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Who was Lully?
RobP
Posts: 483 ✭✭
Hi All. A long shot, but I am trying to find out the identity of a buyer was in a Sotheby sale from 1861 and did he have a sale later in the 19th century?
Does anyone know, or have contacts in France who might know of a collector or dealer called Lully who was active in the second half of the 19th century? I have a Rev. J Lewin-Sheppard (d.1820) catalogue here from his sale on 14th Jan 1861 where lot 151 was a group of a dozen Henry VII and Henry VIII groats bought by someone of that name. There is no known collector or dealer in this country by the name of Lully as far as I can establish. The last two coins in the above lot were Tournai pieces - one with a profile bust and the second dated 1513 (rubbed). I'm 99% certain that the second one is the same coin as that in the BM from the Lockett collection in 1956 (lot 1803) as there is one unique coin dated 1513 (this item?) with no Lion and Lis by the shield and in the angles, and three slightly different in style with these included. Nobody knows where it came from, but working on the principle that Lully was a French composer in the 1600s, I am assuming that the person of this name is also French. It would make sense given the rarity of the H8 Tournai pieces that a French collector would want an example and would travel across borders to acquire one, even in the 19th century. If he had a sale towards the end of the 19th century, this would explain its appearance in the Montagu sales in 1895-7 as Montagu bought extensively across borders.
The other variety is accounted for, as the one illustrated in Ruding was in the BM from 1810 onwards, the BM's current example came from the J P Morgan collection in 1915 (which released the first coin into the market) and the third was ex-Duke of Devonshire (1844) where bought by Wigan (collection sold to Rollin & Feuardent in 1872), so definitely not on the market in 1861. As the only possible candidate of these three is the current BM example and that isn't rubbed, it would appear by elimination that the above ought to be the unique piece - if that makes sense.
Does anyone know, or have contacts in France who might know of a collector or dealer called Lully who was active in the second half of the 19th century? I have a Rev. J Lewin-Sheppard (d.1820) catalogue here from his sale on 14th Jan 1861 where lot 151 was a group of a dozen Henry VII and Henry VIII groats bought by someone of that name. There is no known collector or dealer in this country by the name of Lully as far as I can establish. The last two coins in the above lot were Tournai pieces - one with a profile bust and the second dated 1513 (rubbed). I'm 99% certain that the second one is the same coin as that in the BM from the Lockett collection in 1956 (lot 1803) as there is one unique coin dated 1513 (this item?) with no Lion and Lis by the shield and in the angles, and three slightly different in style with these included. Nobody knows where it came from, but working on the principle that Lully was a French composer in the 1600s, I am assuming that the person of this name is also French. It would make sense given the rarity of the H8 Tournai pieces that a French collector would want an example and would travel across borders to acquire one, even in the 19th century. If he had a sale towards the end of the 19th century, this would explain its appearance in the Montagu sales in 1895-7 as Montagu bought extensively across borders.
The other variety is accounted for, as the one illustrated in Ruding was in the BM from 1810 onwards, the BM's current example came from the J P Morgan collection in 1915 (which released the first coin into the market) and the third was ex-Duke of Devonshire (1844) where bought by Wigan (collection sold to Rollin & Feuardent in 1872), so definitely not on the market in 1861. As the only possible candidate of these three is the current BM example and that isn't rubbed, it would appear by elimination that the above ought to be the unique piece - if that makes sense.
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