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P. O. R. ???
AKrick
Posts: 518
Sorry, meant to post this on the U.S. Coin forum but I'm sure someone can give me a reasonable answer over here too. Thanks in advance.
This may be dumb question but here it goes anyway...What is the reasoning behind dealers putting P.O.R. instead of the actual price they want for certain coins in their listings? Why not just list the price instead of making us contact them if we are interested. I'm sure there is a logical answer so give it to me. . .Please!
Sign: Pissed Off Rick
This may be dumb question but here it goes anyway...What is the reasoning behind dealers putting P.O.R. instead of the actual price they want for certain coins in their listings? Why not just list the price instead of making us contact them if we are interested. I'm sure there is a logical answer so give it to me. . .Please!
Sign: Pissed Off Rick
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Really I have No Idea but when I see it the Item Goes on Ignore. My Only Guess is that Maybe the Item has been in Stock for Ages and They Will take a Reasonable Offer if You Call.
Heres another Idea. Maybe the Price they want is so Un-reasonable that they are Ashamed to Post it for Public Viewing.
Ken
You will REALLY be pissed off when you call and find out what they are asking. That's why the don't put it in the ad. They feel like if they get you on the phone they can talk you into it. Sometimes it works. I guess it works enough so that they keep on doing it.
Doug "non-plussed by POR ads" Wright
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
Blaze - Yellow male b 3/17/93
Onyx - Black male b 3/7/99
Duchess - Yellow female mix b 3/12/02 rescued 9/18/02
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My eBay
P.O.R. Price On Request
Lobster on a menu: Market Value
Give us a call, we'd be glad to talk to you...
At least this is how it is in other markets.
Looking for Low Grade PCGS Half Dimes.
While researching what my coin had gone for at auction I realized I paid too much. I wasn't sure exactly how much of a bath I need to take.
Why don't people bargain more? I was hoping someone would write and make an offer. I guess I'm getting lazy because I don't have to come up with exact prices when selling something on eBay.
Don't you all have a price in mind when you look for a coin?
My general rule is... If you have to ask, it's too much.
David
1. The seller has decided to sell the coin, presumably after doing some market research, so share that research.
2. There's one seller and many potential buyers -- much more efficient for the seller to set a starting price than have a bunch of buyers have to guess or call and waste their time if it's not in their range.
3. The seller has the coin sitting in front of them and has a better idea what it's like compared to others, and whether a discount or premium is justified.
4. POR pisses people off.
If you're not sure about exact price, far better to say something like $1500 OBO. That gives buyers an idea as to what you might think is a reasonable offer, and also gives them a "buy it now" price so they know you're not just fishing around.
I have learned so much from these forums. I really appreciate all the info, opinions and scans! Keep it up!
A few minutes ago I just visited a very popular site for registry coins (and a site I have made several purchases from myself this year).
At that site, that dealer lists a North Carolina quarter in PCGS-MS68 at $380. And, it is possible that weeks of time could have elapsed from the time someone sent that dealer that coin to list on his site at that price or that dealer bought the coin in the marketplace weeks ago. And, while I have no doubt NC quarters in PCGS-MS68 probably sold at that $380 level many times in the past and perhaps even at far higher levels, imho, the "market" on that particular coin TODAY is no longer a $380 level (just my own opinion here). Indeed, that particular state in that grade is currently indicated on my sites today at $145 (with several examples ready to ship), because I personally believe the price has stabilized around that level and I am comfortable "indicating" the coin at that level. But, if I was not comfortable indicating the coin at $145, I would also have no problem listing the coin at P.O.R. and if, and when, I got an inquiry on that coin, I could price it at what I believe the market is the day the buyer asked me about it. IMHO, I do not believe it is "better" to simply list the coin at $380 or $500 and wait for serious buyers to write me to haggle over price. First, many collectors may not be comfortable attempting to haggle down a $380 or $500 indicated price down to $250, $200 or even $145. Second, collectors may not appreciate prices on sites changing every day or week, up or down, like a moving target. If collectors are offended by the POR indication, then I lose a sale - but I personally like that better than throwing up on the site a "high ball" figure like "$500 OBO", even if I invite collectors to couteroffer me.
Just my 2 cents.
peacockcoins
That is enlightening. That may be the way it goes on your site, but let me tell you about perception (and marketing, after all, is about perception, not intention).
I certainly haven't studied your site in detail, but when I have gone there (primarily to investigate your Lincolns), the POR coins have always looked like the high-priced condition rarities. The inference I have gotten from your selecting those coins for POR is that those are the ones you want to draw bids and make the big bucks on, and that the price pressure on those items was up, not down. Usually when I've seen POR, I've read it like others here ("If you have to ask..."), and have moved on to other sources. When I have contacted you about coins, it has always been for the ones with price tags.
Like I say, this may have been my misperception. But you oughta know what at least some of us customers read into "POR." Frankly, I presume you have a price in mind when you post a coin, and I'd like some notion of what that is, before I initiate a contact.
I agree with Akrick, that you and other sellers probably do lose business because of POR listings (even though, for all I know, you may GAIN business from other types of people).
As justification for this personal reaction, I agree with Tad's rationale. I also appreciate Carl's revisiting his policy as a result of this thread.
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
Obviously, the consensus appears to be that listing POR on sites may likely lose sales. I, for one, hear that loud and clear, but may still personally chose to do it that way, along with myriad other dealers and collectors. But, knowing how many of you feel may lead me to probably price those "close calls" where I could have listed it POR or not. Wondercoin.
Keith
My experience with a few, I think was more to build their client base. After they got my name and number (they had to get the coin from the vault or some other BS) I am now on their mailing list. I've even gotten some dealers to sell it to me at my price. It's just a pain in the A$$.
Rich
to talk to people I don't know if I don't have to.
I also don't like being put on the spot; being told the price
of the coin and feeling like I have five seconds to decide if
I want it at that price.
If I do pass, now I feel the dealer has me pegged as someone
who couldn't afford the coin in question and I might not get
proper attention from him in the future (i.e. how many POR inquiries
can you make before you're considered a window-shopper?)
I also like to keep track of the market price of coins I collect
and it's hard to do when you don't get to witness what a coin sold
for because it was listed as POR.
Just my opinion,
-KHayse
Greg
Recpectfully,
Jackie
Upgrading:
PCGS Registery "Lambert Collections" of; Wheat Lincolns, Sac's, and SAE's.
I personally find that another good reason to use the POR is for coins that are extremely popular and priced right (such as some Lincolns) so as to not dissapoint anyone who sees the coin on your site only to discover the coin has been sold. A perfect example of this is when I graded a handful of 1952(d) Lincolns in PCGS-MS67RD a year or so ago and priced them "right" on my site. They were gone quickly but the price remained on the site longer than it should have and I know it dissapointed a couple collectors who spotted the great deal but couldn't obtain a coin. Incidently, my webmaster from the inception of my site is a retired friend, an older gentleman, who quit often battles pneumonia (from a lung disorder) and winds up in the hospital for extended periods of time. While he does a great job handling things on the site, I know that there is always chance he could get sick. It is easier to have some of the coins POR for this reason as well.
In the case of my sites, it could never really be a case of "bait and switch" anyway, as right on my homepage I make it clear that many key date coins in each series never even make it on the site and to email me with any want lists, which many people, like Jackie, happliy do
I prefer to see it as an honest sale, not trying to wait and make a killing. Its part of the hobby that keeps some people intimidated by having to ask on a coin they know will be expensive. If more things did not have prices on them how long till you got tired of asking the price of all things you looked at? Sure its only a few when you see the POR.
If a dealer wants to list their inventory that way they have their own reasons for doing so, and even though I dont agree with it, I personally just over look the listings that are listed as POR.
sometimes you like to window shop without having to deal with having to ask the price.
PS, Mitch to your PM question, on "poorly over rated" no not your site.... but yes to others.
"Because I can"
myurl The Franklin All Old Green Holder Set
Wondercoin, here is what disturbs me about POR. About a year ago, I was looking for a complete set of Roosevelt 1946-1964 MS67, and I saw this ad on your site:
COMPLETE COLLECTION OF PCGS ROOSEVELT SILVER DIMES DATED 1946-1964 AND GRADING PCGS-MS67!!! REGISTRY QUALITY!! Here is a 48 pc. Roosevelt Silver Dime Collection grading PCGS-MS67 and dated 1946. The set contains the complete regular issues for those dates (no overdates, sms or errors of course) totaling 48 pieces and every coin is graded PCGS-MS67!! As importantly, these coins have been hand-picked for their EXCEPTIONAL quality and appeal. Many will be full blazers or pretty toned and many will also be "full band" (i.e. fully struck reverse)!!! I personally believe Roosevelt dimes should have a similar designation to Mercury Dimes to address the horizontal reverse bands. I have found that numerous dated Roosevelts in high grade full band are actually quite elusive. In any event, offered here is a top quality complete PCGS-MS67 dime collection. Only one set available so please e-mail me to confirm availability. P.O.R.
I e-mailed immediately. The response I got was that you could build one for me for $10,000. I e-mailed back complaining and asking whether or not you had one in inventory ready to ship. You did not reply. I found a complete set within a week and purchased it for $8,000.00.
Almost one year later, this ad is still on your site, although the site purports to have been updated 4/1/02. To me this is a form of "bait and switch" which is repeatedly used by retailers who use POR. They don't actually have what is advertised, but if they find out someone is looking for it, they try to go out and get it. What this means to me is that while I am out looking for a coin or a set, now I have someone else looking for the same thing who will buy it and tack on a premium.
Doug: FYI, my comment that I could build you one for $10,000 was from available coins. As you may know, I registered the #1 MS Roosevelt silver Dime set in the 1999 PCGS Registry after spending a decade (I'm glad you found yours in a day) searching for coins for my #1 set, roll after roll, show after show, slab after slab, raw collection after raw collection. Naturally, I acquired a large quantity of nice MS Roosevelts in my pursuit. But, I don't "slop together" these sets and this is an item where price changes on a regular basis - hence the POR. I have sold (2) sets this year already. At this point, it would be a harder task to produce a 3rd set, so I will delete that offering on my sites. Just PM me with this next time. Thank you.
I'm not picking on you per se, because I experienced this several times on other coins and sets with other dealers before I responded to your ad. Each time, I was left disappointed, and felt like the seller was trying to pull a fast one. There is another name for this form of adverising, but it is referred to as "bait and switch" generally.
Rick