Any type of PSA owner list to help verify as real PSA item
smokeybandit
Posts: 177
I was hoping there was some sort of owner list that could
be accesed and updated by owners that would allow collectors to see the
registered owner therby helping to elliminate the possibility of purchasing a
fake/counterfit PSA encapsulated item seems they are getting very good at
making these with the correct item number on the flip which makes looking
up the item number nearly usless to help verify the item as real.
If there is not a way to access this information I would like to see something
like this
Seems it would not be very hard for PSA to set and start a list and add the
owners as they submitted there items, previous owners could ask there items
be added as PSA has the records already listed on our account pages under the
old submission info. Potental buyers could be given a ontime access to view a
owners list of items and numbers ?
Just a thought. Something needs to be done about all these counterfits as its
going to cause PSA graded items to become worthless as a verified means to
help collectors
0
Comments
Doug
Liquidating my collection for the 3rd and final time. Time for others to enjoy what I have enjoyed over the last several decades. Money could be put to better use.
<< <i>And when the person who submitted it sells it to John ... and then John sells it to Dave ... and then Dave sells it to Mike ... and Mike has it for sale and you are interested ... then what? >>
The same way the Set-Registry works old owner releases his interest in the item and new owner is listed (both fill out the releases)
I suspect it would take some doing to keep up with it but if your serious about wanting to protect your investments I dont think it would be that
much to ask
<< <i>I dont think it would be that
much to ask >>
That is too much to ask. Just think of the volume of graded items that change hands every day. No one would ever do what you're proposing.
1. Cards are a dumb investment. Only collect as a hobby.
2. Owner registration is simply not possible or practical.
3. Have not heard of PSA counterfeiting being a serious problem. Any links to active eBay auctions with fake PSA cards?
My 2c
Scott
Always plenty of PSA-graded cards in my ebay store -- https://ebay.com/str/thelumbercompanysportscards
<< <i>
<< <i>I dont think it would be that
much to ask >>
That is too much to ask. Just think of the volume of graded items that change hands every day. No one would ever do what you're proposing. >>
Although it would be nice to see every card listed I expect that would be a large undertaking.
I am more interested in the higher end cards as I dont think there is much interest in faking a
card with a low value but if there was a data base started it would include all cards grades from
that point forward
<< <i>My 2 Cents:
1. Cards are a dumb investment. Only collect as a hobby.
2. Owner registration is simply not possible or practical.
3. Have not heard of PSA counterfeiting being a serious problem. Any links to active eBay auctions with fake PSA cards? >>
Hobby or not if I pay 500.00 or more for a card its an investment
watch this youtube video for some examples of fake PSA graded high end cards
YouTube Link
Well worth watching if you wish to learn more about the topic. Very, very frustrating. For PSA to ignore this is typical/unbelievable (take your pick).
3:50 is chilling
8:00 is funny
8:35 is truth
btw..what does MOJO stand for?
Thanks again for posting. Great thread. They say knowledge is power....
that Ryan rookie with that serial # has been discussed in the SC & M Forum on several occasions and it is common knowledge to those who have read through the threads that other copies exist, in fact efforts have been made to pull them off the market and i'm pretty certain PSA has taken a proactive stance in doing so.
there's also a privacy issue here and you can't just identify everyone who ever had cards graded by PSA because you might be putting their safety or livelihood at risk.
would you want anyone to know that you possess a collection or inventory worth a substantial amount of money, simply by having the ability to identify the cards you've had graded in your history?
i wouldn't.
<< <i>to identify one example of fakery does not mean the whole PSA grading system needs to be overhauled to protect people, particularly those who don't educate themselves before pouring out large sums of money for big time cards. the video provides an excellent reference tool, and your eyes will tell you if you are willing to pay attention and learn.
that Ryan rookie with that serial # has been discussed in the SC & M Forum on several occasions and it is common knowledge to those who have read through the threads that other copies exist, in fact efforts have been made to pull them off the market and i'm pretty certain PSA has taken a proactive stance in doing so.
there's also a privacy issue here and you can't just identify everyone who ever had cards graded by PSA because you might be putting their safety or livelihood at risk.
would you want anyone to know that you possess a collection or inventory worth a substantial amount of money, simply by having the ability to identify the cards you've had graded in your history?
i wouldn't. >>
The problem does exist and if it is left to continue it will only get worse and the fakes will get better, small items worth thousands of dollars
are an easy mark for scammers. If this is not corrected it will undermine the whole PSA idea that its a safe way to collect and after awhile the
idea that a PSA Graded card would be worth the extra cost will be lost.
As for the privacy issue. I suggested there would be a one time access to the sellers record to prove he is the actual owner, it could be set
to only show the one item being sold (not all of the sellers items) this would only be available to the buyer and only by promision from the seller.
I dont understand why there seems to be so many against something like this it could only help the situation and I cant think of a better
way to insure the owner of a graded card has a way to show it is the actual item graded/verified from PSA. The advantage to PSA in there
product name would be increased the owner would have a viabale way to prove its the real PSA Item (the item number now has no importance)
As for the items that have already been sold many times with no way to retrace the original owner. The item could be sent to PSA for a verification by
the new owner for a nominal fee, this would help off-set the cost of setting up the data base. Of course the owners would probably only be
interested in verifieing the high end items and could even offer this as an option to any interested party and pass the cost on to them.
Again this is only one suggestion in an attempt to figure out what can be done. If anyone has a better idea please post it here I would love to
hear it
1. Privacy - Most collectors would agree that a database of ownership is impractical, if not illegal.
2. Counterfeiting - As the video shows, it happens. I am a mid-level collector and I did not know this was an issue. How about some sort of info on the PSA web-site as to which cards have been faked? How about a link on the web-site to report suspected fakes?
3. No one is implying that one fake means the whole system needs to be overhauled. From the other angle, just because a large percentage of PSA cards are not faked does not mean that we should simply ignore the small percentage that are fakes.
Kevin M.
<< <i>I think you're confusing a couple of issues here.
1. Privacy - Most collectors would agree that a database of ownership is impractical, if not illegal.
2. Counterfeiting - As the video shows, it happens. I am a mid-level collector and I did not know this was an issue. How about some sort of info on the PSA web-site as to which cards have been faked? How about a link on the web-site to report suspected fakes?
3. No one is implying that one fake means the whole system needs to be overhauled. From the other angle, just because a large percentage of PSA cards are not faked does not mean that we should simply ignore the small percentage that are fakes.
Kevin M. >>
It seems this would not be acceptable to everyone so it could also be used as a voluntary option when having items graded/verified.
1. Making the data base voluntary would eliminate the legal issue.
2. Seems leaving it up to PSA to find all the counterfits would be much more difficult then simply having a way to prove ownership from the
grading company.
3. I assure you if there is one fake found there are many more that have not been noticed, left unchecked the problem will grow
1) i am as opposed as anyone else to those who choose to defraud the hobby and have been victimized, too
b) opening up private information to others, regardless of their affiliation with this site and PSA, will only create more harm as the very same scammers you are so concerned about would then have more potential access to more information about other people's private business....you may believe that PSA will take responsibility for protecting our rights to confidentiality, and that's fine, but it won't prevent the wrong people from finding a way to use it if they can steal it somehow
&) you are suggesting that we should require further proof after the fact, when so many already know what they have because they submitted the cards...what happens in the open market now brings the responsibility into the hands of the buyer, just like always, be educated
do we really need more verification procedures after the fact? the only benefit would be more fees for PSA and a further muddling of an already complicated grading/authenticating system.
to make such a sweeping general statement as "the item number now has no importance" reeks of bitterness.
<< <i>perhaps i should clarify my own position.
b) opening up private information to others, regardless of their affiliation with this site and PSA, will only create more harm as the very same scammers you are so concerned about would then have more potential access to more information about other people's private business....you may believe that PSA will take responsibility for protecting our rights to confidentiality, and that's fine, but it won't prevent the wrong people from finding a way to use it if they can steal it somehow. >>
I never proposed opening up private information to others I suggested there could be a way for a collector/seller to offer proof his item is
the actual item graded by allowing PSA to confirm the owner of the one item.
Also "NEWS FLASH" the Data Base already exists. Proof just sign into PSA and open your account information and you will see a list
of all the items you have submitted.
<< <i>&) you are suggesting that we should require further proof after the fact, when so many already know what they have because they submitted the cards...what happens in the open market now brings the responsibility into the hands of the buyer, just like always, be educated. >>
I never suggesting any such thing. What I suggested was again a way to offer proof to a potental collector that we do indeed own the graded item
and we were not scammed or trying to scam. A PSA graded item in a case with a correct item nomber is not proof of anything, there are fakes/counterfits being sold and if you want to have the extra benifit of PSA confirming it, why not allow them to do so. I never said you had
to do it. I never suggested it was mandatory
<< <i>do we really need more verification procedures after the fact? the only benefit would be more fees for PSA and a further muddling of an already complicated grading/authenticating system.. >>
Yes we do, the fact counterfits are showing up make another form of verification necessary. There are certainly more benefit then PSA FEES,
how about the ease of mind you are buying from the PSA verified owner. I dont see how clearing up the possibility of buying from a scammer
is muddling up the system
<< <i>to make such a sweeping general statement as "the item number now has no importance" reeks of bitterness. >>
No Not bitter, I have not been burned "YET" or at least that I know of. But the fact a item is in a PSA case with the correct
item number does not verify the item is ligit.
Keeping your head in the sand will not help, something needs to be done befor its to late. I dont know if what I suggested is the
correct solution but at least its an Idea/start
but, eventually they will.
no matter which tactics are used by a 3rd party organization, it begins with you. learn as much as you possibly can about your hobby and what you are committed to spending your hard earned dollars to possess.
there are many examples of what to look for in determining fakes and phonies, all over the Internet, and if not, just start a thread about it here and see how quickly people respond.
one thing i bet many of us have in common is that we've been burned, and not necessarily just because some jerk was trying to rip us off, but also because we didn't know enough to stop it from happening.
it begins with YOU. i wish all of us well.
<< <i>we all definitely agree that there need to be protective measures in place for each of us, the individual owners of cards.
no matter which tactics are used by a 3rd party organization, it begins with you. learn as much as you possibly can about your hobby and what you are committed to spending your hard earned dollars to possess.
there are many examples of what to look for in determining fakes and phonies, all over the Internet, and if not, just start a thread about it here and see how quickly people respond.
one thing i bet many of us have in common is that we've been burned, and not necessarily just because some jerk was trying to rip us off, but also because we didn't know enough to stop it from happening.
it begins with YOU. i wish all of us well. >>
I agree with you that we as individuals are the first defense and we should do all we can to protect our-self and that includes reading and
learning it should also include trying to stop a problem in the making. I am sure we have all heard about fake masterpieces in museums that
have gone unnoticed by the experts. When there is potential for tens of thousands of dollars to be gained by making fakes they start to
get very good. Take a 1000.00 dollar card and make 100 copies your looking at 100,000.00 dollars more then enough to afford some
real money and talent to produce a fake that would go undetected by most.
The simplicity of allowing PSA to verify ownership at the owners request sounds to me like a good tool to use in my self protection process,
After all we are allowing PSA to Grade, Verify and Encapsulate the item to help us in protection but to have them Verify who owns it sounds crazy ?
Oh well I have made my case and will continue to try my best to sound the alarm but hope its just me screaming the sky is falling.
to not do so and allow fraudsters to operate free of confinement would be rather foolish.
i hesitate to echo the sentiments of "never get cheated", but essentially this is a call to arms as much as anything.
the author of this phrase is implying that while we are free to seek an opinion about our collectibles from a 3rd party as long as we pay for it, we must also take upon the enormous responsibility of being informed, because they can't by all rights save the world from itself. they will give you that opinion you seek and then back up that fact by applying an identifier to it. that is supposedly all we can ask.
i absolutely believe that they would appreciate any and all support they could get from us to help identify the fakes and get 'em the frick outta town.