Are the prices of 1986-87 Fleer Jordans and wax justified?

jsanz

So I watch the 1986-87 Fleer basketball from time to time and I read about it all the time on here. I am not an expert but maybe some experts can chime in. I decided to start this thread because of all the chatter about how many high grade Jordans were at the National. I also decided to start this thread because I see a box in every Collect auction and they seem to get a lot of product from Larry Fritsch Cards. We all know the Jordans are not rare. What if LFC has a stash of wax cases? Are those not as rare as we all think? LFC is still slowly releasing boxes from the 1970s. If there are cases hiding out there then the supply of wax and Jordans could potentially go up or at least stay stable, holding prices down, which is good or bad depending on your situation. This stuff is from the 1980's when people were starting to hoard and invest in cards. Just some of my crazy thoughts.

jackstraw

It wouldn't surprise me if he did.

coinspacks

Since bbce is the only true wax box authenticator.......if Steve hart authenticated a ton of fritsch 1986 wax boxes...I don't think his buy price would be as high.

handyman

Interesting thought about F. I have no clue but Id hope/guess he might have some. He did have a good suply of 1987 and 1988 Fleer Bks in his magazines for several years in a row.
I do not ever recall him selling 1986s though.

craig44

It wouldn't surprise me if there were a few stashes of 86 cases out there. Some old time collectors who aren't keen on the internet.

travis t

Because they're locked in a closet with the cases.

MrNearMint

I've actually been thinking about this recently as well. I am with my fellow conspiracy theorists, I think there's a Wherehouse somewhere full of all 80's unopened stuff including 86 b-ball.

Tangalang

There was a 86 Fleer Basketball Case over two year ago on ebay but it was opened! Think he was asking $300k!

jmmiller777

So back in the day, this stuff was hard to find. Only two times did I find whole boxes. I used to search 2-3 times a day at drug stores, toy stores, and big department stores. Even baseball boxes were tuff to find. They made millions and yet they were hard to find. Now its all coming out.

mintonlypls

Back in the day while in graduate school at Florida State...there were multiple wax boxes of 1986 Fleer basketball at all the checkouts where I bought baseball cards. It seemed nobody wanted them then. They were not flying off the shelves. Probably...the boxes could be had for 1/2 price. It pains me to think about the missed opportunity.

ChiefsFan1st

Its been a day or two since I was on here (howdy to those few old timers that still remember me!)

For the newer crowd around today, 80's football is my thing. So I really dont have a feel for this. But it reminded me of this thread

https://forums.collectors.com/messageview.aspx?catid=11&threadid=911934&highlight_key=y&keyword1=1986+fleer

Im in the crowd that thinks the actual number of unopened cases is probably 10 or less. But thats just based off 2 things

1. In the thread I linked, Reed mentioned the $1000 offer just to see one. (Maybe they have since then, dont know). I would think somebody that has 1 of these would of at some point said "sure, look at my case, gimme the free money."

2. Human nature. I think that a person that would have a case like this that was wealthy enough to have no use for $1K free money would still have an ego that would demand that everybody know he/she has the item. Bragging rights if you will.

I could be clear off base in my line of thinking

My personal thoughts on the graded Jordan is sure would love to have maybe a nice PSA8. Definitely would like to have 1 simply because he was almost bigger than life in my youth. I bet a lot of folks have that line of thinking. But when the rubber hits the road, I am gonna spend my extra pennies on my first love. Mine happens to be football.

Awesome topic. I will have to check in over the weekend to see how much of this is old news now.

Edit: Holy cow, its been long enough I have forgot how to post a link. Hope this fixes it

seebelow

lets say i have a 7 figure collection and a salary to support it....i personally wouldn't take the time to "prove" i have a case for a "measly" 1k....in addition to telegraphing it to the world...but thats just my thinking....those guys spend mid 3 figures on dinner and their portfolio fluctuates daily 5 figures...



that said, the current price of a wax box may come down and got ahead of itself, short-term...as the psa 10s coming back to the high 20s from mid to high 30s (in general) ...as are some highly valued RC's....the 9s corrected briefly and will probably continue their climb.



but overall, I'm bullish longterm for 86 jordans....he's this 2 or 3 generations mantle

craig44

Even if you managed to pull 2 psa 10 Jordan's from the box (highly unlikely) you would still have to pull some quality cards just to break even. I don't think the cards in the packs are worth the price for a box.

Tangalang

I agree that as far as ripping...not the best idea unless one hit a Jordan on the first try! I thought $700+ for the 86' Fleer Basketball Pack was high and now they are going for over a thousand!

JJCTHE1

While it would be so much fun to rip a box of 86-87 fleet, the packs and boxes are definitely over priced if you plan to open them. However buying them to sit on it wouldn't be a bad idea. Although I don't collect unopened wax because quite frankly it takes up too much room and I would probably open it.

ThoseBackPages

Best NBA Player and most iconic NBA card of all time.

RipublicaninMass

Back in the day=before the internet

dmurphy3mvp

1. In the thread I linked, Reed mentioned the $1000 offer just to see one. (Maybe they have since then, dont know). I would think somebody that has 1 of these would of at some point said "sure, look at my case, gimme the free money."

Actually, Steve and I would pay $1000 cash EACH to see a sealed case. Simply put, a case doesn't exist. Too many opportunities to take your profits over the last thirty years to believe than anyone is still sitting on one. Given the price of a box has increased five or six fold in the past few years, you can't honestly tell me one wouldn't have surfaced by now. Think about all the amazing items that have been brought to market by auction houses - items that are truly one of a kind - yet no 86 Fleer BK case. And misplacing a case in a warehouse for all these years - yes, it is possible - but given the timeline of this particular product, it's just not possible. Trust me, I want to believe that a case still exists! But it doesn't. There's a better chance of a 52T Baseball box surfacing. A 48B Basketball box. A 65T Football tall boy box.

I'll pay my own way to see the case. It doesn't even have to be for sale; I just want to see a sealed case with my own two eyes and take a pic of it. I will be sworn to secrecy and not divulge anything about the owner - name, location, occupation, etc. - and promise never to contact the seller regarding the case for the rest of my life.

VictorLaszlo

Originally posted by: mintonlypls

Back in the day while in graduate school at Florida State...there were multiple wax boxes of 1986 Fleer basketball at all the checkouts where I bought baseball cards. It seemed nobody wanted them then. They were not flying off the shelves. Probably...the boxes could be had for 1/2 price. It pains me to think about the missed opportunity.

Same. Available everywhere, plenty of boxes, in my area(N.C./S.C.). Even late into 1987 / early 1988 they could be found easily.

jsanz

Only time will tell but I still keep hoping. There are so many great finds that pop up. I have a feeling it will happen some day. Maybe the unopened product really is rare. I guess since I started collecting around that time I find it hard to believe anything from the mid 80's is rare

ifyoucanthinkofit

Originally posted by: jsanz

Only time will tell but I still keep hoping. There are so many great finds that pop up. I have a feeling it will happen some day. Maybe the unopened product really is rare. I guess since I started collecting around that time I find it hard to believe anything from the mid 80's is rare

I think some of it is regional. Where I grew up I never saw any football, basketball, or hockey at all until 1989 or 1990. Before that it was all baseball everywhere.

ndleo

If there is a 1986 Fleer BKB case available, I would guess it resides with an old coin dealer. When the hobby started to grow in the mid-1980's a lot of coin dealers got into the baseball card business. In fact a lot of the early shops I visited were coin dealers with a case of baseball cards and boxes.

I went to a couple of coin stores a few years ago when I was looking at American Eagles and hit on couple of partial rack cases of 1981-1985 baseball and 1981-1987 Football Wax (no 1984). And Yes, he did not spend time researching sports cards on the internet. The prices weren't cheap by any means, he still had the mid-1980's mindset, but they were less than the going rate and very clean. The rack boxes I got had many stars on top.

jsanz

Good point about coin dealers. I remember that. Some of them were reluctantly getting into cards as demand grew.

I have seen a few posts here about finding old unopened product at old card shops and the owners were not too keen on current prices.

hyperchipper09

Originally posted by: VictorLaszlo

Originally posted by: mintonlypls
Back in the day while in graduate school at Florida State...there were multiple wax boxes of 1986 Fleer basketball at all the checkouts where I bought baseball cards. It seemed nobody wanted them then. They were not flying off the shelves. Probably...the boxes could be had for 1/2 price. It pains me to think about the missed opportunity.

Same. Available everywhere, plenty of boxes, in my area(N.C./S.C.). Even late into 1987 / early 1988 they could be found easily.

Where in N.C.? Likely not the place but in the northwest part, ashe county in a little spot in the road called Helton there was an older guy who owned a service station / convenience store. Sullivan's store was the name I believe, who had a case of 86/87 fleer basketball as late as Oct 1990 in plain site. Rather easy to recall for me as I lived in that area, went to App State from 88-90 before moving. The old guy who owned the store passed away 2 years ago. Myself, I'd be curious to know what happened to that case over the years. Anyone know when the MJ rookie really started to take off?

gregmo32

Basketball picked up speed in 1990. Jordan 1986 Fleer jumped from a couple bucks to $40 to $100 within a few months.

seebelow

Originally posted by: gregmo32

Basketball picked up speed in 1990. Jordan 1986 Fleer jumped from a couple bucks to $40 to $100 within a few months.

Interesting. do you know what happened during that time? I'm sure it was during the season.

ifyoucanthinkofit

Originally posted by: seebelow

Originally posted by: gregmo32

Basketball picked up speed in 1990. Jordan 1986 Fleer jumped from a couple bucks to $40 to $100 within a few months.

Interesting. do you know what happened during that time? I'm sure it was during the season.

Beckett started a basketball price guide around that time.