Cards that are naturally in bad condition

DezHood

Can anyone think of a better example than the 1958 Topps Jim Brown rookie?

I've never seen one I thought was nice - even the ones that have high technical grades. The ones I've seen have some degree of snow,sugar, splotches, print dots, print defects, whatever you choose to call the mess. Does anyone have one they think is nice? Anyone have a theory as to why? I don't know much about the set, but I don't recall the set as one that is known for issues (like 48 Leaf for example).

Finally, does anyone have examples of other cards like this? (any sport) Thanks.

biggmacc

All Candy and Caramel issues. Many of them come with sugar stains because they came in packages of... Sugary candy.

Dboneesq

I'd say the 1954 Dan-Dee Baseball Cards in general are in tough condition, as they were issued in bags of Potato Chips. LOTS of the cards had grease and oil on them.

LarkinCollector

75 Hostess Twinkies, almost all are stained with whatever they preserve Twinkies with.

DanBessette

<< <i>75 Hostess Twinkies, almost all are stained with whatever they preserve Twinkies with. >>



Famaldehyde

CW

My vote would go to any Venezuelan card -- they're always beaters, and a "4" is considered high grade.

My Jim Brown is not perfect, as it does have a bit of snow and the surface has a natural texture that you can't see in the scan, but it's pretty close...

SDSportsFan

1914 Cracker Jack. Unlike the 1915 set, the 1914s were only available individually in the boxes of Cracker Jack. The cards were unprotected, so they came in direct contact with the candy.

Steve

Gemyanks10

1980 Topps Dave Winfield. Black background that usually produces tons of ink blotces and fisheyes. Any card I've ever pulled of his have been extremely off center and tilted also. Just a very very tough card that I've noticed.

Jimmy

miwlvrn

1946 Montiel

jmoran19

the mid 50's wilson franks cards come to mind, meat juice ruined a lot of them

shagrotn77

This may be the nicest Jim Brown rookie I've ever seen:

NickM

R308.
You spit on them to develop the card image. The last time I checked, none were above a PSA 5 - and technical grade doesn't ensure that you have a strong, deep image.

1982 FBI Discs, which were the bottom of a six-pack carton, are insanely tough in anything over G-VG condition.

Along the lines of the Propagandas Montiel (very thin paper stock plus tropical humidity) are 1972 Topps Venezuelan stickers (ignore the pop report, as counterfeits slipped by PSA - there was a thread about it) and 1977 Topps Venezuelan stickers, which were originally cut to have a tiny bottom border, and so are frequently miscut to go with everything else.

Nick

DezHood

Thanks for all the great replies. And a couple nice Jim Brown rookies. The 8.5 is the first one I've seen without any snow. I thought someone would mention the Fernando Valenzuela rookie - Dmitri Young made a point on that one. Thanks Again.

bobbyw8469

Here are nice lower grade Brown's that look really nice. You can get nice looking low grade copies without spending a small fortune on a high grade specimen....

DezHood

Nice cards! You want to sell the 5.5 since you already have the 6 Seriously, I've been looking at 5s wanting to spend about 300, I lost a couple auctions but my heart hasn't been in it since I haven't seen one I like much.

bobbyw8469

The 5.5 is not for sale, but if it were I would sure want to get more than $300. VCP is $400 and a nicer copy with less issues should bring more than that.

wrestlingcardking

For me the strip cards from the 1920s, Topps Magic Photos from 1948, the Parkhurst wrestling cards from 1954 and 1955, and the Scanlen wrestling cards from 1986 are always tough. An honorable mention to the market scene cards from 1989-90 too.

vintageinvestments

Dan Dees are first thought, Hunter's Weiners, Wilson Franks, all for obvious reasons.

grote15

1975 Topps mini Tommy Davis. There's only been one 9 graded and that one was a slider. An impossible card to find centered with no PD.

JHS5120

My first thought were 1960's Topps Tattoo cards. In order to open the pack you need to rip the card. =/

DezHood

<< <i>The 5.5 is not for sale, but if it were I would sure want to get more than $300. VCP is $400 and a nicer copy with less issues should bring more than that. >>



Right, I didn't say 300 for the 5.5 - I said around 300 for a 5 - they are auctioned frequently on eBay, so VCP isn't needed. The half grades are tough to price because there is less data.

Scottiec2288

I would go 72 Staubach rookie card. If by luck you find one centered it usually has specs or out of register. There is a psa 9 on ebay for 4,000 and is out of register ( yellow name ) and centering not the greatest. It took me over 5 years searching shows and ebay finally got the nicest one I have ever seen. Pete rose rookie has lots of issues too.

ClockworkAngel

Nice thread. This is exactly why I love looking for high grade cards. It's all those minor idiosycrincies with various cards from the 1980's and back that make the satisfaction of finding that Mint copy so rewarding.

I'm not sure how we are defining naturally bad condition. Some cards that come to mind:
1971 Topps Thurman Munson. Notoriously off centered.
1976 Topps George Brett: corner card on the sheet, centering issues as well as constant print defects
1978 topps molitor/trammel the well known blotch and ink run on the word shortstops as well as centering issues
1981 topps Fernando Valenzuela rc-No 10's says it all. Something about the images always seem to cause registrations issues and weird photos
1980-1981 topps bird/magic legendary print defects

miwlvrn

Surprised not to see 1973 OPC no. 1 Ruth/Aaron/Mays on this list yet.

For that matter, there are actually a lot of OPC cards that could be added here, just that the 1973 no. 1 is more famous than most of the other ones that could be mentioned.

ClockworkAngel

<< <i>Surprised not to see 1973 OPC no. 1 Ruth/Aaron/Mays on this list yet.

For that matter, there are actually a lot of OPC cards that could be added here, just that the 1973 no. 1 is more famous than most of the other ones that could be mentioned. >>



I think across the board 1970's OPC qualifies....kind of like 1971 Topps across the board

jmaciu

<< <i>

<< <i>Surprised not to see 1973 OPC no. 1 Ruth/Aaron/Mays on this list yet.

For that matter, there are actually a lot of OPC cards that could be added here, just that the 1973 no. 1 is more famous than most of the other ones that could be mentioned. >>



I think across the board 1970's OPC qualifies....kind of like 1971 Topps across the board >>



+1

I have picked up a lot of OPC in the last 6 months, and I am convinced that some cards cannot be found centered or without printing issues. If you think a 1976 Topps Brett is tough, a 1976 OPC Brett in anywhere close to NM/M is impossible.

gemint

<< <i>Surprised not to see 1973 OPC no. 1 Ruth/Aaron/Mays on this list yet.

For that matter, there are actually a lot of OPC cards that could be added here, just that the 1973 no. 1 is more famous than most of the other ones that could be mentioned. >>



Try finding the Topps version that has both front and back well centered. They don't exist.

miwlvrn

Couldn't even begin to speculate on how high an auction might go for a 1968 OPC Nolan Ryan graded as a PSA 8.5, 9 and 10. I suppose the sales prices would be 8.5 = vacation, 9 = car, 10 = house.

With none higher than an 8 for a 1968 OPC 177 but an 8 still being achievable, "naturally bad condition" is relative. Compare that to there only being 3 total cards from the 1946 Montiels that received a 4 grade, with none higher than that.

ClockworkAngel

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>Surprised not to see 1973 OPC no. 1 Ruth/Aaron/Mays on this list yet.

For that matter, there are actually a lot of OPC cards that could be added here, just that the 1973 no. 1 is more famous than most of the other ones that could be mentioned. >>



I think across the board 1970's OPC qualifies....kind of like 1971 Topps across the board >>



+1

I have picked up a lot of OPC in the last 6 months, and I am convinced that some cards cannot be found centered or without printing issues. If you think a 1976 Topps Brett is tough, a 1976 OPC Brett in anywhere close to NM/M is impossible. >>



Oddly enough, I believe there are 2 OPC 1976 Brett 10's out there and no Topps....

ClockworkAngel

<< <i>Couldn't even begin to speculate on how high an auction might go for a 1968 OPC Nolan Ryan graded as a PSA 8.5, 9 and 10. I suppose the sales prices would be 8.5 = vacation, 9 = car, 10 = house.

With none higher than an 8 for a 1968 OPC 177 but an 8 still being achievable, "naturally bad condition" is relative. Compare that to there only being 3 total cards from the 1946 Montiels that received a 4 grade, with none higher than that. >>



You would think it would be through the roof, but it would likely disappoint. Take it from someone that just sold a bunch of 1970's HOF RC's OPC in PSA 9 or 10....OPC just hasn't caught on. I sold a Murray 10 (pop 3), an Ozzie 10 (Pop 3), and a Yount (Pop 3)

Disappointing results across the board...

miwlvrn

I don't know, I'd say I've had some good results overall w/ OPC, with more on the better-than-expected end vs. under what I hoped for.

I had a PSA 6 1971 OPC Baker/Baylor go for $399 not that long ago and I didn't think it would go over $250, being mid-grade instead of high. 10's are rare, but there are a heck of a lot more total cards out there for the years like a '78 Murray or '79 Ozzie than there are for earlier sets (except maybe 1973 and 1st series 1972).

OPC is definitely a niche market and you have to be lucky to find the interested buyers at the same time as each other. I've had PSA 7's for 1967 OPC go for $30 sometimes when others went near $300 just because two people were bidding against each other at the right time in the latter case.

jmaciu

I agree that it is hard to get a read on OPC prices, and in my case, it has been from a buying point of view. I was bidding recently on a 1971 PSA 9 McCovey, and the bidding went way out of control in the last minute. But, I picked up a very nice 78 Murray for a really nice price. The 71's are truly coveted based on what I've seen, weather it me Topps or OPC.

everythingcollector

1983 opc tony gwynn comes to mind that card is never perfectly centered with out some sort of tilt problem. I think gwynns opc rookie is much more valuable then his topps if u could ever find a perfectly centered opc gwynn rookie

bishop

1923 Fleer, 1948 Topps Magic Photos, 1955 Topps Hocus Focus, and 1956 Topps Hocus Focus and Topps 1968 Plaks, Topps 61 Rub offs, Topps 65 Embossed...and Don Mossi on anything