SAy what you want to about the PED's or players who took them..
olb31
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baseball was just more fun and interesting then. Big Mac and Sammy. Jose the 40/40 man. Barry the great. Big Frank. Bagwell, Caminiti, Kent. Clemens. These guys seamed bigger then life and much more interesting than just about anyone today.
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<< <i>baseball was just more fun and interesting then. Big Mac and Sammy. Jose the 40/40 man. Barry the great. Big Frank. Bagwell, Caminiti, Kent. Clemens. These guys seamed bigger then life and much more interesting than just about anyone today. >>
1. Frank Thomas and Bagwell were never linked to PED's, that's merely speculation
2. I disagree with your premise that baseball is less interesting now and I think a lot of baseball fans would agree.
3. SEEMED
4. This belongs in the sports talk forum
Red
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<< <i>Bagwell has been linked a time or two. Thomas has not only never been linked but was outspoken about steroid use before the hammer fell. Plus, when I think steroids, Jeff Kent is definitely not one that comes to mind. >>
Bagwell has only been linked by this kind of conjecture, as far as I know. I don't believe his name was ever leaked as part of any list, illegal transaction or failed test.
Hope none of the juicers ever get into the HOF.
Bagwell never has been linked to PEDs (to my knowledge) except for the fact that he got big. Some people get big by working out without using steroids.
On a side note, when charges came down last August against Bosch... weren't they saying a full list of his clients would end up coming out, which was many more than what was turned up in the MLB investigation? What ever happened with that? Wasn't he sentenced back in February without a peep of any more names?
For me it was a decade or two before that, Yaz, Tony C. Reggie Smith Rico and such the star pitcher from Texas wearing #21 was Ray Culp not Roger Clemens.
<< <i>Hope none of the juicers ever get into the HOF. >>
Quite a few HOFers have already stated that they KNOW there are already a few juicers in the HOF. Rickey Henderson was always suspect in my book.
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<< <i>Hope none of the juicers ever get into the HOF. >>
Quite a few HOFers have already stated that they KNOW there are already a few juicers in the HOF. Rickey Henderson was always suspect in my book. >>
Nolan Ryan is suspect to.
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Big Mac 49 homers in 1987. Has Harper even hit 49 homers yet? Canseco 40/40, Bonds many 30/30 years. Just don't see these type of athletes playing currently.
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<< <i>
<< <i>Hope none of the juicers ever get into the HOF. >>
Quite a few HOFers have already stated that they KNOW there are already a few juicers in the HOF. Rickey Henderson was always suspect in my book. >>
Nolan Ryan is suspect to. >>
I agree
<< <i>Some PED's might have been legal over the counter items at that time, not all but some. I grew up liking the Dodgers in the 70's. I went to a 1998 game between St. Louis and Atlanta. There were over 15,000 fans there an hour and a half before the game to watch Big Mac warm up and this was in Atlanta not St. Louis. Harper and Trout are great players but will probably never generate this kind of fan enthusiasm. Forgot about Manny in his prime also.
Big Mac 49 homers in 1987. Has Harper even hit 49 homers yet? Canseco 40/40, Bonds many 30/30 years. Just don't see these type of athletes playing currently. >>
McGwire was 24 in 1987. Harper is at 73 HRs and only 22.
About 10 seconds of research would have helped. As for Trout, he has the ability to be one of the best ever. If you don't think he brings excitement to the game, you haven't watched him play.
As for it being more fun and interesting - hardly. Every era has their stars and today is no different. Trout, Harper, Kershaw, all highly watchable. Baseball always will be what it always was - an awesome game.
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<< <i>Some PED's might have been legal over the counter items at that time, not all but some. I grew up liking the Dodgers in the 70's. I went to a 1998 game between St. Louis and Atlanta. There were over 15,000 fans there an hour and a half before the game to watch Big Mac warm up and this was in Atlanta not St. Louis. Harper and Trout are great players but will probably never generate this kind of fan enthusiasm. Forgot about Manny in his prime also.
Big Mac 49 homers in 1987. Has Harper even hit 49 homers yet? Canseco 40/40, Bonds many 30/30 years. Just don't see these type of athletes playing currently. >>
How can you discount Trout and then tout Bonds' TAINTED 30/30 years?? Trout has AVERAGED 31 HRs and 33 SBs thru his age 20, 21 and 22 seasons. But don't let facts get in the way of your rant. He's the most talented non-pitcher since Griffey and Kershaw is the most talented power pitcher since Pedro. How can you honestly say Trout in 2014-15 doesn't generate more excitement than Manny did in his (juiced) prime? That's just inaccurate. There's not even anything worth debating there.
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<< <i>Bagwell has been linked a time or two. Thomas has not only never been linked but was outspoken about steroid use before the hammer fell. Plus, when I think steroids, Jeff Kent is definitely not one that comes to mind. >>
Bagwell has only been linked by this kind of conjecture, as far as I know. I don't believe his name was ever leaked as part of any list, illegal transaction or failed test. >>
Bagwell was my favorite player in the 90s, and I hope he never took anything. But I noticed his forearms in particular got huge and then later in his career they were not. I really thought he was unique among players back then, his stance, his beard!!
<< <i>each generation thinks the players they watched were the best or most exciting because they meant the most to them. same thing with music, movies, TV or anything with pop culture. the players who took PED's would still have meant the same to the kids from then even if they did not take them. Kids today will look at Trout Harper and Kershaw the same way. >>
+1
For me it was the 90's;
Michael Jordan, Scottie pippen vs. Karl Malone and John Stockton
Tupac, snoop doggy dog, ice cube
Steven seagal, anything with van damme in it
The 90's was by far the best!
Hi Doug!
<< <i>Doug has heard of Snoopy, but doesn't remember any Peanuts characters named Tupac or ice cube.
Hi Doug!
Lol sorry for the confusing references.
Doug,
Ice cube and tupac are "gangster rappers" also known as hip hop artists and some would even call musicians.
And Griffey, Bagwell, Ripken, Thomas and everyone else was on the stuff in my opinion, I would be willing to bet that NOBODY would wager a weeks paycheck that any one of those guys were 100% clean
<< <i>
<< <i>Some PED's might have been legal over the counter items at that time, not all but some. I grew up liking the Dodgers in the 70's. I went to a 1998 game between St. Louis and Atlanta. There were over 15,000 fans there an hour and a half before the game to watch Big Mac warm up and this was in Atlanta not St. Louis. Harper and Trout are great players but will probably never generate this kind of fan enthusiasm. Forgot about Manny in his prime also.
Big Mac 49 homers in 1987. Has Harper even hit 49 homers yet? Canseco 40/40, Bonds many 30/30 years. Just don't see these type of athletes playing currently. >>
McGwire was 24 in 1987. Harper is at 73 HRs and only 22.
About 10 seconds of research would have helped. As for Trout, he has the ability to be one of the best ever. If you don't think he brings excitement to the game, you haven't watched him play. >>
I agree with this~both Harper and Trout are as exciting or more so than the one dimensional McGwire or that fraud Sosa.
Barry was very exciting, too~but did he really need to enlarge his head three sizes to get there? He was pretty darn good before that, anyway.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Wouldn't it be harder to hit off a pitcher that was on PEDs.
If the game is "clean" today as some say, don't the hitters of today have it easier.
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<< <i>Bagwell has been linked a time or two. Thomas has not only never been linked but was outspoken about steroid use before the hammer fell. Plus, when I think steroids, Jeff Kent is definitely not one that comes to mind. >>
Bagwell has only been linked by this kind of conjecture, as far as I know. I don't believe his name was ever leaked as part of any list, illegal transaction or failed test. >>
Baggy not on Roids???
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<< <i>Hope none of the juicers ever get into the HOF. >>
Quite a few HOFers have already stated that they KNOW there are already a few juicers in the HOF. Rickey Henderson was always suspect in my book. >>
Care to name some names other than Henderson? I for one am tired of blanket statements and comments that don't elaborate.
I am NOT ripping you timpatg, just curious about what HOFers said that which HOFers juiced?
<< <i>I LOVED the PED Era, say what you guys want but the Griffey, Sosa and Mcgwire HR chase season brought Baseball back on the map for alot of people.
And Griffey, Bagwell, Ripken, Thomas and everyone else was on the stuff in my opinion, I would be willing to bet that NOBODY would wager a weeks paycheck that any one of those guys were 100% clean
I'd wager my paycheck that Griffey was clean.
<< <i>
<< <i>I LOVED the PED Era, say what you guys want but the Griffey, Sosa and Mcgwire HR chase season brought Baseball back on the map for alot of people.
And Griffey, Bagwell, Ripken, Thomas and everyone else was on the stuff in my opinion, I would be willing to bet that NOBODY would wager a weeks paycheck that any one of those guys were 100% clean
I'd wager my paycheck that Griffey was clean. >>
+1
<< <i>based on the amount of cash that is involved, it would not surprise if everyone/anyone would do what it takes. im pretty sure that most people on this board would take steroids if it might help you get a 10 year $240 million dollar contract. >>
I'm not greedy, I'd do it for half that lol.
I certainly wouldn't bet a paycheck that Trout or Harper are clean either.
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Thought this was interesting.
https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/pdub1819/othersets/6204
<< <i>Greenies vs. Roids
Thought this was interesting. >>
Good article, but i can almost guarantee that players in the early 1980's before big mac and jose were taking PED's. MLB just didn't test for it nor did it really care. Arnold won Mr. Universe/Olympia or whatever in the early 1970's and admitted taking steriods. So they have been around a long time, just never tested for back then.
1. The thing I like most about Trout/Harper is that not only are they great hitters but excellent fielders as well. I don't remember Mac being the skilled fielder that either one of these guys are. Sammy did make some diving catches but his draw was the bombs he was hitting.
2. I do not condone PED use but Mac and Sammy both drew a lot of attention to the game and possibly renewed the love of it for many people. The sad thing is that I remember the night Mac broke Maris's number and his family was in the stands watching. Before hand they were wishing Mac well and such. It was very emotional for them. Now he is brandished a cheater for PED's.
3. There will always be a black cloud over this era and the great hitters of it due to PED's. While I do think there are players that didn't use and still were successful, I think there were many that didn't get caught. I can't quote articles or anything but I will tell you that Pudge got noticeably smaller after all this started to surface.
Red
Looking for 81-84 Topps Stickers in PSA 9 or better, 81 Topps Scratch offs, 83 Topps Fold outs in PSA 8 or better, 83 Fleer Stamps and 81/86 Fleer Star Stickers in PSA 9 or better.
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Red
Looking for 81-84 Topps Stickers in PSA 9 or better, 81 Topps Scratch offs, 83 Topps Fold outs in PSA 8 or better, 83 Fleer Stamps and 81/86 Fleer Star Stickers in PSA 9 or better.
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<< <i>I will throw a couple points/observations out there.
1. The thing I like most about Trout/Harper is that not only are they great hitters but excellent fielders as well. I don't remember Mac being the skilled fielder that either one of these guys are. Sammy did make some diving catches but his draw was the bombs he was hitting. >>
In his defense, McGwire *DID* win a Gold Glove at 1B. He was generally a pretty decent fielder, albeit with below-average range. Nobody was going to confuse him with Keith Hernandez or John Olerud at first, that's for sure, but he was hardly the worst we've seen in the last 30 years either.
<< <i>It sucks that the all time MLB stats don't really matter much any more with the exception of DiMaggio, Rose, et al. >>
The only "stat" that doesn't really matter any more is the HR and maybe the RBI? 2000 RBI is still impressive
regardless what you are on just like 4000 hits is impressive regardless of who you bet on... Hopefully the stats
will continue to be less important and Baseball will shorten the season to make the games more important and not
be playing into late October anymore. After all shouldn't your best baseball be played when it's not 33 degrees outside?
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