C & J Coin & Jewelry Woburn Mass RIP OFF DEALER
FredWeinberg
Posts: 5,891 ✭✭✭✭✭
I posted this on the dealer network this week, but thought I would also put
out the notice here, as a warning to collectors:
C & J Coin
Charles "Chip" Southwick
166 Main St.
Woburn, Mass.
I shipped this 'dealer' $7,000 in two error items, back in April 2015.
I had known him since the '70's, and did business with him when he had
moved out to Calif. in the late '70's/early 80's, or thereabouts.
He admitted, a month after shipping, that he had sold one of the error
coins ($4,800 to him, from me), but was waiting for his customer to
'come up with the funds". Months and months went by with excuses,
lies, BS, etc. - finally, around Oct., he returned the $2,200 item, and
simply said he didn't have the money to pay me for the $4,800 coin.
After contacting numerous dealers Mass. and his area, they ALL told me
that that was his modus operandi - take coins on memo from dealers,
sell them, and just not pay for them. I've talked to almost 10 different
dealers who have had this problem directly with him, and have heard
similar stories about other dealers in the same situation.
I am posting this message simply to warn collectors to be extremely
careful doing business with this person and his store. Apparently he
does not have working capitol funds to properly do business with other
dealers, and so collectors should also be advise to be wary of him and
his shop.
Fair warning about, apparently, a well-known rip-off artist.
Fred
out the notice here, as a warning to collectors:
C & J Coin
Charles "Chip" Southwick
166 Main St.
Woburn, Mass.
I shipped this 'dealer' $7,000 in two error items, back in April 2015.
I had known him since the '70's, and did business with him when he had
moved out to Calif. in the late '70's/early 80's, or thereabouts.
He admitted, a month after shipping, that he had sold one of the error
coins ($4,800 to him, from me), but was waiting for his customer to
'come up with the funds". Months and months went by with excuses,
lies, BS, etc. - finally, around Oct., he returned the $2,200 item, and
simply said he didn't have the money to pay me for the $4,800 coin.
After contacting numerous dealers Mass. and his area, they ALL told me
that that was his modus operandi - take coins on memo from dealers,
sell them, and just not pay for them. I've talked to almost 10 different
dealers who have had this problem directly with him, and have heard
similar stories about other dealers in the same situation.
I am posting this message simply to warn collectors to be extremely
careful doing business with this person and his store. Apparently he
does not have working capitol funds to properly do business with other
dealers, and so collectors should also be advise to be wary of him and
his shop.
Fair warning about, apparently, a well-known rip-off artist.
Fred
Retired Collector & Dealer in Major Mint Error Coins & Currency since the 1960's.Co-Author of Whitman's "100 Greatest U.S. Mint Error Coins", and the Error Coin Encyclopedia, Vols., III & IV. Retired Authenticator for Major Mint Errors for PCGS. A 50+ Year PNG Member.A full-time numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022.
0
Comments
Not an excuse by any means. Can't say that you should change your business model but you were very trusting with $7,000. Do dealers commonly sell to other dealers without payment changing hands immediately? Being a collector and not a dealer I would not know how that circle of trust works.
Sorry Fred that this happened to you.
bob
Times are tough for some folks that were rolling in dough not too long ago.
Not an excuse by any means. Can't say that you should change your business model but you were very trusting with $7,000. Do dealers commonly sell to other dealers without payment changing hands immediately? Being a collector and not a dealer I would not know how that circle of trust works.
Sorry Fred that this happened to you.
bob
Especially with someone you've known for 40 years.
Bad deal.
bob
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Here's hoping that the dude gets right and comes thru with the outstanding funds.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
I posted this on the dealer network this week, but thought I would also put
out the notice here, as a warning to collectors:
C & J Coin
Charles "Chip" Southwick
166 Main St.
Woburn, Mass.
I shipped this 'dealer' $7,000 in two error items, back in April 2015.
I had known him since the '70's, and did business with him when he had
moved out to Calif. in the late '70's/early 80's, or thereabouts.
He admitted, a month after shipping, that he had sold one of the error
coins ($4,800 to him, from me), but was waiting for his customer to
'come up with the funds". Months and months went by with excuses,
lies, BS, etc. - finally, around Oct., he returned the $2,200 item, and
simply said he didn't have the money to pay me for the $4,800 coin.
After contacting numerous dealers Mass. and his area, they ALL told me
that that was his modus operandi - take coins on memo from dealers,
sell them, and just not pay for them. I've talked to almost 10 different
dealers who have had this problem directly with him, and have heard
similar stories about other dealers in the same situation.
I am posting this message simply to warn collectors to be extremely
careful doing business with this person and his store. Apparently he
does not have working capitol funds to properly do business with other
dealers, and so collectors should also be advise to be wary of him and
his shop.
Fair warning about, apparently, a well-known rip-off artist.
Fred
My first few posts many months ago after the Upgrade were fine,
but this is the first one that's got the same 'run-on' problems that
others have had.
Sadysta1 - glad I was able to bring him to your attention. You're always
welcome to stop by the store, if it's convenient for you, and tell the
counter person there that you were contemplating doing business with
them, until you read my post .......ie: - give him my regards.........Fred
I moved from Massachusetts in 2003. While I was running my coin business there, this dealer had a dubious reputation at that time. I remember one dealer, with whom I did a lot of business, once commented to me, "I surprised that he still has knee caps."
Ouch!
Quoted with ie10
I posted this on the dealer network this week, but thought I would also put
out the notice here, as a warning to collectors:
C & J Coin
Charles "Chip" Southwick
166 Main St.
Woburn, Mass.
I shipped this 'dealer' $7,000 in two error items, back in April 2015.
I had known him since the '70's, and did business with him when he had
moved out to Calif. in the late '70's/early 80's, or thereabouts.
He admitted, a month after shipping, that he had sold one of the error
coins ($4,800 to him, from me), but was waiting for his customer to
'come up with the funds". Months and months went by with excuses,
lies, BS, etc. - finally, around Oct., he returned the $2,200 item, and
simply said he didn't have the money to pay me for the $4,800 coin.
After contacting numerous dealers Mass. and his area, they ALL told me
that that was his modus operandi - take coins on memo from dealers,
sell them, and just not pay for them. I've talked to almost 10 different
dealers who have had this problem directly with him, and have heard
similar stories about other dealers in the same situation.
I am posting this message simply to warn collectors to be extremely
careful doing business with this person and his store. Apparently he
does not have working capitol funds to properly do business with other
dealers, and so collectors should also be advise to be wary of him and
his shop.
Fair warning about, apparently, a well-known rip-off artist.
Fred
quoted chrome 47
I posted this on the dealer network this week, but thought I would also put
out the notice here, as a warning to collectors:
C & J Coin
Charles "Chip" Southwick
166 Main St.
Woburn, Mass.
I shipped this 'dealer' $7,000 in two error items, back in April 2015.
I had known him since the '70's, and did business with him when he had
moved out to Calif. in the late '70's/early 80's, or thereabouts.
He admitted, a month after shipping, that he had sold one of the error
coins ($4,800 to him, from me), but was waiting for his customer to
'come up with the funds". Months and months went by with excuses,
lies, BS, etc. - finally, around Oct., he returned the $2,200 item, and
simply said he didn't have the money to pay me for the $4,800 coin.
After contacting numerous dealers Mass. and his area, they ALL told me
that that was his modus operandi - take coins on memo from dealers,
sell them, and just not pay for them. I've talked to almost 10 different
dealers who have had this problem directly with him, and have heard
similar stories about other dealers in the same situation.
I am posting this message simply to warn collectors to be extremely
careful doing business with this person and his store. Apparently he
does not have working capitol funds to properly do business with other
dealers, and so collectors should also be advise to be wary of him and
his shop.
Fair warning about, apparently, a well-known rip-off artist.
Fred
Latin American Collection
1843 Seated Liberty Half Dollar NGC VG-8
Struck 25% Off Center
I never write checks that can not be cashed immediately, and only once have I taken a coin on memo and it was returned days later as soon as my customer passed on it. My consignment (retail) customers call me the "Bank of Armen" as they know they get their money always as we have discussed.
Sorry to hear this Fred, thanks for the heads up, will keep an eye out.
Coin Rarities Online
Don't you have recourse?
You have much to learn.
Fred is 3,000 miles from where he needs to file suit and appear (Defendant's residence). Plus does defendant sound like he has money to pay a judgment?
From his website it sounds like he has plenty of inventory to trade for that coin, just saying.
If he has a website, just be mindful that his business is subject to reviews on Google, Yelp, Manta, WhitePages, Mapquest, 411 and a whole list of other search engines.
May the fun begin !
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
Link
Here, it says he does $500,000 per year.
Link
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
Here, you can leave feedback.
Link
Here, it says he does $500,000 per year.
Link
Actually it says less then $500,000. That could be $50,000 or $1. He will cry that it is closer to a $1.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Don't you have recourse?
You have much to learn.
Fred is 3,000 miles from where he needs to file suit and appear (Defendant's residence). Plus does defendant sound like he has money to pay a judgment?
Actually Fred can notify law enforcement. Depending on the jurisdiction, a lot can be done without appearing unless it's contested and goes to trial. This guy might pay up if he gets threatened with arrest. It won't hurt to at least speak with a detective in that town.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
Sorry to hear this Fred. It is why I want to be paid, and pay for, everything right then and there or at least by the end of the show. I always get a little tweaked when dealers want to do deals, and so you write everything up, and THEN they tell you to hold the check until some future date.
I never write checks that can not be cashed immediately, and only once have I taken a coin on memo and it was returned days later as soon as my customer passed on it. My consignment (retail) customers call me the "Bank of Armen" as they know they get their money always as we have discussed.
PLUS 1. If I can't pay now, I do not need it or anything else. In return I expect others to do the same. I used to be more tolerant but after being burned a couple of times it is cash and carry for me.
I would venture a guess that the guy could actually pay for the coin, he choses not to since he has learned he can get away with this type of transaction.
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
Why can't someone call the dealer offer 10K for coin, when they get it return it to Fred?
You get post of the year for that one.
Why can't someone call the dealer offer 10K for coin, when they get it return it to Fred?
You get post of the year for that one.
Amen. Excellent thought.
Don't you have recourse?
You have much to learn.
Fred is 3,000 miles from where he needs to file suit and appear (Defendant's residence). Plus does defendant sound like he has money to pay a judgment?
Of course I do. That is what makes life worth living.
From your posts you sure seem like someone whom I would prefer to never meet in person.
Latin American Collection
Why can't someone call the dealer offer 10K for coin, when they get it return it to Fred?
The coin has already been sold.
I moved from Massachusetts in 2003. While I was running my coin business there, this dealer had a dubious reputation at that time. I remember one dealer, with whom I did a lot of business, once commented to me, "I surprised that he still has knee caps."
not good
Fred, I'd apply all the pressure you can to this guy through other Mass dealers. If the word isn't already out, get it out further. I think this guy used to do the show circuit when I was on it...I sort of recall them being in the back part of the room when Tom Lacey ran the Auburn, MA show. My gut memory was that there weren't good vibes from those guys.
The monthly Auburn, Westford and annual Bay State - Marlborough (April) shows get decent action. Getting the word out to those shows/promotors/dealers/public would only help. Ed Aleo has done the Bay State shows for over 40 years. I'd contact him through the link below. If anyone is connected to the Mass coin dealer/public network it's him. Ernie (EBW productions) does the other 2 shows and I've known him for 10 years. He's only located 5 miles from C&J. They probably talk to each other a lot. Ernie has his ways.
You might be able to get some help from those guys, at least an idea what your best bet is. It's not likely you'll get much help from police being out of jurisdiction and a fairly small sum (ie white collar crime). If the dealer is an ANA member you can apply another source of pressure through them. Work up 1 complaint and file it multiple times with each of these organizations and all the website reviews out there. It's possible the dealer is also in financial trouble which means fast action before they possibly go under. That happened to me with Beavertown Coin, Lincoln Park, NJ.
I would change the wording in your first post (title and lead in) to start with C & J Coin & Jewelry Coin dealer Woburn, MA . Google search currently puts your post on page 3. This should bring it up to page 1. People need to see this 1st on a national/regional search for C&J Coin and Jewelry.
The company has no recent BBB complaints against it? An A+ rating because of that...lol. Wow, that's surprising no one has ever filed a complaint. I'd file one as it will only take an hour or less. The BBB will contact this dealer. Having a single, recent unresolved complaint isn't going to help them. I did that with a car dealership a couple years back and after 5 months of holding my money they responded to the BBB's inquiry and refunded my money. BBB link below. I'd call them before going nuclear on the postings. Maybe even direct their attention to this CU Forum thread.
BBB rating
List of Mass coin shows
You can post a review/complaint of their business here on Masslive.com
can you do a local news story? contact the local newspaper or TV station?
Great idea. Contact the Mayor or Chamber of Commerce. No Chief Exec likes to get phone calls about Main Street B&M crooks in their town. Interesting that C&J offers foreign currency exchange.
Why not post a copy of the complaint (BBB web page would be a nice plus) and have it posted at several dealer tables at the April Bay State coin show? That will help inform the public. That show is only 35 miles from C&J.
same thing.... Cheers, RickO
Actually, I have done business with this individual as well, although on a small scale. Charles bought a $1100 coin (or thereabouts) and said he'd pay later. I let him take the coin, and he did send me a check a few weeks or so later. I did all that before other dealers at the show (it was at the Baltimore show) told me not to trust him, and was happy he did end up paying.
Recently, he tried to get me to send him a $7,000 coin on memo, but knowing better, I did not.
I know various other dealers to whom Charles owes money....
Jon
1031343 | INDIA-BRITISH. Bengal Presidency. 1203//19 AV 1/8 Mohur. PCGS MS65. Murshidabad. 14mm. Persian-Shah Alam (II) Badshah, fine style. Inscription / Sanat, Zarb, mint name, fine style. Inscription. KM 89. Frozen.
PCGS certification number 32597841
I had already left the show and my employee called me to ask if it was OK to give the piece on memo, as Mr. Southwick had a customer he wanted to offer the piece to. I naively agreed (Mr. Southwick had negotiated quite strenuously on the price, which is not the normal MO for a con artist).
After months of attempting to retrieve payment we gave up. I am still planning to file a report.
James Ricks
I've changed the Title of this thread (thanks for that suggestion, RoadRunner)
and I've left one bad review on a link someone gave me.
I did discover that we had FED EX'd the items to him back in April, so I cannot
file a USPS Complaint.
However, I am pursuing some other actions, based on some of these suggestions and
other direct contact I've had with other dealers who've been ripped-off by Southwick.
As mentioned, I've already posted a short version of the story on the FACTS Dealer
Newwork, and my reason for posting it here was to prevent other collectors from
possibly getting involved with a shop and owner who are completely not trustworthy.
I'll be glad to add any new info as I go along....could take some time........
Again, thanks for all your supportive messages.
It may be hard to get money out of someone who has no money. however he may very well face jail time...
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
Guys, thanks for all the support and suggestions over the past 3 days.
I've changed the Title of this thread (thanks for that suggestion, RoadRunner)
and I've left one bad review on a link someone gave me.
I did discover that we had FED EX'd the items to him back in April, so I cannot
file a USPS Complaint.
However, I am pursuing some other actions, based on some of these suggestions and
other direct contact I've had with other dealers who've been ripped-off by Southwick.
As mentioned, I've already posted a short version of the story on the FACTS Dealer
Newwork, and my reason for posting it here was to prevent other collectors from
possibly getting involved with a shop and owner who are completely not trustworthy.
I'll be glad to add any new info as I go along....could take some time........
Again, thanks for all your supportive messages.
Fred did you consider taking coins of his as trade to balance the scales so to speak? He has inventory. Not a perfect solution granted
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
What's his website?
All you have to do is Google the name!
Comes right up!