Centering and grading

delistamps

66 Centering?

I understand that it might be a great paper, color, impression, etc. There's something that I don't quite get about an off-center note like this being up at the 66 level.

bsides

I agree! This grade is disappointing.... I'd much prefer to see it in a 64 EPQ holder.

gconover

I agree also. On the other hand I have seen notes with better centering in 64 PPQ holders and wondered why they weren't graded higher.

Tookybandit

I see it as a 65 note

TigerTrader

I guess they used the "well it could be trimmed and be a 66" reasoning...



I think it is better than a 64 for sure. The top margin is huge but the other 3 are very healthy normal looking margins. It almost seems like the note may be a little bigger than most...

numbersman

Within my "old school" thought process it is not a gem(65 or higher)regardless of what the holder may state.I was taught to grade initially by reading books..the Friedberg book states that "it MUST be perfectly centered with full margins".I realize that there are other books/references that state different parameters,but that is the way I was brought up in this business/hobby and was expected to adhere to when selling(slabbed or not).I also realize that times have changed and the "old" standards are evolving....but this note,to me,is no gem.if it were,what on earth would a 67 look like!?

larry510

Each series may be graded differently depending on the typical series centering and margin sizes which vary a lot from series to series. The 1957 series is known for having nice big margins so I would grade this one as a solid 65epq. They're only one point off but I have seen a number of worse overgrades than this one by PMG.

luckybucks

Reverse centering looks better than the front, but the front is what matters. I am on the fence on the grade, between a strong 64 or weak 65.

dtreter

sjk1776

Big margins, slightly off center. If this was a Colonial note PMG would have it as a 71 EPQ!

Jim61

Well grading has not been perfect yet and I don't see it being perfect in the rest of my lifetime. We are all human and have opinions and we all make mistakes.



Until they are graded by robots and guided by strict programming, I don't see any changes in the future. Just my opinion!!!!

delistamps

My sense is PCGS places a higher premium on centering than PMG does; PMG may compensate in other areas. Initially I collected stamps and was always focused on centering; that priority has carried into my currency tastes.

In some respects centering is probably the least important aspect for a TPG to weigh in on; it is easily apparent to anyone viewing a picture of the note. Paper quality, color, embossing, etc. are not as evident when viewing pictures online.

By the way, I don't mention this to start a PCGS v PMG debate (we've had enough of those): I buy notes from both. I just think the difference is important and reason why I would not buy a note based on grade without seeing a photo of it.

synchr

Centering and front to back in register too

tomtomtomtom

Originally posted by: delistamps
My sense is PCGS places a higher premium on centering than PMG does; PMG may compensate in other areas. Initially I collected stamps and was always focused on centering; that priority has carried into my currency tastes.

In some respects centering is probably the least important aspect for a TPG to weigh in on; it is easily apparent to anyone viewing a picture of the note. Paper quality, color, embossing, etc. are not as evident when viewing pictures online.

By the way, I don't mention this to start a PCGS v PMG debate (we've had enough of those): I buy notes from both. I just think the difference is important and reason why I would not buy a note based on grade without seeing a photo of it.

I also don't want to get into the debate either but I sometimes wonder if higher value notes get a nod. Here is another "66"...sold $5300



Since fractionals were hand cut, many argue that there are really "tough notes" to get as great centering. But this is not the case here. Here is an AU note with much better centering to discount that argument ....sold for half the price.

dtreter

Tom,



Between the two Justice notes, I would much rather own the second note (PCGS 55) over the first note because of it price and its much better presentation. I try to look for the better looking of the rarer notes and don't care for the number on the holder. If I was trying for the best in the registry, then I would want the the higher graded note and not care for its presentation. It has much better presentation than the first note and the fold is not obvious. With that said, I do agree that the first Justice note is a Gem quality note. With Justice notes, all you have to have is about one millimeter on the margin to get a Gem grade and that note, it looks about right. I am note a grader but I would consider it a 65 (not a 66). If the second note did not have a hidden fold, I would consider it a 66 or a 67 for a grade. It is a beautiful looking note and I would much rather have it than the first note.