E & L Counterstamp Bust Quarters

msch1man

Heritage recently auctioned an 1815 bust quarter with the "L" counterstamp. It was housed in an NGC holder with VG details Reverse Scratches...

Heritage Auction

The obverse was pretty nice, in my opinion (probably a solid Fine grade), and I assume is what I'd look at 99% of the time if I owned it, so even though it had the scratches and a lot more wear on the reverse I did bid on this, but didn't win. I personally think whoever won this got a pretty good deal. Pretty cool to think about the mystery behind these counterstamps.

It seems like the bust quarters with the counterstamps are usually found in AU condition. In fact, there are a couple really nice looking AU ones available right now on some of the major dealers websites, but they are, understandably, much more expensive than what this one went for.

How often do they come along in the lower grades like this?

What do you guys think about this coin?

If anyone has a bust quarter with a counterstamp and wanted to share, I'd certainly enjoy seeing it.

hchcoin

I've always thought they were cool but have never owned one. I usually see a few at the major shows that are circulated and priced higher as you mentioned.

ARCO

Whoops

ARCO

I have wanted an "L" or "E" counterstamped quarter for years. I believe the "E" is the more common of the two. When I saw my first coin, they could be had for a seemingly reasonable price. Not as much these days.

JJteaparty has an AU58 that looks rather fetching. It has been sitting there unsold for a couple of months, so the price is probably on the high side.

AU58 1815 "E" counterstamped Bust Quarter

Tyler

CaptHenway

I do not recall seeing a well-circulated "L" or "E." This supports the theory that they were awards that were kept as family heirlooms, any light wear being accountable by non-numismatic mis-handling.

THis one must have gotten spent. Maybe for a dish of ice cream?

DoubleEagle59

I sent one in for grading once and it came back 'bodybagged'.

I couldn't figure that one out.

In the same submission I had a proof Morgan (very obvious to see it's a proof) and it came back "Unc details".

I could go on and on about this 'winner' submission but it's the last one I'll ever send in.

My apologies for being 'off topic'.

Quarternut

I was tracking this lot as well and was really tempted to buy it. I believe the winner got an ok deal, but not spectacular. The best thing it had going for it was the fact that it was an "L", which is the rarer of the two for 1815. The opposite is true for the 1825's, the "E" stamp is more scarce.

Until this sale, in my most current AAPR, I have only tracked seven sales of the 1815 "L" with all examples graded between MS63 and AU.

For the 1815 "E", all but one example tracked are EF - MS66. That lone example...Fine details.

There are several lower grade examples known of the 1825’s, but both 1815 & 1825 examples lean heavily towards the higher grades.

All the theories pertaining to these counterstamped issues have holes and do not stand up under scrutiny I do not believe we have found the real reason for them yet.

As far as awards...I certainly believe that this theory is incorrect. I have many examples of awards from the same time period and they are much more elaborate. These are single letters with no other information and would have quickly lost their meaning over time. Why keep something so mundane? Also, they only began appearing in numismatic channels in the 1880's and in quantity...Why?

There are several threads on here that show many counterstamped bust quarters…just do a search.

QN

Walkerguy21D

Never seen one of these in person, only the photos from Dave Bowers books.

I have seen the other ones from that hoard dug up near the old fort in NY though - I think it was just a little vertical dash from striking the
coin with a tool, not a real counterstamp. But I think NGC later slabbed some of these.

coindeuce

WG21D - correct. The coins from the Mohawk Valley Hoard out of Schenectady, N.Y. had no connection to the E an L counterstamped coins from the Economite Hoard in Pennsylvania.

Quarternut

<< <i>E an L counterstamped coins from the Economite Hoard in Pennsylvania. >>



Try to remember...this is a theory, not a fact and should be stated as such.

Sorry, but I do not agree with this theory either.

QN

scubafuel

I hadn't seen a low grade piece until you posted this one. Pretty cool.

I agree with Quarternut that these weren't awards. Cash awards get spent by kids. It seems like they surfaced late enough where bust quarters were already a novelty, and so were saved as soon as they appeared. Where they originally came from though? I'll let the authors fight it out.

I don't have one to post because they don't fit in my collection. Most BQ enthusiasts think of them as almost another die variety though, it seems.

coindeuce

"Try to remember...this is a theory, not a fact and should be stated as such."

Thanks for the clarification Mr.T. And for the record, I don't subscribe to that as fact or theory. One of the great mysteries of American numismatics. . .