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Would you block this buyer?
amwldcoin
Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
The pictures in my listing are in my opinion spot on! Here is the coin:
Hong Kong Cent
Here is the message I received from the buyer:
I receive the Hong Kong 1923 1 cent today. After my careful inspection, I found that there was a tiny scratch on the obverse around three o'clock closed to the "OF". Moreover, the color of the actual coin is somewhat darker than the pictures showing on eBay. These are not noticeable until holding the actual coin on hand. I decide to return it back to you. The package will be going out on next Monday (Dec 23rd) by insured mail. Please credit proper amount upon receipt the package. Thank you!
How many Asian fishers are costing you money????
Hong Kong Cent
Here is the message I received from the buyer:
I receive the Hong Kong 1923 1 cent today. After my careful inspection, I found that there was a tiny scratch on the obverse around three o'clock closed to the "OF". Moreover, the color of the actual coin is somewhat darker than the pictures showing on eBay. These are not noticeable until holding the actual coin on hand. I decide to return it back to you. The package will be going out on next Monday (Dec 23rd) by insured mail. Please credit proper amount upon receipt the package. Thank you!
How many Asian fishers are costing you money????
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World Collection
British Collection
German States Collection
if you block him, he will use another account.
Next time he bids, just cancel his bid.
All that typed, I see nothing in his message that warrants blocking him.
Life member #369 of the Royal Canadian Numismatic Association
Member of Canadian Association of Token Collectors
Collector of:
Canadian coins and pre-confederation tokens
Darkside proof/mint sets dated 1960
My Ebay
<< <i>Returns happen. It's part of doing business on eBay. You have a return policy. As long as the buyer abides by your policy just accept the return and move on. Relist and sell to someone else. Remember to ask eBay for fees refund after receiving the coin back and confirming it is the original piece you sent in it's original holder.
All that typed, I see nothing in his message that warrants blocking him. >>
+1 to all this. Sometimes you just have to "eat" the return. For this reason I put in my sale terms that the buyer won't be reimbursed for the shipping cost. At least that way it only costs a bit of my time to relist and I won't have to eat the shipping cost.
<< <i>LOL...I was in a bad mood when I received the request. I'm just becoming tired of dealing with a certain nationality. Of the few returns I have had over 90% fall into this stereotype. >>
Simple solution then is to block bidders from certain countries. Unless, of course, eBay no longer allows this type of blocking filter (I've farmed out any eBay sales via consignment for the last 3-4 years because I grew tired of such games).
To request refund for return ship is sleazy measly as is the ridiculous remarks about the coin itself - the scans are more then adequate.
Too bad guys like these give many a bad rap.
That said you do make it very clear that one can return so with the free shipping what does he have to lose? Probably wanted to study it or compare or what not.
SOrry for your pain!
Taler Custom Set
Ancient Custom Set
<< <i>I would modify future sales rules to deduct shipping cost from refund. With international buyers it is not insignificant. I would encourage any questions to be asked before bidding in listing language. >>
And if the buyer appealed this to eBay/PayPal they would likely win, depending on who at eBay handles the claim. The eBay "model" is that when a return is received, a FULL refund is provided, which includes the original shipping costs. I know a lot of sellers put clauses in about not refunding shipping, or restocking fees, but eBay are fully capable of ignoring those provisions. I've seen it handled both ways.
That said, looking at the original photos in question, I would have called the coin UNC, not BU. Then again, I know that many sellers do not differentiate between the two (heck, I see entirely too many "AU/BU" listings). When someone uses the term BU, that implies to me MS63+ with lots of flash/lustre, with UNC being 60-63 and not as flashy. For example, as a general rule, brown copper is UNC, not BU, unless it has a LOT of original lustre. Also, the black spots on the back drop it down a notch or three.
Since I can see the scratch he is referring to in the photo, it should have been mentioned in the description; one wouldn't expect that on a BU coin.
I can fully understand the buyer wanting to return the coin.
1/2 Cents
U.S. Revenue Stamps
<< <i>
<< <i>I would modify future sales rules to deduct shipping cost from refund. With international buyers it is not insignificant. I would encourage any questions to be asked before bidding in listing language. >>
And if the buyer appealed this to eBay/PayPal they would likely win, depending on who at eBay handles the claim. The eBay "model" is that when a return is received, a FULL refund is provided, which includes the original shipping costs. I know a lot of sellers put clauses in about not refunding shipping, or restocking fees, but eBay are fully capable of ignoring those provisions. I've seen it handled both ways.
That said, looking at the original photos in question, I would have called the coin UNC, not BU. Then again, I know that many sellers do not differentiate between the two (heck, I see entirely too many "AU/BU" listings). When someone uses the term BU, that implies to me MS63+ with lots of flash/lustre, with UNC being 60-63 and not as flashy. For example, as a general rule, brown copper is UNC, not BU, unless it has a LOT of original lustre. Also, the black spots on the back drop it down a notch or three.
Since I can see the scratch he is referring to in the photo, it should have been mentioned in the description; one wouldn't expect that on a BU coin.
I can fully understand the buyer wanting to return the coin. >>
Everyone I know uses this as far as descriptions:
BU=60-62
Ch Bu 63-64
Gem BU 65 or better.
It has been that way as far as I know since the late 60's when I started collecting!
It amazes me how people can not look at pictures! Yes..the scratch is visible and so slight it is hard to capture in a photo! I go out of my way to make sure this shows in my pictures...it is less visible in hand..even with a loop! It's not like we are selling coins to blind people...or are we? I would wager that coin would grade 62 shot 63 RB! I understand some differences in monitors...but on my monitor the color is spot on.
I know what the buyer was after...a full Red 65+ for 1/10th the cost!
1/2 Cents
U.S. Revenue Stamps
<< <i>Everyone I know uses this as far as descriptions:
BU=60-62
Ch Bu 63-64
Gem BU 65 or better.
It has been that way as far as I know since the late 60's when I started collecting!
>>
As far as I know it is the following:
UNC: 60-62
BU: 63
Choice BU: 64
Gem BU: 65 or better
Would you have accepted the return without hesitation if the buyer had not given you a reason? After all, you did offer returns, and generally a return policy on eBay is "no questions asked".
Dennis
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Today at Canadian Tire, an old guy was in front of me at the cashier. He only had one item. He paid for it and then when he checked his receipt, he noticed it didn't have the discount that was advertised.
Probably an old newsclipping he had. Anyways, the item was a $2.88 price.
Can you believe it?
Some people have zero sense (or is it 'cents'?...pardon the pun).
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Absolutely right on! From a buyer standpoint, it is difficult to buy coins from a photo, unless it is one of those "in your face" zoomable photos like those found on the Heritage auction website. Personally I generally steer away from eBay sellers who don't offer return policies unless they have incredibly awesome photography skills. As long as the seller gets his listing fees back and ensures that the buyer is responsible for the return shipping, the offering of a return policy is the hallmark of a professional numismatist/seller.
Out of the 400+ eBay purchases that I have made in the last several years I have returned 25 or so items myself and eaten probably $150 in return shipping so it works both ways. I do empathize with the OP - I'm not saying that it wouldn't be frustrating at times....
Edited to add this:
That is why mentioning faults in a listing is important.
Sellers that would do this could save themselves a lot of aggravation - again, the hallmark of a professional numismatist/seller.
<< <i>Would you have accepted the return without hesitation if the buyer had not given you a reason? After all, you did offer returns, and generally a return policy on eBay is "no questions asked".
Dennis >>
Actually it had nothing to do with the reason...I'm just becoming very predudiced to a certain nationality. I have sold over 1000 coins on ebay this year. I had a couple of returns because the buyers accidently purchased a coin they already had. 1 described as cleaned and returned because it was too cleaned. Probably 6 or 8 from this nationality...more returns than coins kept! Catching my drift?
Dennis...edited to add....an Unc coin is a coin without luster. I supposed this has been discussed before. But I believe most use my scale. But things do change. Can you support this?
Another return which was my fault....I accidently listed a Bust half in VF in the Bust quarter section. I got a chuckle out of that one! The guy evidently didn't even look at the pictures and thought he was buying a $500 Bust Quarter for $100!
<< <i>Returns happen. It's part of doing business on eBay. You have a return policy. As long as the buyer abides by your policy just accept the return and move on. Relist and sell to someone else. Remember to ask eBay for fees refund after receiving the coin back and confirming it is the original piece you sent in it's original holder. All that typed, I see nothing in his message that warrants blocking him.
Absolutely right on! From a buyer standpoint, it is difficult to buy coins from a photo, unless it is one of those "in your face" zoomable photos like those found on the Heritage auction website. Personally I generally steer away from eBay sellers who don't offer return policies unless they have incredibly awesome photography skills. As long as the seller gets his listing fees back and ensures that the buyer is responsible for the return shipping, the offering of a return policy is the hallmark of a professional numismatist/seller.
Out of the 400+ eBay purchases that I have made in the last several years I have returned 25 or so items myself and eaten probably $150 in return shipping so it works both ways. I do empathize with the OP - I'm not saying that it wouldn't be frustrating at times....
Edited to add this:
That is why mentioning faults in a listing is important.
Sellers that would do this could save themselves a lot of aggravation - again, the hallmark of a professional numismatist/seller. >>
In regards to mentioning faults. Just how much time should a person put into a listing on an inexpensive coin if everything is clearly visible in the pictures?
I have had more surprises from crappy pictures from big auction houses than I have had on ebay! Sure ebay is loaded with bad pictures. The 1st thing I do before I consider returning a coin is going back and looking at the pictures again. If I can see something that bothered me that I missed in the pictures I just keep it or eat it so to speak!
Just a line or two really, really helps!
<< <i>In regards to mentioning faults. Just how much time should a person put into a listing on an inexpensive coin if everything is clearly visible in the pictures?
Just a line or two really, really helps! >>
I do agree and do when time permits. It's not like I was selling a Gem BU and the miniscule pinscratch would not stop the coin from being straight graded!
<< <i>Just a line or two really, really helps! >>
It only helps if the buyer agrees with your assessment of the fault. If not...
Just sayin'
edited to add... I'm about to go to listing stuff with just the date/mint and a picture- no grade, no description. As long as the coin I send is the coin shown, how can it be "not as described"?