Big Joe from Brazil - Portugal Gold 12,800 Reis 1732 Minas Gerais

WillieBoyd2

Portugal Brazil 12,800 Reis 1732-M (Minas Gerais)

Obverse: King João (John) V laureate head right, IOANNES V DG PORT ET ALG REX
Reverse: Portugal arms on crowned ornate shield

Gold, 38mm, 28.58gm, AGW 0.8424oz (actual gold weight in troy ounces)

These large coins were called "Dobras", made in Brazil from 1727 to 1733, and had a value close to the Spanish eight Escudo coin or "Doubloon".

They were known in the American colonies and other places as "Joes" from Johannes, the name of the king in Latin. They were mentioned in almanacs of the period and US Continental Congress foreign coin valuations, and were also a favorite of pirates.

This one was minted in the mining town of Vila Rica (Rich Village), now known as Ouro Preto (Black Gold), in the state of Minas Gerais (General Mines) which was the gold mining region north of Rio de Janeiro. The Vila Rica mint operated only from 1724 to 1734.

The large coins were made to keep up with the gold being produced in the Brazilian mining area Likewise, the United States started making twenty-dollar gold coins in 1849 to handle the gold produced in California.

These coins were twice the size of the more common Portugal Brazil 6,400 reis coins known as "Half Joes", one of the most circulated gold coins of early America.

Random notes:

I visited Ouro Preto in 1981, the place where my coin was made.


Ouro Preto, Brazil

And this coincidence:
The United States 2016 Centennial gold coin (Mercury Dime, Standing Liberty Quarter, Walking Liberty Half Dollar) AGW weights of 1/10, 1/4, and 1/2 oz. add up to 0.85 oz, close to the AGW weight of the Joe.

lordmarcovan

WOW.



How long have you had that one?



I love the subtle "orange peel" toning.

lordmarcovan

Had to come back for another look. Big gold coins are impressive.



What's more impressive than that?



Big gold coins from the Colonial era that are loaded with history- that's what!



And with nice toning to boot.



OK, so maybe João V wasn't the handsomest fella who ever lived. You can say that about a lot of 18th century rulers. But I do love 18th century coins. And so here we the see what the "joes" and "half-joes" our American founding fathers spoke of and spent were all about. (Interesting that João = John. I did not know that. I speak Spanish but not Portuguese. They're very similar in many ways but just different enough to be confusing sometimes. The "IOANNES" should have given it away, but I guess I got caught up in the Joe = Joseph fallacy.)



Thanks for posting this and the information, WB2. I was always envious of your membership in the "Aureus Owner's Club" but I must say this coin has me equally jealous.



PS- to avoid future confusion, our Founding Fathers should've called them "Johns" and "half-Johns", perhaps.



One of my detecting buddies came back from one of our coastal Georgia plantation sites with a large copper coin he wanted identified. It was one of those Brazilian 40-reis pieces from the early 1800s with a counterstamp. A startling find, I thought initially, but I shouldn't have been surprised, having myself dug 18th century coins of French Cayenne, an Irish Hibernia halfpenny, and a Mexico City 2-reales piece all within a few feet of each other on the same site in the same day. (That was one of my more interesting days of digging!) I tend to forget the role of Portuguese and Brazilian coins had in our colonial commerce, for some reason.

WillieBoyd2

Spanish Doubloon of Ferdinand VI at roughly the same time:


Spanish America 8 Escudos "Doubloon" 1749, Mexico City Mint

Obverse: Bust of Ferdinand VI facing right / FERDND VI D G HISPAN ET IND REX 1749
Reverse: Crowned shield of Spain / NOMINA MAGNA SEQUOR / 8 S / Mo MF
Gold, 36.5mm x 35.5mm, 26.98gm

Who's better looking?

pmac

I did some quick glances at various central and South American 8 Escudo pieces and found their average AGW to be about .7757oz or about 92% of the Brazilian 12,800 Reis piece of yours. Interesting the Spanish middle of the road 8 Escudo of the same era has an AGW of .7981oz. A double eagle has 30.06g. or .886 AGW making the Brasilian 97% of the double eagle (I'm not too sure about my math here) .