Vintage baseball Ticket variations question.

akuracy503

So I see there are variations in the way tickets were published/marked from the early 1950's baseball.

Perhaps a question for a ticket guru:

If a ticket lists the "game no" (number) as a letter dash numeric ie M-2 what does this mean?
It surely doesnt represent the actual seasons game number for the team issued ticket.

The variation also usually has a date stamp like "April 4 1950" that is on a blank portion of the rain check stub, the stamp may be crooked or off centered as if it was manually stamped.

It's also noted that such a ticket is a general admission type ( no designated seating number ) issue.

Are these types of tickets less desirable?
Are they just as valid for a particular game than a ticket that was issued with a seat number and actual game number?

I've seen a handful of these examples and am curious.

tkd7

Here are some reasons for the characteristics you describe.

If there was a need to reissue tickets for rescheduled games such as rain make-up games - you may see a stamped date with a code for the game number. These tickets were made manually when the need arose.

Some teams sold general admission tickets with no date - the ticket was valid for general admission only. These tickets sometimes have no date, just a serial number.

The desirability is up to you, although personally I think tickets that can't be ascribed to a specific game or even season are less desirable. That is relative though, if you can find a 100 year old stub that just has a serial number, for example a Highlanders ticket to a game at Hilltop Park, I find those very valuable. Clues like the facsimile signature of the team president or owner on the stub can help narrow down a date range, or notations on the ticket by the person that actually used the ticket help as well.


Here is an example:

http://andyimperato.com/archive-of-sold-items/baseball-sold/new-york-highlanders-full-ticket-sold

akuracy503

Great example, ive seen many variations of early 1900 tickets and passes that do not have either game number or dates.
Very interesting ways to put the puzzle together!

Here are some quick examples I pulled off eBay, I reference two tickets that seem to be made of from the same stock or format.
One is a unidentified date Yankee Stadium ticket with a game number but no date, no mention of opponent name.
With only the raincheck stub to reference how does one validate the actual season/year this game was played?
[URL=http://s245.photobucket.com/user/akuracy503/media/1_zps68afcbea.jpg.html][/URL]

Here is one with an obscure "game no" (number) with what seems to be a date stamp, looks like the stamp is consistent with the original print ink however no actual game number.
Could a faux date have been stamped? I wonder how PSA examines this type of scenario.
If you reference the blue ticket above it's not consistent practice as no date was printed/stamped on the same section of the blue ticket. Anyone know what these "L-4" game numbers mean?
[URL=http://s245.photobucket.com/user/akuracy503/media/4_zpsf2d24d4d.jpg.html][/URL]

akuracy503

Here is another ticket that has hand written "vs yanks" "1951" the stub has no reference to year.
Curious if this ticket can truly be graded/verify the game.
I apologize if these are any board members tickets, I just thought they were great examples to reference on the subject.

[URL=http://s245.photobucket.com/user/akuracy503/media/2_zpsb3d41602.jpg.html][/URL]

tkd7

My guess is that the ticket with the game number and no date was sold day of game - no need for a date. The ticket with the date stamp was sold some time before game day, therefore the date was added.

The third ticket could be certified by looking at the possible August 25 dates that were Saturday games that are consistent with the ticket type. If you could put that together, I think the ticket would be certified. It would take some work. For this stub the hand writing is consistent with the schedule.

I'm just making some leaps of faith, I remember as a kid going to a game at Yankee Stadium using a ticket with the date stamped, it was a rescheduled make up game. I still have it, I will pull it out when I have time. The game was probably 25 years later than the games here, but I'm guessing the ticket practices for the Yankees stayed consistent for years.

Stone193

Good discussion guys.

This is an area I definitely know nothing about.

AUPT

According to baseball-reference.com, the Yankees were visiting Cleveland on Saturday, Aug. 25, 1951. They beat the Indians 7-3. Mantle was 2-for-5 that day, with a home run off Mike Garcia, who took the loss. DiMaggio was 1-for-4.

akuracy503

Thanks for the baseball-reference.com, reference.
The big question is how do they authenticate the ticket if it has no 1951 year printed and no mention of Yankees on the "Cleveland" ticket.
It could have been any random year with an August 25th game referenced.

I'm a nit pick and some of these baseball tickets have me stumped!
I wonder what PSA does to research and validate each tickets actual date.

Surely they don't just go off what the submitter writes in their form.



<< <i>According to baseball-reference.com, the Yankees were visiting Cleveland on Saturday, Aug. 25, 1951. They beat the Indians 7-3. Mantle was 2-for-5 that day, with a home run off Mike Garcia, who took the loss. DiMaggio was 1-for-4. >>

tkd7

That's a question for PSA but I would think you could use a calendar plus ticket price information that should be available in period scorecards or schedules to come to a conclusion.

Not saying that's easy, and not saying that PSA does that.

AUPT

In the era that appears to be appropriate for the Cleveland ticket, Aug. 25 fell on a Saturday in 1945, 1951, 1956, 1962 and 1973. The Indians did not play on that date in 1945 and were away in 1956.

akuracy503

<< <i>In the era that appears to be appropriate for the Cleveland ticket, Aug. 25 fell on a Saturday in 1945, 1951, 1956, 1962 and 1973. The Indians did not play on that date in 1945 and were away in 1956. >>



Thanks for putting the puzzle together.

So if one were to put a price on the ticket what would your guesses be?

1951, first Mickey Mantle home run wearing his #7 jersey. (previously he wore #6 prior to being sent back down to Kansas, upon his return he eventually switched to #7 I believe)
Does this sentimental story line hold any value in the ticket?

MLRMLEO

I would say yes. If you can get PSA to slab it and note first home run wearing his number 7 jersey it will bring a nice premium.

tkd7

Here is a sale of a similar item. Note that it shows PSA slabbing a ticket with a date stamp, so that answers one of your questions.

My guess for your ticket - $400 to $800 - based on the reasoning that the home run isn't necessarily as noteworthy as the #7 and it wasn't his first game wearing the number. But your guess is as good as mine.

http://www.goldinauctions.com/1st-game-mickey-mantle-wore--7---%288-24-51%29-full-c-lot6064.aspx

Goldin Auctions
October Legends
Lot #784:
1st Game Mickey Mantle Wore # 7 - (8/24/51) Full Cleveland Indians Ticket - Only One PSA Graded
After starting out well his rookie season, pressure and high expectations wore down the young phenom and by June he was sent back to the minors for more seasoning. The Yanks called him back and on August 24th he took the field wearing number 7; in his previous stint "The Mick" wore number 6. Whether this was a premeditated superstitious move to get away from a bad luck number is not known, but that night he debuted the number that would become inseparable with his name. This Upper Reserve ticket to the game at Cleveland Stadium is full and unused, meaning the original owner missed the young slugger’s 1 for 4 historic debut as number 7. PSA Graded GOOD 2.
Current Bidding
Minimum Bid: $400
Final Bid(Includes Buyers Premium): $817.65
Number of Bids: 5