USPS has update insurance on coins, even if you pay for insurance you can not collect!

seateddime

It seems unless you use registered mail. the USPS is not going to pay claims on coins sent even if you buy the insurance.

How many millions of dollars of coins are being sent insured mail right now that people will never collect on if they are lost?

The USPS will take your money, just won't pay if there is a loss.

Tdec1000

Where did you read this at?

commoncents05

Not true, I collected both times I filed a claim.

-Paul

Bochiman

<< <i>It seems unless you use registered mail. the USPS is not going to pay claims on coins sent even if you buy the insurance.

How many millions of dollars of coins are being sent insured mail right now that people will never collect on if they are lost?

The USPS will take your money, just won't pay if there is a loss. >>




Plenty of people have posted on the forums over time, and you have been here almost 7 years, that state what you post is incorrect.
They have had insurance paid AND it wasn't sent registered.

LindeDad

Only claim I ever had was about seven years ago and a printed page from the PCGS price guide, and the eBay auction final page printed, got me full pay back.
But I will say there are cheaper ways to insure mailed items.

seateddime

I know a dealer who just filed a claim on a lost package and the claim was rejected because the contents were coins.

http://search.reviews.ebay.com/?satitle=USPS+insurance+coverage+rules

TomB

No offense, but an ebay review by someone with unknown competance doesn't mean much to me when compared against discussions at my own Post Office with the Postmaster.

LindeDad

He needs to refile as Numismatics collectibles.
Will need proof of value in any case. And a dealers own value and grading will not work.

MICHAELDIXON

This is true, coins and money are not insurable. H OW E V E R! Numismatic and collectible items are insurable and the claims will be paid. Check out my post with the USPS information.

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>Only claim I ever had was about seven years ago and a printed page from the PCGS price guide, and the eBay auction final page printed, got me full pay back.
But I will say there are cheaper ways to insure mailed items.
>>



What is a good break-even point for using USPS insurance or getting your own? $200 or x shipments per year?

LindeDad

Check the eBay insurance it's about $1.00/$100.00 of coverage for infrequent shipping.
Myself I find if your a volume seller of lower value items self-insuring works for item up a thousand dollars but I have been building my insurance fund for several years now. I set aside the amount it would of cost me to buy insurance at the postal rate. Got the idea from Jerry's coffee can that has become a envelope in the safe.
High value $1000 to $5000 I use Express mail with there lower insurance rate, over $5000 I send Registered Mail.

19Lyds

<< <i>I know a dealer who just filed a claim on a lost package and the claim was rejected because the contents were coins.

http://search.reviews.ebay.com/?satitle=USPS+insurance+coverage+rules >>

Weoll...........If I ship 2 raw 2002 Kennedy Half Dollars to someone and insure them for $25, I certainly will not collect should those coins go missing.
Should I send a $2 roll of nickels to my kids and should that roll (which I picked up at the bank for $2 but insured it for $15) go missing, I have no right to collect.

However, if I sell a rare die variety that has a market AND has generally accepted prices available online for that particular piece, I can insure it for its full purchase value as it is no longer simply a coin.

Its a "collectible coin" which is specifically called out in the US Postal Regulation regarding insurance and as such is covered by USPS Insurance.

Can I send my brother $100 in cash and insure it for $100? No. However, I could send my brother a rare $2 bill that has a value of $100 and thats PCGS graded and expect iot to be insured.

To often folks take the postal regulation at face value and once they see that you cannot insure coins or cash, they think that s it and do not look any further.

As stated earlier, you cannot insure coins and currency that are intended as "money" but you can insure "collectible coins" and "collectible currency". Just be prepared to prove that the items are "actually" collectibles.

derryb

When in doubt, read the instructions:

Domestic Mail Manual - Filing Indemnity Claims for Loss or Damage

Para. 4.1.g, payable claims:

"Fair market value of stamps and coins of philatelic or numismatic value, as determined by a recognized stamp or coin dealer or current coin and stamp collectors newsletters and trade papers."

notwilight

This guy, whoever he is, is clueless. Insuring items valued under $25 is throwing money away. He is paying 10-20% for shipping and insurance. --Jerry

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>When in doubt, read the instructions:

Domestic Mail Manual - Filing Indemnity Claims for Loss or Damage

Para. 4.1.g, payable claims:

"Fair market value of stamps and coins of philatelic or numismatic value, as determined by a recognized stamp or coin dealer or current coin and stamp collectors newsletters and trade papers." >>



How many dealers would go to bat for you and say that a $50 ms63 1884-O white Morgan does indeed have a market value of $600 when tarnished?

Bochiman

"I know someone on the internet who said XXXXX, therefore XXXXX must be true!"

Again, you have been on the forums for almost 7 years. In MANY threads, this has come up and, just as in this thread, people have noted that they HAVE been paid and the section in the DMM that pertains to this.

Unknown

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MsMorrisine

<< <i>"I know someone on the internet who said XXXXX, therefore XXXXX must be true!"

Again, you have been on the forums for almost 7 years. In MANY threads, this has come up and, just as in this thread, people have noted that they HAVE been paid and the section in the DMM that pertains to this. >>



I read on the internet where they can't put anything on the internet that isn't true.

RichieURich

I have collected on a coin that was lost when sent via USPS Insured Mail.

Got full value, but I would rather have had the package delivered.

There is a form that you have to fill out correctly, and include appropriate documentation, in order to collect.

TwoSides2aCoin

My property taxes went up without any improvement to my property. Even my grass was burnt in this drought, and with an extra hour of sunlight during Daylight Saving's Time, it's just not fair.

On a side note, my last submission made it to and from California without a problem.



How did PCGS know it was going to get graded MS 64 ? I took it out of the flip before sending it to them !

derryb

<< <i>My property taxes went up without any improvement to my property. Even my grass was burnt in this drought, and with an extra hour of sunlight during Daylight Saving's Time, it's just not fair. >>


I'm still trying to figure out how Daylight Saving's Time put an extra hour of sunlight on your lawn.

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>

<< <i>My property taxes went up without any improvement to my property. Even my grass was burnt in this drought, and with an extra hour of sunlight during Daylight Saving's Time, it's just not fair. >>


I'm still trying to figure out how Daylight Saving's Time put an extra hour of sunlight on your lawn. >>



One of the great mysteries of life. Perhaps the sun forgot to come up an hour later!

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>Check the eBay insurance it's about $1.00/$100.00 of coverage for infrequent shipping.
Myself I find if your a volume seller of lower value items self-insuring works for item up a thousand dollars but I have been building my insurance fund for several years now. I set aside the amount it would of cost me to buy insurance at the postal rate. Got the idea from Jerry's coffee can that has become a envelope in the safe.
High value $1000 to $5000 I use Express mail with there lower insurance rate, over $5000 I send Registered Mail.
>>



I don't do the eBay thing so their rates don't help me. Any links to other places that sell reasonable insurance packages?

abitofthisabitofthat

The sky is falling!

paladin

I use Inkfrog's Shipsaver insurance for ebay transactions. Rates are $.79 / $100. It's available as an extra app on ebay. (Not to be confused with ebay's Shipcover insurance offered at checkout).

DaggoB

I received a denial on the six Buffalo Nickels which were stolen from an express mail package on the way to CAC in June. A check was also received for $15. The check and the appeal was sent back to ST. Louis 3 days ago and confirmation was received that the appeal arrived. In my original claim it was stated that the Buffs were not coins, negotiable currency or bullion. They are collectibles and of numismatic value. The insurance certificate was included along with everything that shows the fair market value. I followed M. Dixons advise and included every thing possible. The original package included at least 20 pages and pictures of all the coins, Heritage archieves, PCGS and NGC values, recent Heritage and E-Bay sales. The fair market value is higher than the insured value. In the appeal I included a copy of publication 122 and outlined all of their idiotic remarks which were made in their denial. They also said that if I had sent the Buffs registered the insurance would have covered the theft. In all of the conversations I have had with the Post Office and written communication, not once have they answered my question. HAVE YOU INVESTIGATED INTO WHICH OF YOUR LOYAL EMPLOYEES IS A THIEF? I am waiting for the next denial and then off goes my appeal to Washington.

Raufus

<< <i>When in doubt, read the instructions:

Domestic Mail Manual - Filing Indemnity Claims for Loss or Damage

Para. 4.1.g, payable claims:

"Fair market value of stamps and coins of philatelic or numismatic value, as determined by a recognized stamp or coin dealer or current coin and stamp collectors newsletters and trade papers." >>



Thanks for posting this. This topic seems to come up every few months.

segoja

The OP is flat out wrong. Never had a problem when filing a claim, as long as you follow the rules.

BE VERY CAREFUL ON E-BAY INSURANCE. THE SHIP COVER "DOES NOT" COVER COINS, only the USPS insurance covers coins.

derryb

<< <i>BE VERY CAREFUL ON E-BAY INSURANCE. THE SHIP COVER "DOES NOT" COVER COINS, only the USPS insurance covers coins. >>


Printing a shipping label for an ebay sale using a shipping label link in paypal now uses ebay shipcover shipping insurance (USPS label). As pointed out earlier in the thread this third party insurance does not cover coins - see para. II-A:

"II. THE INSURANCE DOES NOT INSURE:
A. Coins, bullion, loose diamonds or stones, stocks, bonds, currency, deeds, evidences of debt, travelers checks, money orders, gift certificates, calling cards, lottery tickets, admission tickets, or any other negotiable documents."

I refuse to use ebay or paypal shipping for this reason and print my on-line postage directly from the usps.com website where regular USPS insurance coverage rules apply. The only hassel is having to manual enter shipping information and to manually enter tracking number in paypal after the label is purchased. If tracking number is manually entered into paypal first it will automatically update "My Ebay" with tracking number. This tracking number needs to be entered in the event there is a paypal or ebay claim or if seller funds are being held until proof of delivery. It is ebay/paypal's way of confirming delivery.

Edited to add: It has been pointed out that on the paypal shipping page there is a drop down box that allows you to choose USPS insurance.

Cougar1978

OP does not know what talking about.

Never had problem with claim I filed with USPS. I ship with USPS and avoid private carriers.

derryb

<< <i>OP does not know what talking about.

Never had problem with claim I filed with USPS. I ship with USPS and avoid private carriers. >>


Note that if USPS label is now purchased on line through ebay or paypal you will be dealing with a third party insurancecarrier that does not insure coins, even though you purchased a USPS label. You are no longer buying USPS postage directly from USPS when you purchase it through paypal or ebay. You are contracting with Ebay Inc Shipping to use USPS for delivery only and to use Interstate Fire and Casualty Co. for insurance coverage. Best to know what that coverage is.

Edited to add: It has been pointed out that on the paypal shipping page there is a drop down box that allows you to choose USPS insurance.

Unknown

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derryb

I have been corrected. There is a drop down box in the paypal shipping window that allows you to select USPS insurance. The non USPS insurance is the default but I now see where it can be changed to USPS. My bad.

DIMEMAN

>>>I'm still trying to figure out how Daylight Saving's Time put an extra hour of sunlight on your lawn.<<<

It's the same guy that said he could land on the sun. When ask how he would handle the heat.....he replied "I'll go a night"!

Kaelasdad

I sent a coin insured for $10,000, registered mail. I thought I covered my ass. I thought that only the addressee was allowed to sign. I was wrong. His apartment manager was able to sign for it, then the original addressee claimed he never received it, since of course, he had never signed for it. Luckily, I had a very good postal inspector on the case, and while i never found out if his manager friend got her butt fired (she claimed she also never signed for it once the heat was turned up--too bad her signature was a perfect match). The addressee mnever returned the coin, but he is doing 12 years in Florida at a Fed reserve. And the USPS said sorry, since it WAS signed for, it WAS delivered...sort of--so no claim. They suggested next time to go restricted registered--so ONLY the addressee is allowed to sign--and here I though registered was the right choice, silly me. apparently anyone with a pen can sign for a registered package.

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>I sent a coin insured for $10,000, registered mail. I thought I covered my ass. I thought that only the addressee was allowed to sign. I was wrong. His apartment manager was able to sign for it, then the original addressee claimed he never received it, since of course, he had never signed for it. Luckily, I had a very good postal inspector on the case, and while i never found out if his manager friend got her butt fired (she claimed she also never signed for it once the heat was turned up--too bad her signature was a perfect match). The addressee mnever returned the coin, but he is doing 12 years in Florida at a Fed reserve. And the USPS said sorry, since it WAS signed for, it WAS delivered...sort of--so no claim. They suggested next time to go restricted registered--so ONLY the addressee is allowed to sign--and here I though registered was the right choice, silly me. apparently anyone with a pen can sign for a registered package. >>



Was the "original addressee" in cahoots with the manager? Why would he return the coin if he didn't have it? Did he ask you for a refund?

That is one of the flies in the ointment with registered mail. Anyone at the receiving address can sign for it. If you want it to go to one certain person restricted delivery is extra $$. The carrier is supposed to ask for ID, FWIW.

derryb

Paypal seller protection requires proof of delivery to the address on the paypal details page, not to the person:

"When you ship to the address on this page and provide proof that the item was delivered, you're protected against claims for items not received. "

""Signature Confirmation" is online documentation that can be viewed at the shipping company's website and indicates that the item was signed for on delivery."

mrpotatoheadd

<< <i>I sent a coin insured for $10,000, registered mail. I thought I covered my ass. I thought that only the addressee was allowed to sign. I was wrong. His apartment manager was able to sign for it, then the original addressee claimed he never received it, since of course, he had never signed for it. >>

From the USPS DMM:

1.1.7 Express Mail and Accountable Mail
The following conditions also apply to the delivery of Express Mail and accountable mail (Registered Mail, Certified Mail, insured for more than $200.00, or COD, as well as mail for which a return receipt or a return receipt for merchandise is requested...

d. When delivery is not restricted at the sender’s request, mail addressed to a person at a hotel, apartment house, etc., may be delivered to any person in a position to whom mail for that location is usually delivered.