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Questions for Brazil Empire experts, scans added

I just acquired a bulk lot of old coppers. I have identified one piece as a Brazil Empire 1822R 20 Reis. Dia is 29.9mm weight is 3.9g. Condition is VG.

19th Century Krause 7th edition states: KM360.1 20 Reis should be 7.17g no size given. 1822R Counterfeit with no values given while the original dates of the period have values at $2.25

So - how collectible is this piece? Are they common? Best guess as to value?

OK - so after getting some rest and rereading of the Krause section: Two things come to mind
1. Maybe it's an 1823R
2. Most likely struck an a 10 Reis flan
Krause does state that many are 15% or more underweight with some overweight specimens observed; the official weight for a 10 Reis is 1 oitavo (3.586g), a 20 Reis is 2 oitavos (7.172g)

I'll post a picture this weekend. terrible scans posted

Thanks in advance.

edit to add photos and further comments

image

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Gene

Life member #369 of the Royal Canadian Numismatic Association
Member of Canadian Association of Token Collectors

Collector of:
Canadian coins and pre-confederation tokens
Darkside proof/mint sets dated 1960
My Ebay

Comments

  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Dia is 29.9mm weight is 3.9g. … … Krause 7th edition states … should be 7.17g >>

    So just to be clear, you believe yours is a counterfeit example because the weight is off? Or do you believe yours is genuine?

    Sorry it's late here and I get confused by numbers when sleepy.
    ANA LM • WBCC 429

    Amat Colligendo Focum

    Top 10FOR SALE

    image
  • 1960NYGiants1960NYGiants Posts: 3,532 ✭✭✭✭
    LochNESS:

    1st line is my description of coin in hand
    2nd line is Krause's, i.e. the catalogue states the date 1822R is counterfeit
    Gene

    Life member #369 of the Royal Canadian Numismatic Association
    Member of Canadian Association of Token Collectors

    Collector of:
    Canadian coins and pre-confederation tokens
    Darkside proof/mint sets dated 1960
    My Ebay
  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭
    But the weights are different, no? Sorry I don't have my catalog handy at the moment so I'm just going off your post. It says the weight should be 7.17 grams for the counterfeit? and all 1822R are counterfeits? And no values given (indicating it has no value). Considering your piece is about 3.3 grams light of the known counterfeit variety, I'd say it's not very collectible. But that's just my 2¢ based on my above assumptions being accurate. Maybe I am still confused about the cat listing.
    ANA LM • WBCC 429

    Amat Colligendo Focum

    Top 10FOR SALE

    image
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