BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Cardinals got sent home with a 9-0 beatdown last year, and they realized that maybe it's more fun to be on the winning side of one. >>
And then the Giants realized they were a flash in the pan, and showed their identity and tanked the next season
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Giants have taken down the defending NL champ in each of the last 4 years. They beat the Phillies in 2010, they beat the Giants in 2011, they beat the Cardinals in 2012, and beat the Giants again in 2013. Cards better watch out in 2014.
Go Redbirds! I thought that Kershaw was going to start crying in the dugout, and hotshot Puig was making Little League level mistakes out there.
You know, Mattingly might be a nice guy and all but frankly I questioned his managerial skills somewhat last night. When you are in a win-or-go-home situation and it's obvious that your guy just doesn't have his A-game (particularly after that 11-pitch battle with Matt Carpenter, not to mention the ensuing 4 runs), why don't you try to staunch the bleeding right there? Yeah, he's a presumptive Cy Young winner but he's also 0-fer against STL this season! Hello! And further, when you've got Ramirez with a cracked rib and unable to be effective in the slightest either offensively or defensively, why does he start the guy? Were they more worried about hurting a couple of guys' feelings than going to the World freaking Series? Did LA just not want to win?
It's like I said in another thread... some folks inexplicably hate the Cardinals for their success, but it isn't STL's fault when their teams make bad decisions or just plain choke when the pressure's on.
I love how the Cardinals, their fans, and the media have tried to play up the Cardinals as these epic underdogs, yet fail to mention they were top 10 in league payroll themselves. Underdogs my backside.
We hate the Cardinals not because of their success (there surely isn't the disdain for the Giants that there is for the Cardinals). No, we hate the smug attitude their ridiculous fans who think they somehow are the best in baseball for some unknown reason.
I'm hoping for a Cardinals beatdown in the world series myself, and I know I'm not alone.
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
New York Yankees $228,995,945 Los Angeles Dodgers $216,302,909 Philadelphia $159,578,214 Boston $158,967,286 Detroit $149,046,844 San Francisco $142,180,333 Los Angeles Angels $142,165,250 Texas $127,197,575 Chicago White Sox $124,065,277 Toronto $118,244,039 St. Louis $116,702,085 Washington $112,431,770 Cincinnati $110,565,728 Chicago Cubs $104,150,726 Baltimore $91,793,333 Milwaukee $91,003,366 Arizona $90,158,500 Atlanta $89,288,193 New York Mets $88,877,033 Seattle $84,295,952 Cleveland $82,517,300 Kansas City $80,491,725 Minnesota $75,562,500 Colorado $75,449,071 San Diego $71,689,900 Oakland $68,577,000 Pittsburgh $66,289,524 Tampa Bay $57,030,272 Miami $39,621,900 Houston $24,328,538 Text
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
11th in payroll and more in line with most of the league.......even those that are behind them.....a lot of that payroll is tied up in players not on the 2013 playoff roster like Chris Carpenter, Jason Motte, Jaime Garcia, Rafael Furcal, Jake Westbrook (inactive) and Ty Wigginton (cut).
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Approx. $40 million for the playoffs are not in play, mostly with rookies making $490,000 right now.....
Player Team Position State League Division 2013 salary Age Chris Carpenter St. Louis Cardinals Starting pitcher Missouri National League NL Central $11,941,975 37 Jake Westbrook St. Louis Cardinals Starting pitcher Missouri National League NL Central $8,750,000 34 Rafael Furcal St. Louis Cardinals Shortstop Missouri National League NL Central $7,500,000 34 Jaime Garcia St. Louis Cardinals Starting pitcher Missouri National League NL Central $5,875,000 25 Jason Motte St. Louis Cardinals Closer Missouri National League NL Central $4,500,000 30 Ty Wigginton St. Louis Cardinals Utility Missouri National League NL Central $2,500,000 34
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
New York Yankees $228,995,945 Los Angeles Dodgers $216,302,909 Boston $158,967,286 Detroit $149,046,844 St. Louis $116,702,085
I think $100 million and nearly double your salaries on your club could constitute an underdog in head-to-head. I am not saying the Cardinals are poor but shouldn't $100 million be able to buy FIVE $20 million dollar players? That is HUGE. Again, over a quarter of the Cardinals payroll at the $116 million is dead payroll for various reasons as well.
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>I am hardly bitter. But any team sporting a $116 million salary doesn't deserve to have the title 'underdog' to it.
I wonder if Beltran will take his bat off his shoulder this time when the game's on the line? >>
Only if Wainwright is throwing a curve to him, so no is the correct answer! Do I need to educate you on Beltran's postseason's statistics too?
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Approx. $40 million for the playoffs are not in play, mostly with rookies making $490,000 right now..... >>
Right. How many teams could write off that kind of salary? Not many. I am not suggesting they bought their way into the series, what I am saying and the numbers bear out is they have the financial resources to pay gobs and gobs of money to contend.
<< <i> Only if Wainwright is throwing a curve to him, so no is the correct answer! Do I need to educate you on Beltran's postseason's statistics too? >>
Wow, talk about bitter. You surely didn't see me whining about payrolls on the Giants threads last year after we lost. We straight up choked in that series. Just like LA choked this year. Last time I checked, every team calls their fans the best in baseball. Not just STL. Anyone agree or disagree with my thoughts about LA's managing last night?
Cardinals are a mid market team, not in the rich and not in the poor, so their success is beyond just "buying" players. If they were buying players how come 20 of their 25 were from their farm system? If the Cardinals had unlimited resources then Albert Pujols never would have left.
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Wow, talk about bitter. You surely didn't see me whining about payrolls on the Giants threads last year after we lost. We straight up choked in that series. Just like LA choked this year. Last time I checked, every team calls their fans the best in baseball. Not just STL. Anyone agree or disagree with my thoughts about LA's managing last night? >>
Why would you have complained about payrolls last year? There was only about $10 million in difference. LA choked? They came within 2 wins of the world series. They finished ahead of every other NL team but one.
<< <i> Only if Wainwright is throwing a curve to him, so no is the correct answer! Do I need to educate you on Beltran's postseason's statistics too? >>
I'll just leave this here:
>>
You know a player that fails 7 out of 10 times in baseball is a very good player right?
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Cardinals are a mid market team, not in the rich and not in the poor, so their success is beyond just "buying" players. If they were buying players how come 20 of their 25 were from their farm system? If the Cardinals had unlimited resources then Albert Pujols never would have left. >>
Midmarket team? Not rich? You do realize who has naming rights, don't you? The Cardinals are hardly a 'midmarket' team.
And Pujols left because the Angels are dumb and offered him a terrible contract for the team.
I provided the whole list to you, when do teams stop being rich to you?
What are the Yankees? What are the Dodgers?
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Let's update where Beltran stands, all time, in MLB postseason history:
* His 16 homers rank 8th.
* His HR ratio of one for every 8.5 at-bats ranks 1st.
* His Runs Created/27 is 13.0, which ranks 1st. (This is an intriguing Bill James stat that tells us how many runs a team would score if a player was able to take all of the at-bats in the game. In Beltran's case, his postseason teams would score 13 runs per game if he took all of the at-bats.)
* His slugging percentage (.794) ranks 1st.
* His onbase percentage (.463) ranks 3rd.
* His OPS (1.258) ranks 1st.
* His .360 batting average ranks 6th.
* His w/OBA of .514 ranks 1st and is 53 points higher than anyone else.
* His RBI rate of one every 4.39 at-bats ranks 13th.
This endless October storm should help Beltran's Hall of Fame candidacy.
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>This endless October storm should help Beltran's Hall of Fame candidacy. >>
Sorry, but Beltran isn't getting in to the hall, unless he buys a ticket like the rest of us. >>
Were you born when he first started playing?
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
So the idea of inducting a guy with no MVPs (only one top 5 and 2 top 10s), less than 400 HRs (despite playing in a huge boom in power numbers) makes me a child? Funny.
He's had a nice career, above average even, but to suggest he's been a Hall of Famer suggests a serious lack of objective criticism.
One reason why he could be considered with another 2 to 3 years are his postseason numbers, his defense (early in his career), and his combination of speed and power. Baseball may be looking at inducting good all around players than those that are obviously steroid enhanced power hitters....not saying he is now, but his career is not over yet and has aged well. A shift to the American League and perhaps a ballpark like Yankee stadium could enhance his chances......
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>One reason why he could be considered with another 2 to 3 years are his postseason numbers, his defense (early in his career), and his combination of speed and power. Baseball may be looking at inducting good all around players than those that are obviously steroid enhanced power hitters....not saying he is now, but his career is not over yet and has aged well. A shift to the American League and perhaps a ballpark like Yankee stadium could enhance his chances...... >>
If we looked at postseason numbers, Bernie Williams would be a sure fire hall of famer. Look, I'm not trying to take away from Beltran's career - 350 HRs and 300+ steals is a nice accomplishment. What it's not, however, is a hall of fame caliber career.
He hasn't aged particularly well, either, missing huge chunks in 2009 and 2010.
Foo3112
Posts: 1,961
Comments
Schadenfreude is strong tonight.
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Seriously, I kind of hate it for Don Mattingly. He is a class act.
Can you say Michael Wacha for NLCS MVP!
Shane
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
<< <i>Cardinals got sent home with a 9-0 beatdown last year, and they realized that maybe it's more fun to be on the winning side of one. >>
And then the Giants realized they were a flash in the pan, and showed their identity and tanked the next season
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
You know, Mattingly might be a nice guy and all but frankly I questioned his managerial skills somewhat last night. When you are in a win-or-go-home situation and it's obvious that your guy just doesn't have his A-game (particularly after that 11-pitch battle with Matt Carpenter, not to mention the ensuing 4 runs), why don't you try to staunch the bleeding right there? Yeah, he's a presumptive Cy Young winner but he's also 0-fer against STL this season! Hello!
And further, when you've got Ramirez with a cracked rib and unable to be effective in the slightest either offensively or defensively, why does he start the guy? Were they more worried about hurting a couple of guys' feelings than going to the World freaking Series? Did LA just not want to win?
It's like I said in another thread... some folks inexplicably hate the Cardinals for their success, but it isn't STL's fault when their teams make bad decisions or just plain choke when the pressure's on.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
We hate the Cardinals not because of their success (there surely isn't the disdain for the Giants that there is for the Cardinals). No, we hate the smug attitude their ridiculous fans who think they somehow are the best in baseball for some unknown reason.
I'm hoping for a Cardinals beatdown in the world series myself, and I know I'm not alone.
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Los Angeles Dodgers $216,302,909
Philadelphia $159,578,214
Boston $158,967,286
Detroit $149,046,844
San Francisco $142,180,333
Los Angeles Angels $142,165,250
Texas $127,197,575
Chicago White Sox $124,065,277
Toronto $118,244,039
St. Louis $116,702,085
Washington $112,431,770
Cincinnati $110,565,728
Chicago Cubs $104,150,726
Baltimore $91,793,333
Milwaukee $91,003,366
Arizona $90,158,500
Atlanta $89,288,193
New York Mets $88,877,033
Seattle $84,295,952
Cleveland $82,517,300
Kansas City $80,491,725
Minnesota $75,562,500
Colorado $75,449,071
San Diego $71,689,900
Oakland $68,577,000
Pittsburgh $66,289,524
Tampa Bay $57,030,272
Miami $39,621,900
Houston $24,328,538
Text
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
I wonder if Beltran will take his bat off his shoulder this time when the game's on the line?
Approx. $40 million for the playoffs are not in play, mostly with rookies making $490,000 right now.....
Player Team Position State League Division 2013 salary Age
Chris Carpenter St. Louis Cardinals Starting pitcher Missouri National League NL Central $11,941,975 37
Jake Westbrook St. Louis Cardinals Starting pitcher Missouri National League NL Central $8,750,000 34
Rafael Furcal St. Louis Cardinals Shortstop Missouri National League NL Central $7,500,000 34
Jaime Garcia St. Louis Cardinals Starting pitcher Missouri National League NL Central $5,875,000 25
Jason Motte St. Louis Cardinals Closer Missouri National League NL Central $4,500,000 30
Ty Wigginton St. Louis Cardinals Utility Missouri National League NL Central $2,500,000 34
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Los Angeles Dodgers $216,302,909
Boston $158,967,286
Detroit $149,046,844
St. Louis $116,702,085
I think $100 million and nearly double your salaries on your club could constitute an underdog in head-to-head. I am not saying the Cardinals are poor but shouldn't $100 million be able to buy FIVE $20 million dollar players? That is HUGE. Again, over a quarter of the Cardinals payroll at the $116 million is dead payroll for various reasons as well.
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>I am hardly bitter. But any team sporting a $116 million salary doesn't deserve to have the title 'underdog' to it.
I wonder if Beltran will take his bat off his shoulder this time when the game's on the line? >>
Only if Wainwright is throwing a curve to him, so no is the correct answer! Do I need to educate you on Beltran's postseason's statistics too?
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Approx. $40 million for the playoffs are not in play, mostly with rookies making $490,000 right now..... >>
Right. How many teams could write off that kind of salary? Not many. I am not suggesting they bought their way into the series, what I am saying and the numbers bear out is they have the financial resources to pay gobs and gobs of money to contend.
<< <i>
Only if Wainwright is throwing a curve to him, so no is the correct answer! Do I need to educate you on Beltran's postseason's statistics too? >>
I'll just leave this here:
Last time I checked, every team calls their fans the best in baseball. Not just STL.
Anyone agree or disagree with my thoughts about LA's managing last night?
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Wow, talk about bitter. You surely didn't see me whining about payrolls on the Giants threads last year after we lost. We straight up choked in that series. Just like LA choked this year.
Last time I checked, every team calls their fans the best in baseball. Not just STL.
Anyone agree or disagree with my thoughts about LA's managing last night? >>
Why would you have complained about payrolls last year? There was only about $10 million in difference. LA choked? They came within 2 wins of the world series. They finished ahead of every other NL team but one.
<< <i>
<< <i>
Only if Wainwright is throwing a curve to him, so no is the correct answer! Do I need to educate you on Beltran's postseason's statistics too? >>
I'll just leave this here:
You know a player that fails 7 out of 10 times in baseball is a very good player right?
2004 27 HOU NL NLDS ATL W 5 24 22 9 10 2 0 4 9 2 0 1 4 .455 .500 1.091 1.591 24 0 1 0 0 0
2004 27 HOU NL NLCS STL L 7 32 24 12 10 1 0 4 5 4 0 8 4 .417 .563 .958 1.521 23 0 0 0 0 1
2006 29 NYM NL NLDS LAD W 3 14 9 2 2 0 0 0 1 1 0 5 2 .222 .500 .222 .722 2 0 0 0 0 0
2006 29 NYM NL NLCS STL L 7 31 27 8 8 1 0 3 4 1 0 4 3 .296 .387 .667 1.054 18 1 0 0 0 0
2012 35 STL NL NLWC ATL W 1 4 4 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 .250 .250 .250 .500 1 0 0 0 0 0
2012 35 STL NL NLDS WSN W 5 24 18 5 8 3 0 2 4 1 0 5 1 .444 .542 .944 1.486 17 0 0 0 1 0
2012 35 STL NL NLCS SFG L 6 22 20 2 6 3 0 1 2 2 0 2 3 .300 .364 .600 .964 12 1 0 0 0 0
2013 36 STL NL NLDS PIT W 5 21 18 3 4 1 0 2 6 0 0 3 1 .222 .333 .611 .944 11 0 0 0 0 0
2013 36 STL NL NLCS LAD W 5 22 17 1 3 1 1 0 4 0 0 5 3 .176 .364 .353 .717 6 0 0 0 0 0
4 Yrs (9 Series) 44 194 159 43 52 12 1 16 35 11 0 33 22 .327 .443 .717 1.160 114 2 1 0 1 1
1 NLWC 1 4 4 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 .250 .250 .250 .500 1 0 0 0 0 0
4 NLDS 18 83 67 19 24 6 0 8 20 4 0 14 8 .358 .470 .806 1.276 54 0 1 0 1 0
4 NLCS 25 107 88 23 27 6 1 8 15 7 0 19 13 .307 .430 .670 1.100 59 2 0 0 0 1
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>Cardinals are a mid market team, not in the rich and not in the poor, so their success is beyond just "buying" players. If they were buying players how come 20 of their 25 were from their farm system? If the Cardinals had unlimited resources then Albert Pujols never would have left. >>
Midmarket team? Not rich? You do realize who has naming rights, don't you? The Cardinals are hardly a 'midmarket' team.
And Pujols left because the Angels are dumb and offered him a terrible contract for the team.
What are the Yankees? What are the Dodgers?
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Let's update where Beltran stands, all time, in MLB postseason history:
* His 16 homers rank 8th.
* His HR ratio of one for every 8.5 at-bats ranks 1st.
* His Runs Created/27 is 13.0, which ranks 1st. (This is an intriguing Bill James stat that tells us how many runs a team would score if a player was able to take all of the at-bats in the game. In Beltran's case, his postseason teams would score 13 runs per game if he took all of the at-bats.)
* His slugging percentage (.794) ranks 1st.
* His onbase percentage (.463) ranks 3rd.
* His OPS (1.258) ranks 1st.
* His .360 batting average ranks 6th.
* His w/OBA of .514 ranks 1st and is 53 points higher than anyone else.
* His RBI rate of one every 4.39 at-bats ranks 13th.
This endless October storm should help Beltran's Hall of Fame candidacy.
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>This endless October storm should help Beltran's Hall of Fame candidacy. >>
Sorry, but Beltran isn't getting in to the hall, unless he buys a ticket like the rest of us.
<< <i>
<< <i>This endless October storm should help Beltran's Hall of Fame candidacy. >>
Sorry, but Beltran isn't getting in to the hall, unless he buys a ticket like the rest of us. >>
Were you born when he first started playing?
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
He's had a nice career, above average even, but to suggest he's been a Hall of Famer suggests a serious lack of objective criticism.
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>One reason why he could be considered with another 2 to 3 years are his postseason numbers, his defense (early in his career), and his combination of speed and power. Baseball may be looking at inducting good all around players than those that are obviously steroid enhanced power hitters....not saying he is now, but his career is not over yet and has aged well. A shift to the American League and perhaps a ballpark like Yankee stadium could enhance his chances...... >>
If we looked at postseason numbers, Bernie Williams would be a sure fire hall of famer. Look, I'm not trying to take away from Beltran's career - 350 HRs and 300+ steals is a nice accomplishment. What it's not, however, is a hall of fame caliber career.
He hasn't aged particularly well, either, missing huge chunks in 2009 and 2010.
<< <i>I am hardly bitter. But any team sporting a $116 million salary doesn't deserve to have the title 'underdog' to it.
I wonder if Beltran will take his bat off his shoulder this time when the game's on the line? >>
Sounds like a bitter Mets fan!
Shane
= = =
I think I am right on these stats (I am, at least, close to right)
On the 25 man roster, the Cardinals have.....
3 acquired by free agency
2 acquired by trade
20 that came up through the minor leagues (that is not a typo - 20!)
Shane