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Ultra rare VAMs

TiborTibor Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭✭✭
One of the threads earlier today dealt with the "Scar Face" 1888-o Morgan
dollar. One respondent, "coindeuce", said that most VAMs "are adrift at sea
right now". There are many experts here at the forum regarding VAMs. What
are the "Top 20" to try to collect. Thank you for your input.

Comments

  • DollarAfterDollarDollarAfterDollar Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Paging Messydesk.......
    If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.
  • Wabbit2313Wabbit2313 Posts: 7,268 ✭✭✭✭✭

    They are mostly dead in the water from what I see. In fact, some Morgans with VAM info on the label will sell for significantly less than without, it seems.
  • cmerlo1cmerlo1 Posts: 7,890 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I've never seen a formal one, but much of the list would change from time to time. I think the problem is that once VAMs get added to a list (Top 100, Hit List 40, etc.) people start looking for them and many that were once thought to be rare aren't any more.
    You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
  • coindeucecoindeuce Posts: 13,471 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: Tibor

    One of the threads earlier today dealt with the "Scar Face" 1888-o Morgan

    dollar. One respondent, "coindeuce", said that most VAMs "are adrift at sea

    right now". There are many experts here at the forum regarding VAMs. What

    are the "Top 20" to try to collect. Thank you for your input.




    I'll try to elaborate on my earlier point:



    In the past year, two of the more long time active and engaged specialty dealers in the VAM market have left the market. One passed away, another simply chose to step away. The most aggressive and presumably the wealthiest VAM collector ever also passed away. Despite a steadily growing base of collectors and dealers of VAMs since the TOP 100 was promoted in 1996, these events have had a conspicuous effect on the trend in the market. Certainly the lingering effect of the economic crisis of 2008 hasn't helped one bit either. It is a multi-faceted issue that goes far beyond these points, but I'm not inclined to labor over them. After all, I own a significant number of ultra rarities that I don't plan on leaving to disinterested heirs. I'm not desperate to place any of these presently, but I'm not exactly encouraged by the current trend. YMMV.

    "Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
    http://www.americanlegacycoins.com

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 19,617 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: Tibor

    One of the threads earlier today dealt with the "Scar Face" 1888-o Morgan

    dollar. One respondent, "coindeuce", said that most VAMs "are adrift at sea

    right now". There are many experts here at the forum regarding VAMs. What

    are the "Top 20" to try to collect. Thank you for your input.


    As with collecting anything, the rule is to collect what you like. Rather than come up with a Top 20 to collect, I'll point you to the Top 100, Hot 50, Hit List 40, and even the 1878 8TF lists. You can see these on VAMWorld or in the PCGS registry. Many of these are rarities, many are just interesting. Currently, for a VAM to have a strong premium, it needs to be rare and high grade. While the VAM market overall is "adrift," the high end of popular coins is still strong. One reason for this is that there are probably as many ways to collect VAMs as there are people collecting them. Another is that many people like the thrill of finding them in the wild.



    There is currently quite the hullabaloo, and rightly so, about the recent completion of a bust half set by Overton number. The parallel to this in Morgan dollar VAMs is probably something like a complete 1878 set. Three mints, something like 391 different VAMs (including cataloged die stages). There are people working on this. Two complete 1878-CC sets have been registered, but no complete sets for P and S, although some people are sort of close.



    I probably didn't answer your question, but hopefully I gave you some food for thought.



  • clarkbar04clarkbar04 Posts: 4,922 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1889 Vam 23A has to be up there close.
    MS66 taste on an MS63 budget.
  • TONEDDOLLARSTONEDDOLLARS Posts: 2,928 ✭✭✭✭
    1878. Vam-44 tripled flower blossoms
  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 19,617 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Others that will bring big bucks: Any of the really rare 8TFs in high grade (in some cases, XF is a high grade) -- 14.5 through 14.20 (not so much 14.10), O-mint clashed E reverses in mint state, any cud, 1898-O VAM 20, 78-S B1 reverse ("Long nock") in AU and higher, high grade Red Book VAMs, high grade 99-O Micro O, 88-O Oval O, 03-S Micro S.
  • cheezhedcheezhed Posts: 5,667 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Scarface.

    Many happy BST transactions
  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 22,713 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There is not a simple answer or list that can be provided-

    Consider the following:

    Rarity
    Condition Rarity
    Demand

    VAMS are interesting-especially to the Morgan Dollar experts. However, a VAM needs to have appeal- something that can be seen with a naked eye and is significant. And it is that is the selling point more than rariy. Some examples- 1888-o Hot Lips, 1901 Shifted Eagle, and the 1903-s micro s. Out of the three, the 1903-s micro s is the most difficult to obtain-especially in a reasonable grade such as EF40 or higher. I rate the shifted Eagle as more difficult than the Hot Lips in higher grades. I started with these as examples because you can see the variety with a naked eye and it is significant. These are the type VAMS that will have interest even though 2 of the three really are not that rare. But the demand for these three will always be significant.

    I owned the finest graded 1879-0 VAM 4. And while I still see this as significant, it truly is rare in MS. However, the demand was not quite what one would expect. My point is rarity does not mean that there is demand for it. Most VAMS need to have a wow factor-

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

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