just curious, does PCGS do a sniffer test for bakelite?
oreville
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Here is a PCGS slabbed 1942 experimental cent pattern made of bakelite. it is a pop one in all grades.
I wonder if the PCGS "sniffer" was able to detect the bakelite smell?
Wonderful picture taking by Todd.
I wonder if the PCGS "sniffer" was able to detect the bakelite smell?
Wonderful picture taking by Todd.
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Did you do a sniff test because I have wondered what bakelite smells like?
More seriously, I presume that pattern is your coin. It's exceedingly cool, but that's the case for all your "modern" patterns!!
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<< <i>Not necessary. A mass spectrometer would identify the composition of such. I would be very surprised if PCGS did not have a mass spectrometer as one of their authentication tools. >>
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a mass spec require a small sample of the material?
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Eric
if Mr. Reiver says it was bakelite, who am I to question him!
Eric
bakelite be minted in a coin press ? I thought is
was more like brittle plastic. Im not sure you can
even grade it like MS etc ? Does it even wear out?
<< <i>Here is a PCGS slabbed 1942 experimental cent pattern made of bakelite. it is a pop one in all grades.
I wonder if the PCGS "sniffer" was able to detect the bakelite smell?
Wonderful picture taking by Todd.
>>
The sniffer does not detect chemical compounds by smell, odor, etc. It detects them by their characteristic infrared spectrum. The spectrum obtained is compared with the infrared spectrum of known authentic reference material. The "sniffer" is merely a slang/figure of speech name.
I found this little tidbit that's more akin to how the sniffer goes.
<<"A good auditor can sniff out the problems an accountant has disguised.">>
<< <i>Not necessary. A mass spectrometer would identify the composition of such. I would be very surprised if PCGS did not have a mass spectrometer as one of their authentication tools. >>
I'd bet that PCGS does not have a mass spectrometer. Would be of very little use to them. The gal who was in charge of the U. S. Mint quality program said that they were ordering a mass spectrometer [which was put on hold due to sequestration] to investigate the milk spotting of ASEs. My question was why, it isn't a very useful tool for the job.
<< <i>Interesting coin, how were they made ? Can
bakelite be minted in a coin press ? I thought is
was more like brittle plastic. Im not sure you can
even grade it like MS etc ? Does it even wear out? >>
Bakelite is moldable until you heat it, at which time it sets permanently. It is called a thermosetting plastic, because once set by heat it can't be softened; it just chars. Thermoplastics OTOH can be softened by heat.
<< <i> The gal who was in charge of the U. S. Mint quality program said that they were ordering a mass spectrometer [which was put on hold due to sequestration] to investigate the milk spotting of ASEs. My question was why, it isn't a very useful tool for the job. >>
I agree. I just can't see buying an instrument that costly to run milk spot material through. Don't all ASE milk spots have the same chemical composition?
Far more cost effective just to send some milk spot material out to a lab that specializes in such things.
We use tandem Mass specs where I work and we pay several hundred thousand for each instrument (although a good chunk of that cost is the "service contract" to keep them tuned and running well).
Very useful tool for many other applications though, we can run a cocaine sample thru those puppies and tell LE exactly what valley in Bolivia the coca was grown in.
<< <i>
<< <i> The gal who was in charge of the U. S. Mint quality program said that they were ordering a mass spectrometer [which was put on hold due to sequestration] to investigate the milk spotting of ASEs. My question was why, it isn't a very useful tool for the job. >>
I agree. I just can't see buying an instrument that costly to run milk spot material through. Don't all ASE milk spots have the same chemical composition?
Far more cost effective just to send some milk spot material out to a lab that specializes in such things.
We use tandem Mass specs where I work and we pay several hundred thousand for each instrument (although a good chunk of that cost is the "service contract" to keep them tuned and running well).
Very useful tool for many other applications though, we can run a cocaine sample thru those puppies and tell LE exactly what valley in Bolivia the coca was grown in. >>
She moved out of that role so I have no idea where that stands. According to my contact at Iowa State/Ames Lab, a special technique would be needed for running silver chloride and they don't have the capability. The technique best suited for that is ESCA aka xps. It is non-destructive and there are commercial labs that can do that and have sample ports large enough to hold an ASE.
There was a guy with one of the hand held devices at a Baltimore show about 2 years ago and he had a table and was doing demos - wish he was still there at the shows. Does anybody know his name??
Sorry to pirate the thread a bit...
Well, just Love coins, period.
<< <i>The gal who was in charge of the U. S. Mint quality program said that they were ordering a mass spectrometer [which was put on hold due to sequestration] to investigate the milk spotting of ASEs. My question was why, it isn't a very useful tool for the job. >>
How typical of the U.S. Govt. I'm sure the U.S. already own's countless mass specs but Heaven forbid the agencies share anything between them or ask another to use something.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.