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No one cares that the London Fix is falling down, falling down?
piecesofme
Posts: 6,669 ✭✭✭
On the day of it launching only 3 players have been identified...that's crazy. I suppose it's better than only the 2 that were setting it.
story from today
from a couple days ago, not much has changed to this point
This is the most important paragraph from the whole article imo:
CME are the U.S.' largest and the world's second largest futures and options exchange and we would have a concern that the new fixes are derived solely from futures trading and electronic trading rather than from actual supply and demand in the physical market
So does this mean anything changes? There's already a determined premium for physical. Does this make that "set" premium change substantially? and if so, does it tighten it or make it wider?
story from today
from a couple days ago, not much has changed to this point
This is the most important paragraph from the whole article imo:
CME are the U.S.' largest and the world's second largest futures and options exchange and we would have a concern that the new fixes are derived solely from futures trading and electronic trading rather than from actual supply and demand in the physical market
So does this mean anything changes? There's already a determined premium for physical. Does this make that "set" premium change substantially? and if so, does it tighten it or make it wider?
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
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They are dismantling it and shipping it to some hellhole in Arizona , its going to take a month or 2 at least Cut them some slack huh?
1. No one cares.
2. The "London Fix Conspiracy" was just another scheme to promote precious metals.
3. The London Fix actually helped to support prices.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
"the SHFE accounted for 48.6% of all volume last year. The Comex, meanwhile, is in sharp decline, falling from 93.4% market share as recently as 2001 to less than half that amount today.
And all that trading has led to a sharp decrease in silver inventories at the exchange. While most silver (and gold) contracts are settled in cash at the COMEX, the majority of contracts on the Shanghai exchanges are settled in physical metal. Which has led to a huge drain of silver stocks."
Due to it's method of settlement (physical instead of cash) Look for the SHFE to dominate PM futures trading and to initiate a truer price discovery method for spot prices.
Give Me Liberty or Give Me Debt
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This
MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
I don't know about that. Was out this morning and the 3 dealers I stopped in at wont sell. Ones exact words was, "I'm not selling any .999 or 90% til Monday at least to see where this thing ends up."
<< <i>1. No one cares
I don't know about that. Was out this morning and the 3 dealers I stopped in at wont sell. Ones exact words was, "I'm not selling any .999 or 90% til Monday at least to see where this thing ends up." >>
Sounds like dealers practicing #2.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>So we are going to trust the Chinese for truer price discovery? Thanks for the Friday funny. >>
It's safe to say that you can trust an exchange that settles in the real stuff (SHFE) more than you can trust an exchange that settles in paper (COMEX) to let the market decide the price of the real stuff. Question is will the Easterners, who continue to stockpile PM, desire to maintain low prices in order to continue their hoarding. In the long term it doesn't matter if they do because they would not be hoarding if they felt low prices were justified or if they felt they would remain low. After all, prices are quoted in a currency. Like any disciplined stacker it's actually a matter of what they think the future holds for currencies, not what it holds for PM. In other words, as I have said many times, currency weakness is the key to PM strength. THIS is what makes PMs a store of value when currencies grow weak.
The only important question that one must answer when contemplating the future of PMs is "what is the future of my currency?" This appears to be where you and I really differ.
Give Me Liberty or Give Me Debt
Sounds like a convenient way for the Chinese to eventually confiscate physical holdings.
The only important question that one must answer when contemplating the future of PMs is "what is the future of my currency?" This appears to be where you and I really differ.
Dollars and Euros are currency. Gold and silver are assets no different that stocks or real estate or rare coins, paintings or other artifacts that are priced in currencies.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>It's safe to say that you can trust an exchange that settles in the real stuff (SHFE) more than you can trust an exchange that settles in paper (COMEX)
Sounds like a convenient way for the Chinese to eventually confiscate physical holdings.
The only important question that one must answer when contemplating the future of PMs is "what is the future of my currency?" This appears to be where you and I really differ.
Dollars and Euros are currency. Gold and silver are assets no different that stocks or real estate or rare coins, paintings or other artifacts that are priced in currencies. >>
I'd say the numismatic (collector) portion of physical gold and silver are assets (the perceived value-added of the form in which they're wrought).
The metals themselves are more like commodities, and more like elements such as copper or iron, than complex softs such as oil, wheat, cotton, or frozen concentrated orange juice.
Of course, gold, silver and copper coins and bars have long histories as coinage metals by way of convenience. Now they're treated as fetish items among hoarders and the traders serving them, also not all that different in psychology from the art and antique segments with which they share significant overlap of emotion and devotion.
the London fix may matter less and less to purveyers and customers, while more and more attention is devoted to differentiation of the forms to generate sales to collectors
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
They can do 10x the volume of comex but if there are no or minuscule foreign participants, what difference does it make to the planet?
<< <i>How many non-PRC participants are there on the SHFE?
They can do 10x the volume of comex but if there are no or minuscule foreign participants, what difference does it make to the planet? >>
IMO, volume trumps number of players. The exchange leading in volume will lead in price discovery.
Give Me Liberty or Give Me Debt
If they want to fix at a time when globex is open, what can they do? Lipstick on a pig that wears off seconds later as the market moves.
I knew it would happen.
Button, button….
Who's got the button ?
Tin Roof
rusted
I care, too.
Everytime one of u buys silver anywhere at anytime, u have created you own "fix"...
Jeesh people get all riled up over nuthin...
I don't know if this link has been posted yet in the thread more on the FIX
For some reason a number of posts in the thread are invisible to me on the main page it says 19 posts but I can only see 15
Apparently someone(s) did care.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Apparently someone(s) did care
It's is/was a much biger deal than some cared about here. It's still a significant subject being talked about amongst local dealers when I visit.