Plain and simple. Far from an attack on you. Over and out. Wondercoin.

Edited to add... Dimitri... I posted on behalf of my son. I did not ask anyone of a 100+ forum members I am very friendly with to do him a favor and post a third party post here which is obviously acceptable. No games played here.

Zohar

You are really something in judging my honesty and assuming rather than reading my answer - I clearly answered - "In the name of "Democracy" as you define Dimitri, I will remain the minority vote here"



Minority vote = BST is a more appropriate place to promote your own sale and financial interest.



I have no interest in furthering this discussion with you.

wondercoin

With all due respect. I never judged your honesty. You never answered my question either one way or the other. In fact, it only reaffirms to me your honesty even more.

To the USPI collectors. .. please check the BST board for my future announcements or just send me your email address via PM and I will pass it along to Justin.

Wondercoin

EVillageProwler

It's a rare day that I get to be a diplomat...

I think this discussion has gone beyond its worth, because I think both sides have merit in their positions (I actually do side with one position, but I prefer to keep that private -- for now).

Yes, this started as a BST-ish thread, and we have a BST forum. Yes, this thread was very good to some (or many) of us. Since we don't have an actual problem here, and I don't foresee this becoming a slippery slope incident, I say that we categorize this sole thread as a grey area and move on to other merry threads and topics.

(Seldom is the real benefit of always trying to be right and having everyone else agree with you. I learned that from my ex-wife, and reinforced by my current wife.)

Ok?

EVP

wondercoin

EVP ... Well said ... I'm moving on to the other merry threads and topics.



Wondercoin

marcmoish

OH WOW!!



A full blown nuke it out fest...we haven't had one since..... I don't recall...ever?



For the record I still stand by my original statement - there really was nothing wrong with this post period - when you look at the whole picture, and as originally presented.



Flame away

amwldcoin

I have a coin Krause lists as 2 known! I think I am going to let heritage auction it....haven't decided yet. Should I start a thread about it here??????

krueger

It is my understanding there are two known 1907 proof pesos.



This may be the only one in private hands. I stand to be corrected,

but I believe the other is in the Philippine Central Bank museum,



Krueger

Collecting USPI since 1975

PBRat

I have a coin Krause lists as 2 known! I think I am going to let heritage auction it....haven't decided yet. Should I start a thread about it here??????

Sure, what is it?

wondercoin

Krueger. They are each unique I believe made with different metal compositions. Wondercoin

pruebas

Originally posted by: wondercoin

Krueger. They are each unique I believe made with different metal compositions. Wondercoin

Correct. One of them is 800 fine and the other is 900 fine. I forget which is impounded in the museum, but yes, the other is there. They both are technically patterns.

wondercoin

Agreed Pruebas.

On another note, JHF's Proof Peso collection was just updated in the PCGS set registry. All the coins are also pictured. Breathtaking is an understatement. Every coin in PCGS-PR68 or finer grade. The coins are not presently for sale. I just thought anyone interested in viewing some neat colorful Peso coins (as well as a near technically flawless 1906) might want to take a look. My personal favorite is the 1903. Wondercoin.

Analyst

I am a veteran of controversies in forums. I would never, however, advertise coins for sale at the top of a thread in this forum. In any event, I wish to suggest a compromise.

WonderCoin's original post could have been effective and satisfying to most all while being worded in a less commercial manner. Rather than keep mentioning his son and E-Bay, it would have made sense to talk more about the importance of the JHF Collection of USPI coins and some of the impressive coins therein. It could have been pointed out that some of the more expensive coins have been and will be in major auctions, while some of the less expensive coins will be sold in Internet-only venues without being so explicit. Interested buyers can find them without much difficulty, especially after being informed that such coins are being or will soon be offered. The emphasis of the beginning of this thread could have been on the quality, completeness, and depth of the said collection, which is very much newsworthy and an appropriate topic for a thread. There was not a need to explicitly mention the names of sellers.

WonderCoin: all the way up THE rarest USPI coin in existence - a Unique 1907 Proof Peso grading PCGS-PR65 ... This 1907 Proof Peso is so extremely rare, Coinfacts does not even list it at the present time and shows the proof Peso collection as 1903, 1904, 1905, 1906 and 1908! Justin will also alert Coinfacts of the existence of the Unique 1907 Proof Peso (already in a PCGS gem holder) so they can include it in their roster of proof Pesos struck by the US Mint and stamped "United States of America" on the reverse

PBrat: I like this thread. Things I learned .. 1. There's a unique Philippine Proof 1907 Peso. I don't have a lot of interest Philippine coins, but a unique coin is interesting ...

Krueger: It is my understanding there are two known 1907 proof pesos. ... This may be the only one in private hands. I stand to be corrected, but I believe the other is in the Philippine Central Bank museum ,... Collecting USPI since 1975 ...

Wondercoin: Krueger. They are each unique I believe made with different metal compositions.

Pruebas: Correct. One of them is 800 fine and the other is 900 fine. I forget which is impounded in the museum, but yes, the other is there. They both are technically patterns.

This is very interesting. I did not know these details about Proof 1907 Pesos.

Pruebas: I do seem to remember an 1894-S 10c that Laurie flew transcon with it in her pocket. Or maybe I got that one mixed up too.

Wondercoin: Purebas... Yes, you got that wrong as well. We sold the coin to JF, who flew it home in his top pocket.

Well, not exactly, IIRC. In 2007, JF flew, with this 1894-S dime, from the SF area to the NY area where JF sold the finest known 1894-S dime to JA who then placed this coin with a client. After 2013, it was purchased by a collector on the East Coast, who owned it for just a while. That collector, who wishes to remain anonymous, consigned it to the 01/16 FUN Platinum Night event.

Condition Ranking of 1894-S Dimes, with Recent Histories

wondercoin

Analyst... In 2007, JF met me at my safe deposit box in Oakland where I (As agent for JHF) sold JF (As agent for JA) the finest known 1894-S dime. He paid for it and flew back East with the dime in his pocket. I have no doubt you have correctly discussed what happened with the dime from there. I was a little surprised the coin did not break the $2M mark at that Heritage sale. How about you?

In any event, whether my USPI post was OK or inappropriate, one thing for certain, I won't do it again! And, not because the coins will be sold next month. Indeed, the coins will likely take a year or two to sell off from here. But, my intention was not to upset anyone at all. I truly wanted to give "heads up" on a landmark USPI collection (the likes of which having never been seen as far as I know) coming, in part, to eBay.

Wondercoin.

bidask

Wondercoin,

Your posts on the darkside are very infrequent.

This makes me suspicious that your OP was self promoting.

wondercoin

Bidask.. And, the funny thing is I don't even consider the USPI coins to be dark side coins. Wondercoin.

Jackthecat1

Originally posted by: wondercoin

And, the funny thing is I don't even consider the USPI coins to be dark side coins.

Yeah, they do have the words 'United States of America' on them.

Analyst

WonderCoin: I have no doubt you have correctly discussed what happened with the dime from there.

I also have no doubt.

WonderCoin: I was a little surprised the coin did not break the $2M mark at that Heritage sale. How about you?

If this coin had been in one of the Jan. 2013, 2014 or 2015 Platinum Night events, the probability of it selling more for than $2m would have been much higher. Indeed, there is a good chance that it would have in 2013 or 2014. I really believe that markets for rare U.S. coins began to slide in August 2015. So, the result in Jan. 2016 was not weak, given current market conditions. Markets for rare U.S. coins tend are cyclical.

Coin Market Realities & U.S. Gold Coins in January 2016 FUN Platinum Night Coin Auction

WonderCoin: In any event, whether my USPI post was OK or inappropriate, one thing for certain, I won't do it again! And, not because the coins will be sold next month.

Above, I did not say that it was appropriate or inappropriate. I did say is that there should be a logical avenue for a compromise. The importance and depth of the JHF Collection of USPI coins could have been emphasized without mentioning Justin's name ten times, literally, and his E-Bay handle. Although I am not easily irritated, it is apparent that more than a few members are upset about it, while others really want as much information as can be provided about the offerings of this collection. So, as I said, I was suggesting a form of compromise, for present discussion and future reference.

WonderCoin: And, the funny thing is I don't even consider the USPI coins to be dark side coins.

May we please end the habit of referring to world coins as being part of or in "the dark side." This Star Wars analogy is inaccurate and a bit too negative. Perhaps, "the undiscovered territory" or "the civilizations beyond" would be more appropriate references for world coins.

JackTheCat: they do have the words 'United States of America' on them.

Indeed, according to the terms of the Treaty of Paris in 1998, the U.S. paid Spain US$20 million for the Philippines, a good deal. If the U.S. had not prevailed in the Spanish-American war, the price, undoubtedly, would have been a lot higher, if an offer would then even be considered. During the 1940s, the U.S. liberated the Philippines from a rather brutal occupation by Imperial Japan.