, you know what you think you know from on here based on me speaking my mind.
I think that's all any of us need to know. LOL. Happy Independence Day.
And that enables you to know something like where I have ever traveled, beyond doubt as you claim to be able to? Nice train of thought there buddy, tells me alot about you actually.
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
On topic, the silence that has occured since I made the comment that ASE's have ruined any chance for Spot bullion to be at any level near what it's actually worth speaks volumes.
I have something to add for everyones consideration. ASE's are the worst thing to ever happen to bullion, meaning the value of bullion.
I disagree, and I'll explain why below.
Sure, if they'd never existed we would have had alot more generic Merry Christmas rounds and like items made than there already is, but they would be considered bullion, never knowing the mintage of them, therefore no one would know if silver is oversupplied as you say.
I don't know that there is a market pricing relationship based mainly upon the number of generic rounds vs. official "coins" in terms of mintages. How would we know? It's all hypothetical.
Something about having the denomination of $1 and a mintage figure attached to it makes people think of it as a coin rather than what it really is, a 1 oz piece of silver...therefore, a "coin" can only be worth so much because of its mintage. That holds back the value of what it really is, a 1 oz of silver.
ASE's keep mintage statistics, and THAT killed the chance at bullion/precious metal (particularly Silver) being valued more realistically.
I don't understand why you think that having an official mintage number limits the price. Why then is there a premium attached to ASEs, instead of a discount?
Also,
Going back to the late 1970's and early 1980's there was a premium attached to bags of silver dollars and no premium for fractional 90% silver. I conclude that people found Silver Dollars more desirable than fractional 90% silver. Why? I could guess, but the reason doesn't matter as much as the fact that they simply liked Silver Dollars better and were willing to pay a premium. Does that mean that Silver Dollars were holding back the value or price of silver? I don't think so. It didn't keep silver from climbing all the way to $50 in 1980.
I also think that the same analogy applies to generic silver rounds vs. ASEs today. Apparently more people simply like ASEs better than generic silver rounds and are willing to pay up for them. That fact didn't keep silver from climbing to $49 in 2011.
I think that premiums are only a matter of personal preference. They also fluctuate with the market and I don't believe the lack of premiums on generic silver rounds or the premiums on ASEs affect the demand, or the base price of the metal - see those examples I gave above. Explain why you think otherwise, and maybe give an example.
More than anything else, I think that premiums fluctuate when there is market volatility. That's just my own personal opinion, but I don't have a statistical proof handy in my back pocket. Sometimes, I just wing it.
Valid points to consider...I have stated my thoughts, don't feel a need to elaborate as it's pretty clear we're on different ends of the thinking spectrum on this.
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Going back to the late 1970's and early 1980's there was a premium attached to bags of silver dollars and no premium for fractional 90% silver. I conclude that people found Silver Dollars more desirable than fractional 90% silver. Why? I could guess, but the reason doesn't matter as much as the fact that they simply liked Silver Dollars better and were willing to pay a premium. Does that mean that Silver Dollars were holding back the value or price of silver? I don't think so. It didn't keep silver from climbing all the way to $50 in 1980.
I also think that the same analogy applies to generic silver rounds vs. ASEs today. Apparently more people simply like ASEs better than generic silver rounds and are willing to pay up for them. That fact didn't keep silver from climbing to $49 in 2011.
I think that premiums are only a matter of personal preference. They also fluctuate with the market and I don't believe the lack of premiums on generic silver rounds or the premiums on ASEs affect the demand, or the base price of the metal - see those examples I gave above. Explain why you think otherwise, and maybe give an example.
The "premium" is, in reality, Numismatic Premium.
I like my silver best when it's .8925, and in a form about 200 years old, and pay high premiums for it.
Other forms, lesser premium, some forms I don't want at all.
there's a whole spectrum of higher and lower percentages vs "spot"
ASEs and Morgans are more "neato" than bags of worn silver roosies and washingtons, which are in turn more "neato" than broken sterling jewelry and picture frames.
There's no reason to think that the level of numismatic premium for any specific form of silver would drive the underlying spot price of the metal itself
the premium is in physical. Numismatic (or collectible demand for non-coins) premium can add to or subtract from that depending on the coin.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Right now it seems that the silver market to the public is oversupplied. The Mint's production of silver eagles in June was well under 3 million @ 2,837,500 coins where the usual production has been in excess of 4 million coins for quite a long time.
Right now it seems that the silver market to the public is oversupplied. The Mint's production of silver eagles in June was well under 3 million @ 2,837,500 coins where the usual production has been in excess of 4 million coins for quite a long time.
What is the reason for such oversupply?
Range-bound prices for years followed by a run up in prices over the last 90 days IMO.
The bullion eagles are produced in vast quantities for sure whereas the"W" mintmark are very minuscule by comparison and therefore hold their value very well.
Comments
, you know what you think you know from on here based on me speaking my mind.
I think that's all any of us need to know. LOL. Happy Independence Day.
And that enables you to know something like where I have ever traveled, beyond doubt as you claim to be able to? Nice train of thought there buddy, tells me alot about you actually.
I'll take a stab at it, to wit:
On topic, the silence that has occured since I made the comment that ASE's have ruined any chance for Spot bullion to be at any level near what it's actually worth speaks volumes.
I have something to add for everyones consideration. ASE's are the worst thing to ever happen to bullion, meaning the value of bullion.
I disagree, and I'll explain why below.
Sure, if they'd never existed we would have had alot more generic Merry Christmas rounds and like items made than there already is, but they would be considered bullion, never knowing the mintage of them, therefore no one would know if silver is oversupplied as you say.
I don't know that there is a market pricing relationship based mainly upon the number of generic rounds vs. official "coins" in terms of mintages. How would we know? It's all hypothetical.
Something about having the denomination of $1 and a mintage figure attached to it makes people think of it as a coin rather than what it really is, a 1 oz piece of silver...therefore, a "coin" can only be worth so much because of its mintage. That holds back the value of what it really is, a 1 oz of silver.
ASE's keep mintage statistics, and THAT killed the chance at bullion/precious metal (particularly Silver) being valued more realistically.
I don't understand why you think that having an official mintage number limits the price. Why then is there a premium attached to ASEs, instead of a discount?
Also,
Going back to the late 1970's and early 1980's there was a premium attached to bags of silver dollars and no premium for fractional 90% silver. I conclude that people found Silver Dollars more desirable than fractional 90% silver. Why? I could guess, but the reason doesn't matter as much as the fact that they simply liked Silver Dollars better and were willing to pay a premium. Does that mean that Silver Dollars were holding back the value or price of silver? I don't think so. It didn't keep silver from climbing all the way to $50 in 1980.
I also think that the same analogy applies to generic silver rounds vs. ASEs today. Apparently more people simply like ASEs better than generic silver rounds and are willing to pay up for them. That fact didn't keep silver from climbing to $49 in 2011.
I think that premiums are only a matter of personal preference. They also fluctuate with the market and I don't believe the lack of premiums on generic silver rounds or the premiums on ASEs affect the demand, or the base price of the metal - see those examples I gave above. Explain why you think otherwise, and maybe give an example.
More than anything else, I think that premiums fluctuate when there is market volatility. That's just my own personal opinion, but I don't have a statistical proof handy in my back pocket. Sometimes, I just wing it.
Valid points to consider...I have stated my thoughts, don't feel a need to elaborate as it's pretty clear we're on different ends of the thinking spectrum on this.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Going back to the late 1970's and early 1980's there was a premium attached to bags of silver dollars and no premium for fractional 90% silver. I conclude that people found Silver Dollars more desirable than fractional 90% silver. Why? I could guess, but the reason doesn't matter as much as the fact that they simply liked Silver Dollars better and were willing to pay a premium. Does that mean that Silver Dollars were holding back the value or price of silver? I don't think so. It didn't keep silver from climbing all the way to $50 in 1980.
I also think that the same analogy applies to generic silver rounds vs. ASEs today. Apparently more people simply like ASEs better than generic silver rounds and are willing to pay up for them. That fact didn't keep silver from climbing to $49 in 2011.
I think that premiums are only a matter of personal preference. They also fluctuate with the market and I don't believe the lack of premiums on generic silver rounds or the premiums on ASEs affect the demand, or the base price of the metal - see those examples I gave above. Explain why you think otherwise, and maybe give an example.
The "premium" is, in reality, Numismatic Premium.
I like my silver best when it's .8925, and in a form about 200 years old, and pay high premiums for it.
Other forms, lesser premium, some forms I don't want at all.
there's a whole spectrum of higher and lower percentages vs "spot"
ASEs and Morgans are more "neato" than bags of worn silver roosies and washingtons, which are in turn more "neato" than broken sterling jewelry and picture frames.
There's no reason to think that the level of numismatic premium for any specific form of silver would drive the underlying spot price of the metal itself
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Right now it seems that the silver market to the public is oversupplied. The Mint's production of silver eagles in June was well under 3 million @ 2,837,500 coins where the usual production has been in excess of 4 million coins for quite a long time.
What is the reason for such oversupply?
Right now it seems that the silver market to the public is oversupplied. The Mint's production of silver eagles in June was well under 3 million @ 2,837,500 coins where the usual production has been in excess of 4 million coins for quite a long time.
What is the reason for such oversupply?
Range-bound prices for years followed by a run up in prices over the last 90 days IMO.