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What's going with this eBay auction

CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
I'm the high bidder and I just checked the cert number. The cert is no good. Could this be a fake?


Link

Comments

  • dcarrdcarr Posts: 8,968 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The font on the holder looks bad, as does the coin.
    By "bad", I mean fake.
  • kookoox10kookoox10 Posts: 538 ✭✭✭
    There's a lot suspicious about that label. It looks funny.
  • JeffersonFrogJeffersonFrog Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018 11:20AM
    ...

    If we were all the same, the world would be an incredibly boring place.

    Tommy

  • JeffersonFrogJeffersonFrog Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018 11:20AM
    ...

    If we were all the same, the world would be an incredibly boring place.

    Tommy

  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Concerning. I was hoping to get a steal here with bad pics. Coin looks like it could be nice. I sent seller a message but no answer yet.
  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Is it an error on the slab or a fake?
  • davewesendavewesen Posts: 6,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    yes, if you end up winning ask the seller to cancel auction because the slab is a fake and cert verification does not check out.
  • sparky64sparky64 Posts: 7,041 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It seems pretty strange that if you take away the last 5 in the cert, it comes up a MS 65 Bridgeport. image

    I don't like it.

    "If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"

    My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress

  • scubafuelscubafuel Posts: 1,925 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'd be willing to bet the coin and slab are fine and it's a PCGS database issue and bad pixellated pics. This just doesn't match the usual fake slab MO, IMO.

    Could be wrong though.
  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I got a good deal if it's real. I'm going to wait for the seller to respond before I jump to any conclusions. It's still very odd and concerning though.
  • LindeDadLindeDad Posts: 18,766 ✭✭✭✭✭
    They don't have cert. numbers that long.



    image



    8 digits at most never been any with 9.



    image
  • coindeucecoindeuce Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Every other PCGS coin that has been sold by this member since they joined eBay in January checks out just fine, and is reflected in their 100% feedback rating. Only unless you believe that this seller got unknowingly scammed when they acquired this coin, then why worry ?

    "Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
    http://www.american-legacy-coins.com

  • davewesendavewesen Posts: 6,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: coindeuce
    Every other PCGS coin that has been sold by this member since they joined eBay in January checks out just fine, and is reflected in their 100% feedback rating. Only unless you believe that this seller got unknowingly scammed when they acquired this coin, then why worry ?



    Heritage of 20667555
    http://coins.ha.com/itm/commem...?hdnJumpToLot=1x=0&y=0
  • lkeigwinlkeigwin Posts: 16,893 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Now it's okay to worry.

    Lance.
  • hiijackerhiijacker Posts: 1,172 ✭✭✭
    Well, he did have the decency to do it to a PT Barnum coin.
    There is a sucker born every minute...
    Buyer of all vintage Silver Bars. PM me
    Cashback from Mr. Rebates
  • ChrisH821ChrisH821 Posts: 6,657 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: davewesen

    Originally posted by: coindeuce

    Every other PCGS coin that has been sold by this member since they joined eBay in January checks out just fine, and is reflected in their 100% feedback rating. Only unless you believe that this seller got unknowingly scammed when they acquired this coin, then why worry ?






    Heritage of 20667555

    http://coins.ha.com/itm/commem...JumpToLot=1x=0&y=0




    Looks like the nail in the coffin to me.

    Collector, occasional seller

  • coindeucecoindeuce Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: davewesen

    Originally posted by: coindeuce

    Every other PCGS coin that has been sold by this member since they joined eBay in January checks out just fine, and is reflected in their 100% feedback rating. Only unless you believe that this seller got unknowingly scammed when they acquired this coin, then why worry ?






    Heritage of 20667555

    http://coins.ha.com/itm/commem...JumpToLot=1x=0&y=0




    Wouldn't be the first time someone removed a CAC sticker while in possession. Look at the stacking tabs on the front images the seller presents. They're a perfect match to PCGS holders with that generation of label. The coin in the images could not possibly be any less than MS-63, unless it is counterfeit. The spread for the Bridgeport from 63-65 is $110-$150. If you really believe that someone is desperate enough to do all the work to sub a 63 for a 65, then you're the kind that can't see the forest, 'cause the trees are in the way. Like I stated above: why worry? The OP has eBay buyer protection and perhaps even a second level of insulation if they used a CC with PayPal.



    "Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
    http://www.american-legacy-coins.com

  • ChrisH821ChrisH821 Posts: 6,657 ✭✭✭✭✭
    How does one explain the additional 5 in the cert #? Although the photos are terrible, it also appears that none of the marks on the Heritage coin are shown on the ebay one.

    Collector, occasional seller

  • coindeucecoindeuce Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: ChrisH821

    How does one explain the additional 5 in the cert #? Although the photos are terrible, it also appears that none of the marks on the Heritage coin are shown on the ebay one.




    If your reading comprehension is up to par, you would notice that the Heritage sale was 4 years ago. A lot can happen to a coin in a holder in 4 years. Even if you really think you can interpret the surfaces of the eBay coin from the images well enough to compare to 4 year old Heritage images, you should be a forensic analyst. image



    FWIW to the conspiracy theorists, the inserts in the newest generation of PCGS holder cannot be removed from the holder without damaging some of the anti-counterfeiting devices on the insert. The only plausible explanation for the wrong cert. number would be from a faulty photo edit, and the coin/label are both hijacked images superimposed over the rest of the holder image. As long as the OP has the proper buyer protections, WGAF ?

    "Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
    http://www.american-legacy-coins.com

  • ArizonaRareCoinsArizonaRareCoins Posts: 679 ✭✭✭✭
    UMMMMMM......This seller is selling coins in COUNTERFEIT PCGS Holders........Lots of PROOF here:

    Multiple COUNTERFEIT PCGS holdersfrom seller ahello2u23

    This is a newbie eBay crook that is probably just testing-out his scam to sell counterfeit PCGS items. He is making his own PCGS holders, probably with a 3D printer and inserting real coins that are 1 or 2 grades lower. When you compare his fake PCGS holders to the REAL PCGS holders, they are almost exact, but, the coins are definately not the same.
  • joebb21joebb21 Posts: 4,760 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Not the bridgeport, but some of the other morgans he's sold if counterfeit is the best work Ive seen..
    may the fonz be with you...always...
  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I don't think I will be paying this guy. Glad I caught it in time so I didn't have to deal with the fiasco of returning it or dealing with ebay.
  • davewesendavewesen Posts: 6,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: CommemKing
    I don't think I will be paying this guy. Glad I caught it in time so I didn't have to deal with the fiasco of returning it or dealing with ebay.


    Tell them why when you ask to cancel auction - it is possible they bought a group from someone with some bad ones mixed in and they do not know.
  • oih82w8oih82w8 Posts: 12,511 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Agreed one too many "5's" in the cert number...PCGS is only up to 8 digits.



    Fake.
    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
  • joebb21joebb21 Posts: 4,760 ✭✭✭✭✭
    All his OGH'S are counterfeit too.
    This is the first Ive ever seen of this kind.

    may the fonz be with you...always...
  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    He canceled the auction no questions asked. Should he be reported or should I leave it alone?
  • sparky64sparky64 Posts: 7,041 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sorry to state the obvious CommemKing and you're probably more seasoned than I.

    I've never bought a coin off eBay.



    But on other auction sites, the first thing I do is verify the cert no. to see if it's in the database, see if there's a trueview and to see the price guide.



    "If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"

    My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress

  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    U usually do check it out first. For some reason I didn't check this one until after I bid. Hey, at least I caught it before I paid.
  • davewesendavewesen Posts: 6,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: CommemKing
    He canceled the auction no questions asked. Should he be reported or should I leave it alone?



    Leave it alone, if you want to watch their other auctions and report counterfeits that is fine. Who would you report them too? I am not sure who at PCGS follows up with counterfeits of their products - they probably should have a division to keep their brand intact.
  • ms70ms70 Posts: 13,956 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Notice the MS65 is a larger font than PCGS.

    Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.

  • sparky64sparky64 Posts: 7,041 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: CommemKing

    U usually do check it out first. For some reason I didn't check this one until after I bid. Hey, at least I caught it before I paid.


    I can see that happening.

    Glad you caught it.

    "If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"

    My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress

  • joebb21joebb21 Posts: 4,760 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: davewesen
    Originally posted by: CommemKing
    He canceled the auction no questions asked. Should he be reported or should I leave it alone?



    Leave it alone, if you want to watch their other auctions and report counterfeits that is fine. Who would you report them too? I am not sure who at PCGS follows up with counterfeits of their products - they probably should have a division to keep their brand intact.


    I reported all of his auctions and even his past sales as they were ALL counterfeit.

    On his one raw morgan I asked:

    "Hi,

    I see you are counterfeiting PCGS slabs and placing your artificially toned coins inside them with higher grades thereby defrauding people on many counts.

    Is there a a reason why you did not do the same for this morgan?

    thank you"
    may the fonz be with you...always...
  • JeffersonFrogJeffersonFrog Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018 11:21AM
    ...

    If we were all the same, the world would be an incredibly boring place.

    Tommy

  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,313 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: scubafuel

    I'd be willing to bet the coin and slab are fine and it's a PCGS database issue and bad pixellated pics. This just doesn't match the usual fake slab MO, IMO.



    Could be wrong though.








    The coin itself seems like it could be a decent MS65.
    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • LindeDadLindeDad Posts: 18,766 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I posted it over on Numismatic Crimes Facebook site.
  • mudskippiemudskippie Posts: 540 ✭✭
    Check out this one and look closely at the prong insert. It is clumsy homemade prong insert!
    1885 morgon dol
    He ATed the coin then placed them in genuine pcgs holder using homemade labels. Reported.
  • LindeDadLindeDad Posts: 18,766 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Think that just been cooked in the holder.
  • FallGuyFallGuy Posts: 207 ✭✭✭
    The 1880 Morgan being auctioned is in a OGH. Enter the cert number into PCGS coinfacts database and see it was auctioned January of this year, same cert number but the older solid blue label!

    Obviously this EBay seller is running a scam on ALL the coins he has listed. I am very surprised at how many folks here think it's an image problem or no big deal as long as the coin is genuine.
  • mudskippiemudskippie Posts: 540 ✭✭
    Originally posted by: LindeDad
    Think that just been cooked in the holder.


    The labels are homemade!

  • FallGuyFallGuy Posts: 207 ✭✭✭
    And I have never seen an OGH with an 8-digit cert number. Kinda jives nicely with the 9-digit cert on another fake holder.
  • ebaybuyerebaybuyer Posts: 2,984 ✭✭✭
    when you guy 50 scratch offs and none of them are winners you cant get your money back ... that's a gamble. the sellers are the only ones who truly "gamble" on ebay the buyers have so many safety nets, a few of which are even legitimate, its hardly a gamble
    regardless of how many posts I have, I don't consider myself an "expert" at anything
  • ArizonaRareCoinsArizonaRareCoins Posts: 679 ✭✭✭✭
    Well, the speculation as to whether the PCGS holders are real or fake are now over.....They are FAKE:
    This guy sold me TWO COUNTERFEIT PCGS holders. BEWARE!!!!

    I'm sure this Counterfeiter will be back selling his Counterfeit PCGS holders on eBay soon, under a different eBay user name.
  • joebb21joebb21 Posts: 4,760 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Arizona,

    Why did you also leave him 1 positive feedback?
    may the fonz be with you...always...
  • davewesendavewesen Posts: 6,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: joebb21
    Arizona,

    Why did you also leave him 1 positive feedback?


    someone else left the feedback
  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 13,082 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The slab appears fake to me.

    This one (completed sale) looks even worse . . . .

    Link
  • ArizonaRareCoinsArizonaRareCoins Posts: 679 ✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: Connecticoin
    The slab appears fake to me.

    This one (completed sale) looks even worse . . . .

    Link


    Too bad the buyer of that counterfeit PCGS holder has no idea that he was scammed and since ebay now blocks the name of the buyer, he can't even be contacted to let him know this. Even worse, look at the feedback the duped buyer left this crook:

    Very very nice coin, Thank you for the quick and painless transaction !~ t***8 ( 1117Red star icon for feedback score in between 1,000 to 4,999) During past 6 months
    1881 S MS65PL PCGS MORGAN DOLLAR OGH DCAM ON MIRRORS Colorfully Edged (#262301559833) US $260.00 View Item


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