Ensisheim Double Talers

Zohar

Ensisheim was part of the early Habsburg hereditary possessions in Alsace (now France, prior Germany). One unique unrelated fact was that on 7 November 1492, a 250 pound meteorite fell there, and since then it has attracted many meteorite enthusiasts.

Archduke Ferdinand (1564-1595) issued single and multiple talers at the Ensisheim mint. Relatively low mintage and somewhat similar designs to the Hall Mint types across the Habsburg emperors. I had been looking for a double Taler (50mm) for years and was only recently able to find an AU-55 at the Eric Newman auction. I thought that this is a major milestoine as I had not seen many in auction books which looked better and then I run across the finest graded AU-58 piece. I decided to purchase it through a partial trade as I really liked the look of it and it is of a different die variety. So now I have two of these, and while it doesn't make sense to keep them both, I think I will given the long wait and natural look for both.

EPN NGC AU-55 piece



NGC AU-58 (2 sets of images)

Iosephus

Nice coins, their large size must make them quite impressive in person!

I noticed the prominent die cracks on both coins. Are these double taler pieces prone to such die issues due to their large size?

Zohar

They look relatively small as NGC placed them in the HUGE holder... they are very nice large pieces.

Die/planchet flaws/cracks are common in larger flan given the pressure applied and one side tends to be weaker in strike given the inherent curvature. Getting these in a pristine condition is therefore a challenge.

STLNATS

I've always liked multiples - big, heavy and lots of room for well laid out and interesting designs - and these are real honeys. I only have a couple of German ones and not really a focus so maybe in my next life.

Congrats and thanks for sharing these beauties.

EVillageProwler

Based only on the images, I think the EPN piece is the nicer of the two and looks AU58 to me.

Remember that the EPN pieces are fresh and only been through the TPG mill once in his lifetime.

EVP

Zohar

They are both nice and "fresh" in terms of grading, yet bear in mind that NGC imaged the EPN while I imaged the newp. I will get it done professionally and then share. The second to me has an even nicer look in hand.

lordmarcovan

I think I feel a slight bout of Thalermania coming on. Zohar posts often have that effect.

But sometimes it's like reading a smeagle1795 post... territory that a mere smaller-budget mortal won't be able to explore as much.

JCMhouston

Nice addition Z, and nothing wrong with holding on to a dupe for a high grade scarce coin.

marcmoish

Hey I'm going to agree with you Z if you needed to pick one it would be the 58 versus the EPN piece ..nor do I agree with its grade.

Your 58 is an amazing example - tuck it under your pillow

But better pics might twist this jmho somewhat

worldcoinguy

Congrats - two double talers is quite an accomplishment. Do they share a Davenport number, or are they considered different issues? I only ask because of the high number of die differences on the obverse.

Zohar

Thanks. I will research this week as Davenport doesnt map to the individual die level. Voglhuber and Moser Tursky and I will get the exact die variety listed.

Tibor

Are these twice the size of their little brothers? Were the "little brothers" circulating
legal tender or special issue NCLT? I believe these might also be called Doppelters.

Zohar

1) Circulation, not double size, yet double weight. Thicker medal and larger diameter of 48mm.
2) Doppeltalers indeed.

Tibor

Did these then circulate or just have cabinet friction?
Were these then struck for visiting dignitaries and
to be presented as gifts?

Zohar

These were circulation issues in general. Specifically, difficult to tell, as it seems to have some wear in fields. Perhaps minor circulation, perhaps some ongoing cabinet friction over 400 years.

Choice Uncirculated they look like this

Tookybandit

Beautiful! I enjoy your posts!

Zohar

Thank you Tooky!