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MILE HIGH FALL AUCTION -- NOTING THE 1953 STAHL-MEYER FRANKS SET, ESPECIALLY THE MICKEY MANTLE
IndianaJones
Posts: 346 ✭✭✭
As soon as I heard the venerable auction house Mile High was chosen to offer the unique ultra high-grade 1953 Stahl-Meyer Franks complete set, I became interested, to say the least. Their imminent auction of important early Mickey Mantle mainstream gum cards is very impressive as well, even if those opportunities are much more frequent, relatively speaking of course. Be that as it may, the banzai 1953 Stahl-Meyer set is simply breathtaking. I know, I know, the whole hobby loves the 1951 Bowman and 1952 Topps Mantles, and rightly so. It's like Marilyn Monroe. However, I offer an interesting comparison. Should you get a chance to look at Anita Ekberg frolicking in the fountain in La Dolce Vita, you cannot take your eyes off of her. The same is true for me with that Stahl-Meyer Franks Mickey Mantle. In Mile High's catalog listing, they said their card is one of the greatest Mickey Mantles it has been their privilege to have ever offered.
Gazing at it, I can see once again why Joe Orlando, when he expanded the "TOP 200 Sportscards" to 250, chose among the fifty the Stahl-Meyer of Mr. Mantle. Some of you may not know this, and it's neither here nor there in some ways, but the magnificent portrait of Mickey Mantle on his Stahl-Meyer was taken during his rookie season. Owning this baby would have endless bragging rights, though the owner should say not a word at first. Simply watch the look on his guest's face when he lets them view it.
You never forget your first major show. Mine was in 1972. Among the highlights I have never forgotten, nor ever will, was the privilege to view an album of mounted Stahl-Meyer cards from the collection of Ron Greenwood. The late Mr. Greenwood had wisely chosen to keep his Mickey Mantles at home, rather than risk misfortune, but what I got to see was incredible. It was my introduction to the rare Stahl-Meyer Franks cards; let me assure you, it was love at first site.
"A few" of you chaps collect and/or follow Mickey Mantle cards. Did any of you other guys notice the Mile High Stahl-Meyer cards? Just wondering.
Cheers. ---Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
Gazing at it, I can see once again why Joe Orlando, when he expanded the "TOP 200 Sportscards" to 250, chose among the fifty the Stahl-Meyer of Mr. Mantle. Some of you may not know this, and it's neither here nor there in some ways, but the magnificent portrait of Mickey Mantle on his Stahl-Meyer was taken during his rookie season. Owning this baby would have endless bragging rights, though the owner should say not a word at first. Simply watch the look on his guest's face when he lets them view it.
You never forget your first major show. Mine was in 1972. Among the highlights I have never forgotten, nor ever will, was the privilege to view an album of mounted Stahl-Meyer cards from the collection of Ron Greenwood. The late Mr. Greenwood had wisely chosen to keep his Mickey Mantles at home, rather than risk misfortune, but what I got to see was incredible. It was my introduction to the rare Stahl-Meyer Franks cards; let me assure you, it was love at first site.
"A few" of you chaps collect and/or follow Mickey Mantle cards. Did any of you other guys notice the Mile High Stahl-Meyer cards? Just wondering.
Cheers. ---Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
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Always looking for Mantle cards such as Stahl Meyer, 1954 Dan Dee, 1959 Bazooka, 1960 Post, 1952 Star Cal Decal, 1952 Tip Top Bread Labels, 1953-54 Briggs Meat, and other Topps, Bowman, and oddball Mantles.
Shane
Always looking for Mantle cards such as Stahl Meyer, 1954 Dan Dee, 1959 Bazooka, 1960 Post, 1952 Star Cal Decal, 1952 Tip Top Bread Labels, 1953-54 Briggs Meat, and other Topps, Bowman, and oddball Mantles.
I see it is one of those auctions where they break up the cards and auction them individually too and the higher price takes them home.
Do you think the strength in Mantle cards will lead to this set being broken up?
<< <i>Mantle PSA 7
I see it is one of those auctions where they break up the cards and auction them individually too and the higher price takes them home.
>>
Yup, set vs singles. You can win but still end up losing. Most auction houses have abandoned that format- personally I won't bid in any auction that still utilizes it. It's just wrong, IMO.
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
<< <i>I looked at some of the cards in the MH preview and pardon my bluntness but those are some of the worst high end PSA 9's I have ever seen. Most of them have poor centering and several have massive tilts to them. Definitely a case of buy the card and not the holder. >>
Totally agree.
Check out the 1971 Hank Aaron PSA 10. Might get a 7.5 if subbed right now.
<< <i>The mile high auction has some of the best cards of any major auction house I've seen in a while. >>
Curious as to what qualifies as "best". I saw a Mantle rookie in an 8 that has horrendous centering and weak corners. The 1952 Robinson and Campanella are horrible 9's - the eye appeal and tilt are so bad they looked like 6's. Ryan rookie in a 9 and 1971 Aaron in a 10 are extremely weak.....Very surprised at the condition of the cards in this one.
Please don't bid on the set so I have a chance.
The 1953 Topps set will be a completely different story. This set will sell for a huge price tag and I believe the lot as a set will not be victorious. There are a ton of high grade commons in 8.5 or 9 that will have a ton of nice action for the seller.
I must agree that some of the high grade cards in this auction are not that nice to my eye. Cards that I would have been bidding on are not going to be hit because the condition of the card does not match the grade. This is not exactly MileHighCard's issue but it is the issue of PSA. I can't get a card in the holder I think it deserves and yet there are many that I refuse to grade because of a tilt or a touched corner. Heck, I may be getting old and the eyes are not that good as they used to be.
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<< <i>The mile high auction has some of the best cards of any major auction house I've seen in a while. >>
Curious as to what qualifies as "best". I saw a Mantle rookie in an 8 that has horrendous centering and weak corners. The 1952 Robinson and Campanella are horrible 9's - the eye appeal and tilt are so bad they looked like 6's. Ryan rookie in a 9 and 1971 Aaron in a 10 are extremely weak.....Very surprised at the condition of the cards in this one. >>
Insult the high grade cards all you want. I'm sure you would be jealous of whoever owns them though.
Still, I'd give the full six of a .44 Magnum, whether for one card or the full set of nine. If enough single player or type collectors get involved, it will take massive coin to win the whole shebang. The Stahl-Meyer Mantle alone is worth BEAUCOUP (BOO COO) bucks. Personally, I would not trade it for the 1952 Topps PSA 8. Brave words, and I'm rather certain in some quarters they would be deemed irresponsible, I suppose, to some. Having collected cards off and on since 1961, with Mr. Mantle being of prime interest, I have gained a bit more knowledge and experience than some of our casual brothers and sisters here. Just as I described Anita Ekberg in LA DOLCE VITA, I cannot tear myself away from that 1953 Stahl-Meyer Franks Mickey Manlte in PSA 7---the eye appeal is off the charts.
For what it's worth, and it may be nothing after what I've said, for over twenty years I was a very happy, contented owner of a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle, which I would grade no better, nor worse, than a PSA 6 EX-MT. The card was magnificent, and I miss it terribly. I had to choose between my 52 Topps and my Stahl-Meyer Mantle to sell and help raise money for a down payment on a house. That very tough occasion was twenty years ago, shortly before the announcement that Mickey was dying of cancer. The Topps Mantle was perfection, just as the Stahl-Meyer, but my family and I could not wait 20 more years to live in a house.
Back to the subject, if we really have one anyway. It will be interesting to see what transpires for Mile High's '53 Stahl-Meyers.
I will say this, let's say there was a banquet hall with an invitation for anyone owning a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle in PSA 5 EXCELLENT or better. The number of gents who would qualify to attend would be 391. Let's not bother that there have been specimens graded that high by SGC or Beckett; neither have graded a Stahl-Meyer Mantle in EXCELLENT or better anyway. How many '53 Stahl-Meyer Mickey Mantles have been graded EXCELLENT or better?
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The discussion over which Mantle card to hunt for becomes superfluous IF you have the sufficient funds to build a world class Mickey Mantle baseball card collection. So, asking the silly question, "What's better than having an ultra high grade 1952 Topps Mantle?"
ANSWER: Having an ultra high grade Stahl-Meyer Franks Mickey Mantle to go with the Topps.
Oh yeah.
The number of collectors from across the USA who could potentially own both in ultra high grade would just fit a table for five. Exclusivity indeed. In fact, I dare say not every one of those five seats would be occupied, if you know what I mean.
Of course, just having a couple of barrels stuffed with discretionary money to spend by no means guarantees you will be able to hunt down an ultra high grade Stahl-Meyer Mick. Availability seldom presents itself.
Now, lest someone scream in their thinking, "Ok, the Stahl-Meyer is a condition rarity all right, but what about demand?!? Desire! Demand! GOTTA HAVE IT?!!? Huh? Ha? Huh?"
How do think demand sprouts up? Talk. Gossip. Stories. Pictures. Price guides. Sales. Price guides. Interviews. Price guides. I think you get the idea. Oh yes, hobby articles, hobby chat forum threads, and auction catalog write-ups whenever the seldom occurrence transpires that an ultra high-grade Stahl-Meyer Mantle is offered.
There have been very, very few of the above, and no genuine hobby articles, and I mean NADA.
Why?
I will offer an educated guess, partly based upon my own self-preservation and defense mechanisms when I was a "Mantle Maniac".
Would you talk up and wax lyrical about a beautiful rare Mickey Mantle card that you desperately desire?
I WOULD NEVER, EVER DO THAT, DUE TO THE FACT I MIGHT RAISE UP MORE COMPETITORS FOR THE SAME CARD, AND THUS SCOTCH MY CHANCES ALL THE MORE OF GETTING THIS DREAM CARD! That kind of bone-headed enthusiasm could cause the card to skyrocket in value, and again, erase any possible chance of my being able to win one in an auction, let alone purchase one outright.
Why say this now and destroy my own chances? Because I am bereft of the financial means to enter a dogfight for one. I'm out of the ball game. It happens.
So what is it about the Stahl-Meyer Mickey Mantle that makes my heart flutter?
Since I'm out of the hunt, I can speak freely.
The stunning appearance of the card. The perfect portrait of Mickey Mantle. The expert fashion in which it was tinted. The simple yet compelling design. The stimulating background color with the bone china borders. I will not go into the ravages that wreaked absolute havoc on the far majority of the cards, nor its enthralling promotion, and all the accouterments of stories and history that go with them. Sure, the mainstream hobby all loves the '52 Topps. I do, too. Be that as it may, as a connoisseur collector of fine Mickey Mantle cards, the Stahl-Meyer is the summit. Yes, I would love to own an EXCELLENT or better '52 Topps Mick again; be that as it may, twenty years ago I made my choice and never once have I regretted choosing the one over the other.
Thus, among some connoisseurs of Mickey's finest cards, there's a silent undercurrent of deep, strong desire for the Stahl-Meyer.
The last words for that gorgeous PSA 7 1953 Stahl-Meyer Franks Mickey Mantle I leave to the real Indiana Jones, who would say, give or take a word, "That is a rare, priceless artifact that belongs in a museum!"
----Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
To each his own, I'm certainly not stopping anyone else from bidding or even suggesting that- just stating that I won't. If there is one thing I've learned from the last 15 years in this hobby is that for the most part another one will come along offered by someone else, and that stuff doesn't trump other factors when chosing where to spend money.
Best of luck on your consignment Indy!
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
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<< <i>The mile high auction has some of the best cards of any major auction house I've seen in a while. >>
Curious as to what qualifies as "best". I saw a Mantle rookie in an 8 that has horrendous centering and weak corners. The 1952 Robinson and Campanella are horrible 9's - the eye appeal and tilt are so bad they looked like 6's. Ryan rookie in a 9 and 1971 Aaron in a 10 are extremely weak.....Very surprised at the condition of the cards in this one. >>
Insult the high grade cards all you want. I'm sure you would be jealous of whoever owns them though. >>
Not intending to step on any toes or call someone's kids ugly. If they are your cards no offense - BTW are those your cards I referenced? I just thought it was odd that the cards used for the auction preview, about 10 of them, all were consistent in that they all had huge tilts/ centering that was. It very desirable. Is a Mantle 8 a great card to have - absolutely. If I had a choice of the PSA 8 offered in MH for $250k or Matt's PSA 4.5 or Evans PSA 3 he sold I would take either of their cards in a heartbeat. Much better eye appeal and for $25-40k I would have a beautiful Mantle and save $200-300k.
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That's quite a write up there. Hope it all pans out for you.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Nor was I asked by anyone to make a pointed discourse on this set. I know who the owner/consignor of the '53 Stahl-Meyer is, but we've never met nor been in any contact.
You know, I honestly can see why you would say in these past 15 years, you've learned "for the most part another one will come along offered by someone else". The key is determining when it is "the most part", and when it is "the chance of a lifetime". Earlier this year, PSA graded its fourth-ever 1953 Stahl-Meyer Franks Mickey Mantle in EX-MT or better. I would love to know the history behind that individual card. I "get in" to that sort of thing; find it fascinating. Few bother to do that kind of research, which is stupid. Or, they refuse to divulge what they know, which is also asinine. The auction market for the extremely rare, highly desirable, and ultra expensive racing sports cars has the matter of research way above and beyond the all too often small minds of our hobby. Most guys are still afraid to tell their wives what they spend on a card, and still fear all the publicity because they think everybody and their uncle will be out to steal their cards. Sure, it is true, a graded card is small, as compared with a 1964-65 Shelby Cobra Daytona coupe.
Then again, we know precisely how many of those Daytona coupes survived the ravages of racing---6. We don't know how many Stahl-Meyers there are, or if there's more than one of the currently unique 1955 Hunter's Wieners
Bob Stephenson, or how many unopened 1971 Kellogg's 3-Ds are still out there, or if we'll ever see any more of the 1914 Baltimore News Babe Ruth, or even Babe's extremely rare 1933 R306 Butter Cream. A few more 1910 Washington Times Ty Cobbs would be super nice. The list, as we all know, can go on and on. Another Colgan's Chips Jim Thorpe, another find of gem mint 1954 Wilson Franks (the only such major find involved almost 300 mint cards, at a major Bruce Paynter Show in Chicago in 1990, aside from one mint complete set back in the late 70s), and of course more mint or near mint Stahl-Meyers. I know of the find the Mile High set came from. I won't go into details because that's in my forthcoming book on postwar regionals. I will say this, however. The find was in the late 1970s and traces to someone who worked at Milprint Printing Co. of Wisconsin. He brought them (involving just 10% of the number of the Wilson Franks find) to a show, and a key collector/dealer of the time purchased them, who granted me a priceless interview of the whole riveting story. Simple as that. Have there been other finds of Stahl-Meyers?
Yes, the amazing find from 1974 of approximately 53 of the 1953 Whitey Lockman. That's why Whitey is "so common". Humph, fifty-three Lockmans. Big deal. Let me tell you, guys. It very much WAS a big deal to the hobby at the time it occurred. I purchased one as soon as I saw Rob Lifson's announcement in a hobby paper. The card was so elegant, and so MINT. Somehow, not one Lockman has technically graded out as MINT, which is downright perplexing. Where are all the others? Maybe it's as you say Griffins; eventually a few more will show up.
Some cards just won't show up, however, or by the time it does, ....? Would you wait until you're so old, fingers gnarly, forgetful, failing eyesight, and let's not keep going here, for the benefit of all of us. We can all wait just so long. They say life is short, and I think they're right.
To be sure, SGC graded a magnificent high-grade S-M Roy Campanella. It was from the collection of who I believe owned the finest collection of SGC-graded cards. He had a pristine set of 1914 (that is the correct year, not the easier 1915) Cracker Jack. I saw them at the 2008 National in Chicago. I will always remember staring for five minutes at the elegant horizontal Christy Matthewson. The owner tragically died of some disease not many months thereafter.
Well, I'm sure I have discoursed way, way too long. I'm sorry. Particularly, I apologize to you, Shane, as you said you are gunning for the set. You would prefer less attention to it, and for me to flat out shut up. I'm also aware some of you prefer thread responses that may be read in a minute or less. I tend to get wound up on the postwar regional/food. Hey, I'm far, far, far from a lousy "KNOW-IT-ALL" when it comes to these types of cards. Although my book will say all I know, as well as what I was able, by the grace and mercy of God, to secure from the lips of other hobby pioneers and ultra intense collectors of these gems as I, there were major gaps and pertinent questions unanswered. Several people I contacted refused to participate and would not divulge one crumb of what they knew. No comment on that needed; besides, my response is too long already.
I do very much wish you, and the rest of youse guys, genuinely, the very best in pursuing any cards or coins that you still dream about, and want to get. May your own "museum" grow wisely and beautifully, just not at the expense of some poor widow or guy who's down on his luck.---Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
PS Quite true, the Stahl-Meyer PSA 7 Mickey Mantle I have been discussing is off-center, but still within the confines of the requirements for centering standards PSA has established for a "7". Just as the 52 Topps, Stahl-Meyer borders are generous, so much so that when a card is centered 60-40 it will be more distracting to the brothers and few sisters for whom centering is paramount. Put it this way, the 7 is the second-highest graded specimen. If you would let its off-centeredness steer you away from this beautiful, enormously eye appealing rare piece, there will be collectors very overjoyed at your annoyance; less competition for them!!!!!
PSS - Many thanks to you, Darin, for supplying us with a glimpse of dear Anita in the fountain during LA DOLCE VITA. Sadly, she is another star we lost this year, in January.
Have a good night. --Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
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<< <i>The mile high auction has some of the best cards of any major auction house I've seen in a while. >>
Curious as to what qualifies as "best". I saw a Mantle rookie in an 8 that has horrendous centering and weak corners. The 1952 Robinson and Campanella are horrible 9's - the eye appeal and tilt are so bad they looked like 6's. Ryan rookie in a 9 and 1971 Aaron in a 10 are extremely weak.....Very surprised at the condition of the cards in this one. >>
Insult the high grade cards all you want. I'm sure you would be jealous of whoever owns them though. >>
Not intending to step on any toes or call someone's kids ugly. If they are your cards no offense - BTW are those your cards I referenced? I just thought it was odd that the cards used for the auction preview, about 10 of them, all were consisten<script id="gpt-impl-0.4509742888621986" src="https://partner.googleadservices.com/gpt/pubads_impl_73.js"></script>t in that they all had huge tilts/ centering that was. It very desirable. Is a Mantle 8 a great card to have - absolutely. If I had a choice of the PSA 8 offered in MH for $250k or Matt's PSA 4.5 or Evans PSA 3 he sold I would take either of their cards in a heartbeat. Much better eye appeal and for $25-40k I would have a beautiful Mantle and save $200-300k. >>
Nope not my cards. Tilt or no tilt these high grade vintage cards continue to set price records.
I apologize for not commenting on the exciting fact your Dad has flown B-17's and B-24's for the foundation you mentioned. How absolutely thrilling! Well I remember going to an airshow in Elkart, Indiana in the summer of 1990 with my wife and two-year old son. They had those two beautiful, powerful bombers you mention, as well as my favorite, the Supermarine Spitfire. The moments we were there were very treasured, and I shall never, ever forget them. Just being in their presence, their immensity, the sight and sound of seeing them fly. Wow. Good for your father. May God keep him and those priceless fighter bombers safe. Thanks again for sharing this with me, bro. ---Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
The Mantle is very clean, accounting for the high technical grade, but I'm a centering nut and that would bother me.
Some of the others are really nice, so y'all focus on the Mantle and don't look too hard at the others until after the auction please
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
There are a lot of nice cards in the auction, and some pretty cool graded packs if that's your thing.
They usually have solid offerings in their auctions, this one doesn't seem any different to me. My bids are in.
https://kennerstartinglineup.blogspot.com/
<< <i>KENDALLCAT---
I apologize for not commenting on the exciting fact your Dad has flown B-17's and B-24's for the foundation you mentioned. How absolutely thrilling! Well I remember going to an airshow in Elkart, Indiana in the summer of 1990 with my wife and two-year old son. They had those two beautiful, powerful bombers you mention, as well as my favorite, the Supermarine Spitfire. The moments we were there were very treasured, and I shall never, ever forget them. Just being in their presence, their immensity, the sight and sound of seeing them fly. Wow. Good for your father. May God keep him and those priceless fighter bombers safe. Thanks again for sharing this with me, bro. ---Indiana Jones (Brian Powell) >>
No worries. My dad has a ton of good flying stories having flown since 1960. When he started as a 23 year old at Eastern Airlines he flew with a lot of guys who flew in WW2 and Korea who always had good stories, and were also known to have some interesting flights and landings - nothing like doing combat approaches with a Boeing 727! I have been in the B17 and B24, and was supposed to fly in one courtesy of my dad. It plans got halted at the last second. As long as we get down to Florida in February in the future we will get the chance. Bring some ear plugs, and if they would let us some .50 cal ammo
KC
I'm at a loss for our brothers that seem to have been spoiled by the perfect centering given them by the modern card companies over the past 30 years. Believe me, I prefer perfect or near perfect centering as well, but for someone to let such preoccupation with dead centering so spoil their reasoning, understanding, and appreciation for such a fine Mickey Mantle regional / food issue, then utter so little about the card's magnificent qualities, there is something wrong with their picture.
This tunnel vision obsession with perfect centering while ignoring the Stahl-Meyer Franks Mantle's regal qualities that are genuinely perfect is decidedly reckless, reprehensible, and repugnant to those of us who know this extraordinary card better.
As if someone grumbled about a van Gogh being too weird and difficult to comprehend.
Or Anita Ekberg being TOO thoroughly endowed with the attributes of femininity.
Or whining about a vintage Shelby Mustang GT500 looking too much like its ordinary model baby brother.
There is nothing more to be said. ---Indiana Jones (Brian Powell)
<< <i>If anything will ever push me out of this hobby, it will be my inability to tolerate ridiculously overblown, nausea-inducing write ups like the ones I have just been exposed to by perusing Mile High's auctions. >>
Because of your comment I read the write up on the Mantle. Haha That one is pretty over the top!