I know we have discussed this before, do die striations/ polish lines lower a coins grade?
bolivarshagnasty
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Anyone discussed this with a PCGS representative or know first hand how striations are viewed when grading?
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8 Reales Madness Collection
Planchet striations should not hold back a coins grade. What will hold back the grade a bit if it's a higher graded UNC is the weak strike. Typically planchet striations are only visible on coins with weaker strikes.
Die striations/ polish lines are in the die, not the planchet. The opposite is closer to true - the stronger the strike the more likely striations/polish lines may visible. Moreover, the newer the die (or the newer the lapping), the more likely die lines are evident.
Some finest known, early die state coins can exhibit an abundance of lines. I can't recall a coin that has been knocked back in grade because of it.
Because I think some die polish on some pieces is very cool. On others, like the overly die-polished UHRs, I think it's a distraction.
--Severian the Lame
Lance.
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
Excessive clash marks often result in a grade lower as well. Choice/gem 1853 with arrow half dimes have a tougher time making the grade when they littered with clashes. The dimes too but less so.
I've seen choice and/or gem MS No Motto halves sometimes held back because of excessive field die striations/polish lines. I can only assume that at times the graders see them as a distraction since a perfectly clean field is much more pleasing to the eye. While it may not be the norm, I have no doubt it happens. On some I was pretty sure on a few occasions they saw lighter die striations as cleaning lines. And on superb NM halves that are essentially at the MS67 level, could get kicked down because of such a few minor mint made distractions.
Excessive clash marks often result in a grade lower as well. Choice/gem 1853 with arrow half dimes have a tougher time making the grade when they littered with clashes. The dimes too but less so.
I also thought that maybe the die scratches were mistaken for hairlines, which would then limit the grade.
Planchet striations should not hold back a coins grade. What will hold back the grade a bit if it's a higher graded UNC is the weak strike. Typically planchet striations are only visible on coins with weaker strikes.
Die striations/ polish lines are in the die, not the planchet. The opposite is closer to true - the stronger the strike the more likely striations/polish lines may visible. Moreover, the newer the die (or the newer the lapping), the more likely die lines are evident.
Some finest known, early die state coins can exhibit an abundance of lines. I can't recall a coin that has been knocked back in grade because of it.
I do not believe that "striations" are on the die but do believe that they are on the planchet.
You cannot say with all honesty that these lines are on the die:
They flow evenly across all devices including the rim which indicates a planchet problem. This is validated by the fact that the lines also exist on the reverse and run in exactly the same direction.
These striations also exist on quite a few ultra High Grade 1972-D Eisenhower Dollars.
Note that the lines are at different angles on the above two coins which indicates, again, that they are not on the die but the planchet.
Of course, folks could be referring to other types of die anomolies such as deep abrading lines which, obviously, occur on the die but generally speaking, when "striations" are being referred to, they are across the entire coin.
Edited to add: These striations do not appear to be grade limiting. If anything at all, they could add to the cartwheel luster and actually boost the coin by a point.
The name is LEE!
This 1959 Lincoln received a 66RB.
Those are not what I consider striations since they are obvious die poliching lines.
The name is LEE!
Those are not what I consider striations since they are obvious die poliching lines.
You are right, these aren't what I would consider striations either. However since the OP also asks about polish lines potentially lowering a coin's grade, I felt these pics were appropriate.
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
To my reading, the OP seems to have clearly asked about die polishing lines, yet some of you keep talking about planchet problems with metal mixture, etc. A discussion of this sort can't occur efficiently unless we agree on a shared vocabulary to discuss the matter.
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And then there's this coin - graded 66 with obvious striations
Maybe I have caused the confusion. I thought the term striation indicated a raised line on the finished coin. If this is not the case, please help me understand the difference between a striation and a die polished line which would also be a raised line due to the scratch in the die.
You used striation/die polish line interchangeably, which many folks do. A couple of folks didn't read your question close enough, or think that there is only one use of the term "striation", which is different than yours.
"Striation" is also a term used for describing incuse marks on a planchet, often times caused by rolling bars during planchet production. "Striation" can also describe incuse lines found as a result of excessive polishing of blanks to impart mirrorlike surfaces on proof coins, and sometimes but rarely on business strikes.
Hope that helps.
Maybe I have caused the confusion. I thought the term striation indicated a raised line on the finished coin. If this is not the case, please help me understand the difference between a striation and a die polished line which would also be a raised line due to the scratch in the die.
No confusion; This is what I was taught.
Die polish is raised on a coin because the polishing is done to the die causing minute scratches into its surface.
Hub polish is incuse on the coin because it was raised on the die.
Striations are basically parallel. This term is used in many fields of science. In numismatics I was taught they can describe both raised and incuse marks. I like to use the term especially for the raised parallel marks we encounter on a coin; however, some consider adjustment marks and roller marks to also be "striations" that have a distinctive look and name. l will call a patch of adjustment marks striations myself and not worry about it.
The Ike dollar is a perfect example of a coin with striations. I would like to see a blow uo of the 1893 Indian as I have never seen "very fine"die polish like this on an Indian cent. The Lincoln is a beautiful example of a coin struck with a heavily polished die.