<< <i>I wonder who will be the first to advocate building a pipeline and sucking the Great Lakes dry! Not like someone hasn't already thought about it.
Maybe desalination from the Pacific Ocean, but it can consume a lot of energy. >>
Old saying when I lived in Detroit was...they can have all the water they want, as long it is packed in Stroh's cans.
I'd like to have someone write me a check for NOT selling coins, currency or bullion.
Yup. Cousin-in-law got paid 100% of revenue, not profits, *revenue*... to not plant his land last year.
I say let the farmers make it like the rest of us. And the real farmers I know, agree. This garbage of people not paying their bills and pretending to be poor has got to stop.
<< <i>As an example, without subsidies for milk, the price would be close to $10/gallon. I guess I wouldn't mind paying that personally, but this and other subsidies are a way to keep rising prices of food from causing runaway inflation. Once food rises, then wages must follow, otherwise there would be food riots like in 1857 New York. So, it is Congress' way of placating the masses. All Government's (except Somalia, I guess) has some form of subsidies for critical industries. >>
There are many milk exporting countries that can produce milk at less than $2/gallon with no subsidies. They do that here in Australia and across the Tasman in New Zealand. Our milk is of a high standard and our wages are higher than yours, so why would American farmers need $10/gallon? BTW I support targeted drought relief (and other exceptional disaster assistance) as farming is a critical strategic industry and even the most efficient farmers can be set back by an extended drought. If farmers send their core breeding stock to slaughter then the loss of genetics can harm the recovery. Same with keeping fruit growers in the industry, if they are forced out by financial ruin in a drought then the critical mass of growers needed after the drought to provide throughput to the local processor is lost. Then the processor shuts and then even the most efficient of farmers lose their outlet. But permanent subsidies are wrong.
<< <i>As an example, without subsidies for milk, the price would be close to $10/gallon. I guess I wouldn't mind paying that personally, but this and other subsidies are a way to keep rising prices of food from causing runaway inflation. Once food rises, then wages must follow, otherwise there would be food riots like in 1857 New York. So, it is Congress' way of placating the masses. All Government's (except Somalia, I guess) has some form of subsidies for critical industries. >>
Without subsidies not to plant/produce supply would be greater; law of supply and demand dictates prices should be less. Keep in mind that subsidies are fought for and awarded by elected officials to give their producing constiuents higher prices. The arugment for subsidies is that it keeps prices stable, even if artifically high. Volatility in food production prices could easily wipe out some producers in a market that saw extremely high supply in a given season. Subsidies are about controlling supply which stabalizes prices. While subsidies result in higher prices try to imagine what would happen to prices if the number of producers were to drop. Even with subsidies there is still healthy competition.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>As an example, without subsidies for milk, the price would be close to $10/gallon. I guess I wouldn't mind paying that personally, but this and other subsidies are a way to keep rising prices of food from causing runaway inflation. Once food rises, then wages must follow, otherwise there would be food riots like in 1857 New York. So, it is Congress' way of placating the masses. All Government's (except Somalia, I guess) has some form of subsidies for critical industries. >>
There are many milk exporting countries that can produce milk at less than $2/gallon with no subsidies. They do that here in Australia and across the Tasman in New Zealand. Our milk is of a high standard and our wages are higher than yours, so why would American farmers need $10/gallon? BTW I support targeted drought relief (and other exceptional disaster assistance) as farming is a critical strategic industry and even the most efficient farmers can be set back by an extended drought. If farmers send their core breeding stock to slaughter then the loss of genetics can harm the recovery. Same with keeping fruit growers in the industry, if they are forced out by financial ruin in a drought then the critical mass of growers needed after the drought to provide throughput to the local processor is lost. Then the processor shuts and then even the most efficient of farmers lose their outlet. But permanent subsidies are wrong. >>
The dairy farmers in USA usually get around $1.30 to $1.50 / gallon. It is during extended periods below $1 / gallon which really puts a strain on them, increasing their accounts payable and effectively dropping their acquired net worth. After leaving the farm there are hauling charges, processing, distribution, and sales which increases the price paid by consumers for dairy products. Normal supply and demand does not work very well in the dairy market because a 10% over supply will drop the price on the farm in half. Grocery stores selling also realize that milk sold is almost independant of selling price so they have no incentive to lower price when their costs drop. The time taken to match supply and demand is not fast because milk production is on a yearly season cycle as lactation cycles of cows.
But this thread is about bailing out crop farmers in CA because they have no water (although many CA dairies will be hurting/done if they have no water for cattle to drink).
A 10% oversupply of my product would crash global markets by 90+%, yet somehow I get by. Farmers can do the same as me. That's where the problem for these situation arises. Government picking winners and losers.
<< <i>A 10% oversupply of my product would crash global markets by 90+%, yet somehow I get by. Farmers can do the same as me. That's where the problem for these situation arises. Government picking winners and losers. >>
I can live with out to big to fail banks. I can not live with out food.
<< <i>A 10% oversupply of my product would crash global markets by 90+%, yet somehow I get by. Farmers can do the same as me. That's where the problem for these situation arises. Government picking winners and losers. >>
I can live with out to big to fail banks. I can not live with out food. >>
USA is a vast land with ample fertile ground to feed the nation. A report a few years ago showed that the total nutritional crop value per capita was 440 calories.
Somehow, some way, with this great resource, anyone willing to earn a living will be able to purchase ample food for themselves and family, without the corrupt hand of government interference.
<< <i>USA is a vast land with ample fertile ground to feed the nation. A report a few years ago showed that the total nutritional crop value per capita was 440 calories. Somehow, some way, with this great resource, anyone willing to earn a living will be able to purchase ample food for themselves and family, without the slimy hand of government interference. >>
But only if there is a farmer with the knowledge and expertise to make use of all that fertile land. How many people do you know, given a piece of fertile land, would even be able to feed themselves? Most people today have never planted and nurtured a vegetable to maturity, they depend on Publix to do it for them.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>USA is a vast land with ample fertile ground to feed the nation. A report a few years ago showed that the total nutritional crop value per capita was 440 calories. Somehow, some way, with this great resource, anyone willing to earn a living will be able to purchase ample food for themselves and family, without the slimy hand of government interference. >>
But only if there is a farmer with the knowledge and expertise to make use of all that fertile land. How many people do you know, given a piece of fertile land, would even be able to feed themselves? Most people today have never planted and nurtured a vegetable to maturity, they depend on Publix to do it for them. >>
Pretty much everyone I know could grow enough food if they had the land available.
Much of the City of Detroit is now farm land. Some organic, which is better for the local folks that a bag of genetically engineered Cheetohs.
<< <i>Pretty much everyone I know could grow enough food if they had the land available. >>
Pretty much everyone you know does have land available, even if it is only their back yard. How many of them are growing food and how many of them are depending on Publix to grow it for them?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>Pretty much everyone I know could grow enough food if they had the land available. >>
Pretty much everyone you know does have land available, even if it is only their back yard. How many of them are growing food and how many of them are depending on Publix to grow it for them? >>
Derryb, your first question was could they and my answer is yes.
Your second question is do they? Back in Michigan where I am from, at least 3/4 of those that I know well do have gardens and grow some of their food. Most though purchase most of their groceries at anywhere from Whole Foods to Kroger. Publix is not in that market, I do not believe.
It Arizona, growing is a bit trickier though certainly not impossible. Many folks here have citrus trees that produce large quantities on Oranges, lemons and Grapefruit. An acquaintance from some years ago grew Pistachios on their land.
Certainly the large commercial farmers are quite efficient at getting calories to the table. Quality of those Round Up Ready crops though are questionable in my view.
I guess my point is that if it ever comes to every man for himself, many will not be able to feed themselves, primarily because they depended on others to provide the basic necessities and never learned how to do it themselves.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>I guess my point is that if it ever comes to every man for himself, many will not be able to feed themselves, primarily because they depended on others to provide the basic necessities and never learned how to do it themselves. >>
True. We have ceded our place on the farm for a cubicle, a healthcare plan and lungfulls of smog.
More importantly we gave up our independence so that we can jump on cue as high as the boss demands.
Presidents are selected in Iowa. Much more important state in the nomination process than NY, Fla, Tx, or Calif. Ask Obama.
You want Iowans mad at your party? I didn't think so. Better help the farmers.
Obama (the liberal and wealth redistribution guy) increased the Estate Tax exemption from $1 million to over $5 million. Nobody wants to pay estate tax on that big family farm.
<< <i>Presidents are selected in Iowa. Much more important state in the nomination process than NY, Fla, Tx, or Calif. Ask Obama.
You want Iowans mad at your party? I didn't think so. Better help the farmers.
Obama (the liberal and wealth redistribution guy) increased the Estate Tax exemption from $1 million to over $5 million. Nobody wants to pay estate tax on that big family farm.
Ethanol? Gotta sell more corn at a higher price! >>
Ethanol is a joke. I wouldn't put that crap into my coaster wagon.
I have had farmer clients who whine and complain about big government who ( there is a website to check ) receive MILLIONS from the federal government in handouts. Millions.
Comments
Maybe desalination from the Pacific Ocean, but it can consume a lot of energy.
Box of 20
<< <i>I wonder who will be the first to advocate building a pipeline and sucking the Great Lakes dry! Not like someone hasn't already thought about it.
Maybe desalination from the Pacific Ocean, but it can consume a lot of energy. >>
Old saying when I lived in Detroit was...they can have all the water they want, as long it is packed in Stroh's cans.
That was before Stroh's bailed and left Detroit.
Yup. Cousin-in-law got paid 100% of revenue, not profits, *revenue*... to not plant his land last year.
I say let the farmers make it like the rest of us. And the real farmers I know, agree. This garbage of people not paying their bills and pretending to be poor has got to stop.
<< <i>As an example, without subsidies for milk, the price would be close to $10/gallon. I guess I wouldn't mind paying that personally, but this and other subsidies are a way to keep rising prices of food from causing runaway inflation. Once food rises, then wages must follow, otherwise there would be food riots like in 1857 New York. So, it is Congress' way of placating the masses. All Government's (except Somalia, I guess) has some form of subsidies for critical industries. >>
There are many milk exporting countries that can produce milk at less than $2/gallon with no subsidies. They do that here in Australia and across the Tasman in New Zealand. Our milk is of a high standard and our wages are higher than yours, so why would American farmers need $10/gallon?
BTW I support targeted drought relief (and other exceptional disaster assistance) as farming is a critical strategic industry and even the most efficient farmers can be set back by an extended drought. If farmers send their core breeding stock to slaughter then the loss of genetics can harm the recovery. Same with keeping fruit growers in the industry, if they are forced out by financial ruin in a drought then the critical mass of growers needed after the drought to provide throughput to the local processor is lost. Then the processor shuts and then even the most efficient of farmers lose their outlet.
But permanent subsidies are wrong.
<< <i>As an example, without subsidies for milk, the price would be close to $10/gallon. I guess I wouldn't mind paying that personally, but this and other subsidies are a way to keep rising prices of food from causing runaway inflation. Once food rises, then wages must follow, otherwise there would be food riots like in 1857 New York. So, it is Congress' way of placating the masses. All Government's (except Somalia, I guess) has some form of subsidies for critical industries. >>
Without subsidies not to plant/produce supply would be greater; law of supply and demand dictates prices should be less. Keep in mind that subsidies are fought for and awarded by elected officials to give their producing constiuents higher prices. The arugment for subsidies is that it keeps prices stable, even if artifically high. Volatility in food production prices could easily wipe out some producers in a market that saw extremely high supply in a given season. Subsidies are about controlling supply which stabalizes prices. While subsidies result in higher prices try to imagine what would happen to prices if the number of producers were to drop. Even with subsidies there is still healthy competition.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>As an example, without subsidies for milk, the price would be close to $10/gallon. I guess I wouldn't mind paying that personally, but this and other subsidies are a way to keep rising prices of food from causing runaway inflation. Once food rises, then wages must follow, otherwise there would be food riots like in 1857 New York. So, it is Congress' way of placating the masses. All Government's (except Somalia, I guess) has some form of subsidies for critical industries. >>
There are many milk exporting countries that can produce milk at less than $2/gallon with no subsidies. They do that here in Australia and across the Tasman in New Zealand. Our milk is of a high standard and our wages are higher than yours, so why would American farmers need $10/gallon?
BTW I support targeted drought relief (and other exceptional disaster assistance) as farming is a critical strategic industry and even the most efficient farmers can be set back by an extended drought. If farmers send their core breeding stock to slaughter then the loss of genetics can harm the recovery. Same with keeping fruit growers in the industry, if they are forced out by financial ruin in a drought then the critical mass of growers needed after the drought to provide throughput to the local processor is lost. Then the processor shuts and then even the most efficient of farmers lose their outlet.
But permanent subsidies are wrong. >>
The dairy farmers in USA usually get around $1.30 to $1.50 / gallon. It is during extended periods below $1 / gallon which really puts a strain on them, increasing their accounts payable and effectively dropping their acquired net worth. After leaving the farm there are hauling charges, processing, distribution, and sales which increases the price paid by consumers for dairy products. Normal supply and demand does not work very well in the dairy market because a 10% over supply will drop the price on the farm in half. Grocery stores selling also realize that milk sold is almost independant of selling price so they have no incentive to lower price when their costs drop. The time taken to match supply and demand is not fast because milk production is on a yearly season cycle as lactation cycles of cows.
But this thread is about bailing out crop farmers in CA because they have no water (although many CA dairies will be hurting/done if they have no water for cattle to drink).
<< <i>A 10% oversupply of my product would crash global markets by 90+%, yet somehow I get by. Farmers can do the same as me. That's where the problem for these situation arises. Government picking winners and losers. >>
I can live with out to big to fail banks. I can not live with out food.
<< <i>
<< <i>A 10% oversupply of my product would crash global markets by 90+%, yet somehow I get by. Farmers can do the same as me. That's where the problem for these situation arises. Government picking winners and losers. >>
I can live with out to big to fail banks. I can not live with out food. >>
USA is a vast land with ample fertile ground to feed the nation. A report a few years ago showed that the total nutritional crop value per capita was 440 calories.
Somehow, some way, with this great resource, anyone willing to earn a living will be able to purchase ample food for themselves and family, without the corrupt hand of government interference.
<< <i>USA is a vast land with ample fertile ground to feed the nation. A report a few years ago showed that the total nutritional crop value per capita was 440 calories. Somehow, some way, with this great resource, anyone willing to earn a living will be able to purchase ample food for themselves and family, without the slimy hand of government interference. >>
But only if there is a farmer with the knowledge and expertise to make use of all that fertile land. How many people do you know, given a piece of fertile land, would even be able to feed themselves? Most people today have never planted and nurtured a vegetable to maturity, they depend on Publix to do it for them.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>USA is a vast land with ample fertile ground to feed the nation. A report a few years ago showed that the total nutritional crop value per capita was 440 calories. Somehow, some way, with this great resource, anyone willing to earn a living will be able to purchase ample food for themselves and family, without the slimy hand of government interference. >>
But only if there is a farmer with the knowledge and expertise to make use of all that fertile land. How many people do you know, given a piece of fertile land, would even be able to feed themselves? Most people today have never planted and nurtured a vegetable to maturity, they depend on Publix to do it for them. >>
Pretty much everyone I know could grow enough food if they had the land available.
Much of the City of Detroit is now farm land. Some organic, which is better for the local folks that a bag of genetically engineered Cheetohs.
Please read
<< <i>Pretty much everyone I know could grow enough food if they had the land available. >>
Pretty much everyone you know does have land available, even if it is only their back yard. How many of them are growing food and how many of them are depending on Publix to grow it for them?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>Pretty much everyone I know could grow enough food if they had the land available. >>
Pretty much everyone you know does have land available, even if it is only their back yard. How many of them are growing food and how many of them are depending on Publix to grow it for them? >>
Derryb, your first question was could they and my answer is yes.
Your second question is do they? Back in Michigan where I am from, at least 3/4 of those that I know well do have gardens and grow some of their food. Most though purchase most of their groceries at anywhere from Whole Foods to Kroger. Publix is not in that market, I do not believe.
It Arizona, growing is a bit trickier though certainly not impossible. Many folks here have citrus trees that produce large quantities on Oranges, lemons and Grapefruit. An acquaintance from some years ago grew Pistachios on their land.
Certainly the large commercial farmers are quite efficient at getting calories to the table. Quality of those Round Up Ready crops though are questionable in my view.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>I guess my point is that if it ever comes to every man for himself, many will not be able to feed themselves, primarily because they depended on others to provide the basic necessities and never learned how to do it themselves. >>
True. We have ceded our place on the farm for a cubicle, a healthcare plan and lungfulls of smog.
More importantly we gave up our independence so that we can jump on cue as high as the boss demands.
Well....not all of us.
Ask Obama.
You want Iowans mad at your party?
I didn't think so. Better help the farmers.
Obama (the liberal and wealth redistribution guy) increased the Estate Tax exemption from
$1 million to over $5 million. Nobody wants to pay estate tax on that big family farm.
Ethanol? Gotta sell more corn at a higher price!
<< <i>Presidents are selected in Iowa. Much more important state in the nomination process than NY, Fla, Tx, or Calif.
Ask Obama.
You want Iowans mad at your party?
I didn't think so. Better help the farmers.
Obama (the liberal and wealth redistribution guy) increased the Estate Tax exemption from
$1 million to over $5 million. Nobody wants to pay estate tax on that big family farm.
Ethanol? Gotta sell more corn at a higher price! >>
Ethanol is a joke. I wouldn't put that crap into my coaster wagon.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
I thought they were selected on CNN.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Presidents are selected in Iowa.
I thought they were selected on CNN. >>
Davos is my guess.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Cowboys vs Aliens
Interesting that there was also the Coinage Act of 1873.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coinage_Act_of_1873
Way too much coincidence for this not to be true.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>You guys are way off; all "elections" are decided by the Galaxy Overlords, who generally live on worlds orbiting Cygnus and Sirius >>
Nah...to tough to get the winners good quality, fake birth certificates.