Fake 1985 Star Jordan 117?

highballer

eBay listing for 1985 Star Bulls set

Is this one of those known Star reprints? The Star '85 logo seems low. Otherwise, I don't see much else wrong -- particularly on the back.

MrNearMint

I wish I could tell with star counterfeits. I actually posted a thread on the beckett forums about the Jordan star 101 and had Steve Taft respond.
All I know about star counterfeits is that all black and white background star cards were illegally reproduced and that the original star 101 Jordan typically will have a color bleed from the top front edge to the top back edge of the card.

stevesimps

The item is definitely the #117 reprint. Look at the white/black border area around the card and how the white goes out of the border. The back won't have any red bleed on any of the edges. There are other differences as well, but trying to keep it simple. That's the #117 that is known as the reprint. The seller knows, he does not care. He has also been listing a number cards made to look like Shop at Home cards that were not actually Shop at Home cards.

stevesimps

Other differences, on the reprint, the red expands into the white Bulls logo on the bottom (past the black round line), as person noted 'Star '86 is too low in the top right. Key differences though are reprint shows no signs of bleed on any back edge and has that black/white border area shifting around the card.

Look up a real #117 and the black/white border area is solid; a small amount of white that expands outside of the top left black/white border area as it turns at the top left (easiest cheat way to tell) and will have some red bleed on a back edge (even if one needs to check under magnification).

highballer

Thanks for the responses. Very informative.

I just noticed PWCC looks like it's going to auction some Ewing Star XRC 166 reprints (scroll down to view previews): http://www.pwccauctions.com/live-auction.php?q=&view=grid&items_per_page=50&sort_by=category_3&page=8 I only know about this one because of commentary by Steve Taft in another thread. Disappointing these are popping up like this. I wish there was more guidance on these 85/86 Star 2nd series reprints.

stevesimps

In the other thread, Taft pointed it out, but the person had the Type II Ewing reprint PSA graded and went to sell on ebay recently and then changed his photo with a real BGS graded Ewing, so the Type II reprint Ewing is no longer posted.

stevesimps

stevetaft

Correct as other poster's have noted. The raw 85-6 Star #117 Jordan linked in the original thread posting is a counterfeit. There will not be any red bleed along the back edges, and, the tiny white frame protrusion into the red border (at upper left of framing) does not exist as it does on the original issue.

highballer

Thanks all (and expert Steve Taft) for the confirmation. Since this is the reprint/counterfeit, it seems the concern over knowing whether a Jordan 117 is genuine is overblown.

It looks like the rest of the seller's 1985 Star Bulls Set may be genuine from what I can tell ... at least the borders are larger and what can be seen of the logos does not share the same traits as that on the Jordan. Looks like someone may be buying genuine Bulls commons with a fake Jordan, unfortunately.

stevesimps

The #117 Jordan is the reprint, but the other Bulls in the team set are real. The seller knows it is the reprint and does not care. He is using the other Bulls to try to disguise the Jordan. He repeatedly has other listings with cards that never were Shop at Home cards in 1997 that are printed made to look like Shop at Home.

Bird33Celtics17

Unfortunately star company cards have that stain on their history that scares people off but if you do a little research it's fascinating what you can learn and really quite easy to enjoy these cards worry free. Star basketball makes up a large portion of my collection. I love the cards and I am confident I do not own any of the type 2 reprints or counterfeits. If anybody would like to add these cards to their collection then they should. They are great cards. Just ask questions like the ones above and learn. Expert Steve Taft is very generous with his time and knowledge as well as others like Steve Simps who seems to know his stuff as well. When buying, getting bgs graded helps but if you are still worried, buy from Steve Taft, Mike Higbee who sells the schonco collection, or a guy with ebayid jerry507 who has many great star cards that are all legit. I've done lots of business with them and they are all selling legit star cards and none of them would sell a type 2 reprint or counterfeit. So from them you get that extra layer of protection which I personally appreciate. If you read their listings Steve Taft will tell you on some stuff how to spot the reprint version or what to look for to avoid bad cards. Jerry507 will say things like "not his rookie" or "case has a chip in bottom left corner". Point being, when you look at most listings sellers are telling you how their items are special and you should buy them over everything else. These 2 state facts and stay away from shameful overpromotion. That is exactly the type of people we as collectors who love these cards should support because they ARE the shining light that STAR needs to achieve lasting legitimacy in the minds of the masses.

In many cases these cards were printed at levels of 5000 and less so as Steve Taft had said before, If "a deal" seems too good to be true it probably is. These cards are rare and feature the games greatest players. They deserve a spot at the top of the collecting world.