Who is grading Exonumia at PCGS??

keets

I have begun to see a few PCGS encapsulated SC$'s which are either miss-attributed or contain an insert with wrongly entered information, a problem which has become all too prevalent at NGC. This isn't meant to be a criticism, more along the lines of understanding how difficult some Exonumia can be to properly identify. The "mechanical errors" will always take place but I think with the right verifiers and graders working together most wrong attribution is avoidable. Does anyone know who is currently doing the grading for PCGS?? Are the graders working in this new area for PCGS specializing or are they doing everything from HTT's to SC$'s to trade tokens to Mint Medals?? Tha would seem like a daunting task for even the best grader.

Al H.

ambro51

Ssssssshhhhhh...... I love this misattributions. It's a cherrypickers delight!

brg5658

<< <i>I have begun to see a few PCGS encapsulated SC$'s which are either miss-attributed or contain an insert with wrongly entered information, a problem which has become all too prevalent at NGC. This isn't meant to be a criticism, more along the lines of understanding how difficult some Exonumia can be to properly identify. The "mechanical errors" will always take place but I think with the right verifiers and graders working together most wrong attribution is avoidable. Does anyone know who is currently doing the grading for PCGS?? Are the graders working in this new area for PCGS specializing or are they doing everything from HTT's to SC$'s to trade tokens to Mint Medals?? Tha would seem like a daunting task for even the best grader.

Al H. >>



I think you (in your normal style) massively over-exagerate the NGC mis-attributions. I have two dozen NGC-graded SCDs in my collection, and every one is correctly identified.

I haven't seen any in PCGS holders yet, so I don't have an opinion of their ability to attribute.

Lakesammman

My (small) experience has been that NGC gets it right 80% of the time. Just wish they would pay for the round trip to correct them.

No experience with PCGS yet. I imagine it's a tough job, one that's time consuming for a relatively small reward/fee.

Broadstruck

<< <i>Ssssssshhhhhh...... I love this misattributions. It's a cherrypickers delight! >>





Last fall I told a dealer at a show in the cheap table section that his silver PCGS SC$1 was wrongly attributed and needed to be corrected.

He didn't take it well and barked at me like I was some dumb phuck.

So I agreed I might be wrong, paid him his full ask, and quickly made a hefty profit.

Weiss

I know the guys at all of the TPGs are under the gun, but there really should be some better checks and balances. It doesn't instill a feeling of confidence if the agency you're paying to certify and grade doesn't seem to know what they're looking at. That said, I haven't seen any PCGS misattributes so far.

Broadstruck

<< <i>I think you (in your normal style) massively over-exagerate the NGC mis-attributions. I have two dozen NGC-graded SCDs in my collection, and every one is correctly identified. >>



NGC has made their share of mis-attributions as on some token varieties the majority of the pop is compiled of errors.

Then again for well over a decade the exonumia market for grading was almost completely theirs.

I personally own at least 20 but knew what I was buying so the label info was irrelevant.

Treashunt

<< <i>My (small) experience has been that NGC gets it right 80% of the time. Just wish they would pay for the round trip to correct them. >>



Their error, they should pay for the mail

brg5658

I know this isn't really a valid excuse, but a large portion of the wrong attributions on exonumia in NGC holders comes from the submitters providing wrong attributions at the time of submission. Yes, NGC should catch and fix most of them, but they don't. I'm with Broadstruck -- the exonumia world is one that has largely been comprised of people who know more about what they are looking at than the slab factories. If exonumia becomes more mainstream with registry sets, and "competition" mentalities then the real problems start. People will be buying something that they know nothing about and just blindly trusted in the label/TPG.

If you're buying anything outside of normal type-coins from the USA, you had better know something about what you're doing. Else, you're bound to be disappointed when someone who does tells you that you really have a trinket, not a rarity.

keets

I know this isn't really a valid excuse

there really is no valid excuse for QUALITY CONTROL issues such as that and the type which is routinely called "mechanical error" when in reality it is human error on the data side of the equation. BTW, take a look at the "20%" comment and you may want to reassess your opinion of my normal style.

brg5658

<< <i>I know this isn't really a valid excuse

there really is no valid excuse for QUALITY CONTROL issues such as that and the type which is routinely called "mechanical error" when in reality it is human error on the data side of the equation. BTW, take a look at the "20%" comment and you may want to reassess your opinion of my normal style. >>




I think 20% must be based on a sample of 5 coins submitted, 1 was wrong? The real number is probably closer to 5%.

But, it doesn't really matter. I was just pointing out your "normal style" of dogging on NGC -- who up until the last year was the only of the two big TPGs to even attempt to grade and attribute this type of material. I seriously doubt PCGS has enough SCD submissions to merit having a specialist committed to their attribution. I would guess they have a few people who know a bit about exonumia and grade across areas like CWTs, SCDs, Medals, Conder tokens, etc. There simply aren't that many people who care about SCDs for them to justify hiring a "specialist" who sits around waiting for a SCD submission...

ambro51

Everyone is "Rushed".... No doubt more time spent studying the coin, the no doubt extensive library of Numismatic research material and "more eyes and opinions" would curtail these mistakes. Do we expect experts to know everything....YES. We Do! Only repeatedly bringing these mistakes to the attention on the issuer will help the situation. Personally, I cannot understand why with only 12 varieties, each with distinct markers...PCGS will not variety attribute a Feuchtwanger cent. I could teach an 11 year old how to do this.

keets

I was just pointing out your "normal style" of dogging on NGC

please point me to the "dogging" by posting a few links. what I have done in the past is compliment the grading that used to be the sole responsibility of Brian Silliman and has suffered pretty badly since his departure: mistakes seem to be more frequent and egregious. and like I said, some of them aren't the fault of the grader, they are a QA deficiency.