Does BBCE keep track of certified boxes?

seebelow

As the title asks...In the jordan thread someone said how many PSA 10's there were and asked if anyone knew how many '86 fleer basketball boxes there are?



Great ? Does Steve keep track of how many 86 fleer boxes, or any/all boxes (rack, wax, cello) for all sports over all years that he has certified? I think that would be very valuable information. And support the legitimacy of the market. Just like TPG, PSA does with the pop report? Is the hologram serially numbered? That would be awesome.



Any guesses how many 86 fleer basketball boxes are out there? (frankenboxes or not)

grote15

There is no BBCE pop report. Steve has been authenticating boxes going back to the early 2000s, at least, which is when I started buying product from him. Back in those days, boxes were simply shrinkwrapped in clear plastic wrap with a gold business card underneath the wrap. Up until a few years ago, BBCE certified boxes were available only via direct purchase from BBCE.

slum22

Tim would know better than I, but I don't think there's any way that Steve/BBCE has more than a general idea of how many boxes they have wrapped. As for 1986 Fleer boxes, I have heard that Steve will not wrap a 1986 Fleer BK box unless it adheres to the proper sequencing. I do not know it, but apparently 1986 Fleer has pretty consistent sequencing and people who know this sequence can tell which packs have a chance to contain a Jordan RC. If Steve sees that these packs are not included in the box at the expected rate he will not certify that box. So every BBCE box should yield on average 2-3 Jordan RCs.

Arsenal83

As for the 86 fleer boxes, I've seen Steve label some "Wax Box" and others "36 Unopened Wax Packs." I've also seen some newly wrapped ones with letters from Steve detailing the contents including a reference to the sequencing.

jay0791

How can u tell sequencing if yo don't open at least one pack?

So how do you tell these 'Packs" are n the box?

Can u c the card front or back thru the wax cover?

70ToppsFanatic

Steve does write additional letters for specific items that he has authenticated and knows the provenance of, but there is not
pop report of what has been authenticated, other than what he has done for PSA which ends up in the PSA pop report.

70ToppsFanatic

Originally posted by: jay0791
How can u tell sequencing if yo don't open at least one pack?

So how do you tell these 'Packs" are n the box?

Can u c the card front or back thru the wax cover?

Yes (see through wax). And I believe there are 3 packs with each "sticker" in a factory box except for 3 players (different in each box) where there are 4 stickers (11 stickers in the set, 3 packs with each sticker, 3 additional packs with #4 for each of 3 players).

Here's a link that provides some basic info on identifying legit boxes:

Legit_1986_Fleer_Boxes

rtimmer

Originally posted by: slum22
Tim would know better than I, but I don't think there's any way that Steve/BBCE has more than a general idea of how many boxes they have wrapped. As for 1986 Fleer boxes, I have heard that Steve will not wrap a 1986 Fleer BK box unless it adheres to the proper sequencing. I do not know it, but apparently 1986 Fleer has pretty consistent sequencing and people who know this sequence can tell which packs have a chance to contain a Jordan RC. If Steve sees that these packs are not included in the box at the expected rate he will not certify that box. So every BBCE box should yield on average 2-3 Jordan RCs.

I do not believe Steve can look at the packs and tell if the Jordan RC is in the pack/box or if it has been taken out. What he can do fairly easily is look to see if the 3 Jordan stickers are in the box so in authenticated boxes at least you know you will get atleast that. It would still be possible for a knowledgable person to take out all of the Jordan RC packs and replace those 3 packs with the appropriate showing back sticker packs and have BBCE authenticate it.

Now in saying that there is still some randomness in the sequencing and without going into too much detail I think it's improbably to go into a box and pull out all 3 Jordan RCs. So even a picked thru box probably still contains at least 1 Jordan RC.

thunderdan

Originally posted by: Arsenal83
As for the 86 fleer boxes, I've seen Steve label some "Wax Box" and others "36 Unopened Wax Packs." I've also seen some newly wrapped ones with letters from Steve detailing the contents including a reference to the sequencing.

36 Unopened Packs means that it is a pieced together box. Wax Box means it is a full box with the correct stickers (3 per player; 4 for 3 players).

Then he looks at color of wrappers (does the color tone match) and the seals to determine if this is a full original box.

If he thinks it is, he writes a letter stating his opinion with cert number that matches the cert sticker on the box.

I don't know if he writes letters for pieced together boxes, though I doubt it. I haven't seen one written in that regard. The only ones I've seen pertain to a whole box (i.e. Wax Box designation)

sportscardstop

I thought you could see through part of the front of the pack and see who is on top. Then you can follow the sequence from there.

thunderdan

Originally posted by: rtimmer

Originally posted by: slum22
I do not believe Steve can look at the packs and tell if the Jordan RC is in the pack/box or if it has been taken out. What he can do fairly easily is look to see if the 3 Jordan stickers are in the box so in authenticated boxes at least you know you will get atleast that. It would still be possible for a knowledgable person to take out all of the Jordan RC packs and replace those 3 packs with the appropriate showing back sticker packs and have BBCE authenticate it.

While technically true, this is why he also looks at color toning on the wrappers and location of seals to determine if all packs were part of the original box. That's about the best you can do to determine whether it's a full, original box IMHO.

ndleo

Great info about 1986 F BKB Boxes. Thanks to everyone