<< <i>Have you ever gotten cards graded by PSA? >>
Ive subbed plenty of cards to PSA over the years. Mainly 1972 Topps Football. After completing that set I began to become frustrated by the inconsistant grading.
I wasn't into paying extra to play the "Crack and Re-sub" game and after the .05 money grab felt the system was now starting to take advantage of the hobby people they
initially entered the hobby to help protect. Kind of like Big labor unions have done.
Its not a knock on PSA as ALL grading is subjective weather its being done by people in the hobby or "professional" TPGers. All are human and therefore it will always
be a subjective issue no matter who is grading them.
I think the inconsistant grading has grown more over the years as PSA has become larger and larger. More and more inexperienced graders are hired and it is just
inevidable that the grades are going to vary more with that many graders.
I do understand that todays Sports card Market is ruled by greed, money, value, labels and price guides more than any affection for the players or cards themselves as it once
was when it was the simple innocent hobby of our youth and many times I keep forgetting that. I do very much enjoy the few Graded sets I tinker with, but the vast majority of
If you have any extras of those cards that meet your tough "gem mint" grading standards let me know. I don't mean to distract you from your quest but I figured it was worth asking. I hope you don't mind.
Ive always liked the 1985 Topps Baseball set and I think Ive still got a nice MINTY set around here somewhere, missing the Mcgwire that I sold off for crazy money during the big Homerun race. I really should pick that card back up for the peanuts it now goes for just to complete the set again.
I could never attempt this kind of craziness on a Baseball set. The sets are just to big and after the handful of rookies and stars Im afraid I would lose interest chasing the 600 common cards.
Its just too tall of an order for me and I wish you the best of luck in your quest.
John As I said a couple of weeks back, "you are sick!" You are a cardaholic if I have ever seen one. I have really enjoyed viewing your set and just the time that you have put into scanning and describing all the small issues with each card. I know it is a ton of work but I have a ton or respect for your collecting sickness.
Good job. Shane
Looking for high grade rookie cards and unopened boxes/cases
Well if I gotta have a sickness, at least its one I enjoy.
Scanning is a lot of work, but I really enjoy seeing the cards displayed and how they flow with each other through out the set.
It also helps me see multiple cards at the same time in a different "Light" when trying to evaluate so many cards.
Ive always enjoyed and obsessed with sort and organizing cards in different ways every since I was a young boy.
From Rubber bands and shoe boxes to the time I glued that 76 Topps football set onto notebook paper and put it in a binder(Yes the Payton too)
Ive always had this OCD when it comes to cards. OK..... OK this 88 thing is starting to spin out of control a bit and bordering on the edge of INSANITY now!
Am I turning into "Rainman" Raymond Babbitt? Im now starting to obsess with Set #2 and #3 and have an uncontrolable urge to got to K-mart and get me some underware!
Shhhhh! Don't say nothing................ But I just broke 6 more Wax boxes..................... STOPPPPPPP the INSAINTY!!!!! But then what will I do?????????
Guess I would have to start breaking some of the 87 Topps Football Cello Boxes I got from Steve Hart and get to work on "The PERFECT 1987 TOPPS FOOTBALL SET!
While we're on the subject of the truck load of extras I have.
While indeed I can assemble 40 or so sets, I figure I can make at least 2-3 absolute "Killer sets" with 60/40 or better centering throughout. NO: wax stains, creases, etc... with nice sharp corners and surface. Please keep in mind I have not started making the next three Killer sets and it will takle me some time to go through and access and make those sets and to be safe 3 killer sets will be the limit until I can proper access weather more might be available.
Also note: That I removed and disgarded all the wax stained cards as well as any with creases or badly miscut cards when I opened the packs. So none of the sets I will build will have any of those flaws.
Each will come with: 1000 yd club glossy set 10 wax wrappers (Includes all variations) 10 cello wrappers 1 Empty cello Box (sent flat) 10 unbroken sticks of the original gum
new to the boards, but I wanted to let you know that ive been following this thread for weeks. I think what youre doing is very cool. I've done that will a couple of sets before and havent ever met anyone else as obsessive (or in your case more) as I was.
this is cool. i have many fond memories of busting wax and putting my own baseball and football sets together in the 80's. in recent years i have stocked up on unopened product of my favorites years to do nearly the same thing but not to the same degree. the nice thing is that for many of the sets i already have 2-3 of each sitting in monster boxes untouched since they were sorted back in the day. wonder if any would pass the mustard.
there are others that are doing this too, or hoarding, or busting to submitt as BBCE prices on some of these years have gone up and inventory has gone down. should have bought more cases 2-3 years ago.
Packers Fan for Life Collecting: Brett Favre Master Set Favre Ticket Stubs Favre TD Reciever Autos Football HOF Player/etc. Auto Set Football HOF Rc's
Thanks for all the comments guys! Thankfully Ive been busting plently product over the years to make these kind of crazy high grade sets. I do agree that the prices on the unopened material is getting quite high and pricing most collectors out of the wax busting business of making a master set.
Ive been away to Disney World with the kids and Just got back and its been awhile since my last update. Putting up The Seahawks Cards now.
Ok, So as I was putting up the 1988 Topps Seattle Seahawks Cards I kept questioning what happend to those Kreig/Warner/Largent Teams of the Eighties, and why such a talented team couldn't make it over the hump.
It seems the hump was usually the Raiders or Broncos. Three Times from 1983 to 1987 The Seahawks lost the Divison Title to either the Broncos or Raiders to settle for a Wild Card spot.
1983 9-7 Finish(2nd) Raiders 12-4(1st)
Season: Krieg 60% 18 TD / 11 INT Warner 1449 YDS / 13 TD Largent 72 REC / 1074 YDS / 11 TD
A very solid season
Playoffs Wild Card Game 31-7 win over the Broncos Divisonal Game 27-20 win over the Dolphins Championship game 30-14 Lost.... to you guessed it..... The Raiders They would never make the Chamionship game again in the eighties.
1984 12-4 (2nd) Broncos 13-3 (1st) Curt Warner is lost for the season with 10 att for 40 yds. Despite that lose the 12-4 record is their best of the decade. Krieg 57% 3671 YDS / 32 TD / 24 INT and a Pro Bowl Selection. 24 INT's? Largent 74 REC / 1164 YDS / 12 TD
Playoffs Wild Card Game 13-7 win over the Raiders ( maybe this was the year, even with out Warner) Divisonal Game 31-10 Lost to The Dolphins I always assumed that Kreig threw a lot of untimely int's, but no int's here. Dan Marino was just to unstoppable for the defense.
Season Kreig 53% 3602 YDS 27 TD / 20 INT Pretty decent again for Krieg, but with his % slipping and again 20 or more int's, it's tough to win the AFC West. Curt Warner returned with another 1000 yd season Largent was solid 79 REC / 1287 YDS / 6 TD Missed the Playoffs
1986 10-6 (Tie for 2nd with Chiefs) Broncos 11-5 (1st)
Season Kreig 60% 2921 YDS / 21 TD / 11 INT His percentage was back up and his Int's were cut in half! One of his best seasons. Curt Warner had the best year of his career 1481 YDS / 13 TD Largent with his last 70 + catch year 70 REC / 1070 YDS / 9 TD One of the best statistical years for the team and the best record they would post in eighties behind the 1984 12-4 season. But the black cloud still hung over them as they were ousted from the playoffs in the tie-breaker system by the Chiefs and Jets.
1987 9-6 (2nd) Broncos 10-4-1 (1st)
Season Kreig 60% / 23 TD / 15 INT / 2131 YDS Warner 12 games / 985 YDS / 8 TD Largent 58 REC / 912 YDS / 8 TD Back in the Playoffs with yet another Wild card spot. No Curt Warner for that Game.
Playoffs Wild Card 23-20 Overtime lose to the Oilers ( A heartbreaking lose)
1988 9-7 (1st) Raiders 8-8(2nd) With down years by both the Broncos and Raiders the Seahawks capture their only divison Title of the decade.
Season Krieg 9 games 58% / 1741 YDS / 18 TD / 8 INT Warner Back in form with 1025 YDS / 10 TD Largent 39 REC / 645 YDS / 2 TD Numbers way down and aging but still a clubhouse leader
I'll be updating soon. It is very time consuming going through this many cards with a critical eye.
I often only do a handful of cards at any one time, otherwise the eye starts to not be as critical.
I will be putting up The Minnesota Vikings Team next.
Im also in the process of putting together 5 absolutely stunning killer sets that rivial event the registry sets. There are no shortages of "dealer Sets" out there so I don't see a reason to assemble the 40 or more sets I have cards for.
But 5 Super high grade sets that have not be cherry picked of all the top cards is something I don't thing you will see much of in todays hobby.
Rest assured I will have you an update soon.
Thank You for your interest and support in my thread!
<< <i>the man should start his own gading company - watch what happens to PSA prices
love the thread John - thanks for sharing it. >>
It's a very good idea. What you would need is a baseline to go by. The color of the back, for instance, that translucent blue he describes, versus the muddied version. Centered on both sides. No fisheyes anywhere, clean printing where registration is on key. Etc., etc. Those should all be earmarks of a "10". But as I said, one needs a base card for color, quality, and the sort. If you are just handed a card for the first time and determine its grade, then its purely guesswork. Which would also lead me to say that cards that are unique, like 1/1, should not be graded (or if so, graded on a different curve).
But I am making hypothetical rules to a hypothetical situation.
Comments
<< <i>Have you ever gotten cards graded by PSA? >>
Ive subbed plenty of cards to PSA over the years. Mainly 1972 Topps Football. After completing that set I began to become frustrated by the inconsistant grading.
I wasn't into paying extra to play the "Crack and Re-sub" game and after the .05 money grab felt the system was now starting to take advantage of the hobby people they
initially entered the hobby to help protect. Kind of like Big labor unions have done.
Its not a knock on PSA as ALL grading is subjective weather its being done by people in the hobby or "professional" TPGers. All are human and therefore it will always
be a subjective issue no matter who is grading them.
I think the inconsistant grading has grown more over the years as PSA has become larger and larger. More and more inexperienced graders are hired and it is just
inevidable that the grades are going to vary more with that many graders.
I do understand that todays Sports card Market is ruled by greed, money, value, labels and price guides more than any affection for the players or cards themselves as it once
was when it was the simple innocent hobby of our youth and many times I keep forgetting that. I do very much enjoy the few Graded sets I tinker with, but the vast majority of
my collection will always be raw.
John
Doesn't the slight tilt on the Montana Record Breaker bother you? I noticed it on your scan.
<< <i>Great quest!
Doesn't the slight tilt on the Montana Record Breaker bother you? I noticed it on your scan. >>
Now that you mention it and Im looking at it........ Yes..... Yes it does.
CARD #4 has been rejected! In Favor of this Beauty I just Pulled!
Thanks for the sharp eye stevebay!
John
My Unisquare Online Auction Store
John
good luck!!
Do you have any interest in moving some of your extras? I only need a few.
Walter Payton #5(Record Breaker)
Bernie Kosar #85(In Action)
Bernie Kosar #86
If you have any extras of those cards that meet your tough "gem mint" grading standards let me know. I don't mean to distract you from your quest but I figured it was worth asking. I hope you don't mind.
Thanks
Bernie Kosar collector
Ive always liked the 1985 Topps Baseball set and I think Ive still got a nice MINTY set around here somewhere, missing the Mcgwire that I sold off for
crazy money during the big Homerun race. I really should pick that card back up for the peanuts it now goes for just to complete the set again.
I could never attempt this kind of craziness on a Baseball set. The sets are just to big and after the handful of rookies and stars Im afraid I would lose interest
chasing the 600 common cards.
Its just too tall of an order for me and I wish you the best of luck in your quest.
John
My Unisquare Online Auction Store
As I said a couple of weeks back, "you are sick!" You are a cardaholic if I have ever seen one. I have really enjoyed viewing your set and just the time that you have put into scanning and describing all the small issues with each card. I know it is a ton of work but I have a ton or respect for your collecting sickness.
Good job.
Shane
Thanks for the "Sick" comments (I think/LOL)
Well if I gotta have a sickness, at least its one I enjoy.
Scanning is a lot of work, but I really enjoy seeing the cards displayed and how they flow with each other through out the set.
It also helps me see multiple cards at the same time in a different "Light" when trying to evaluate so many cards.
Ive always enjoyed and obsessed with sort and organizing cards in different ways every since I was a young boy.
From Rubber bands and shoe boxes to the time I glued that 76 Topps football set onto notebook paper and put it in a binder(Yes the Payton too)
Ive always had this OCD when it comes to cards. OK..... OK this 88 thing is starting to spin out of control a bit and bordering on the edge of INSANITY now!
Am I turning into "Rainman" Raymond Babbitt? Im now starting to obsess with Set #2 and #3 and have an uncontrolable urge to got to K-mart and get me some underware!
Shhhhh! Don't say nothing................ But I just broke 6 more Wax boxes..................... STOPPPPPPP the INSAINTY!!!!! But then what will I do?????????
Guess I would have to start breaking some of the 87 Topps Football Cello Boxes I got from Steve Hart and get to work on "The PERFECT 1987 TOPPS FOOTBALL SET!
"Nurse Rachett, is it time for my medicine yet?
John
My Unisquare Online Auction Store
No distractions here.
here are some of the nicer minty ones I have of those three cards.
John
If you'd rather discuss the details on email I'm jmeekins33@aol.com
Thansk for taking the time.
Bernie Kosar collector
While indeed I can assemble 40 or so sets, I figure I can make at least 2-3 absolute "Killer sets" with 60/40 or better centering throughout.
NO: wax stains, creases, etc... with nice sharp corners and surface. Please keep in mind I have not started making the next three Killer sets
and it will takle me some time to go through and access and make those sets and to be safe 3 killer sets will be the limit until I can proper access weather more might be available.
Also note: That I removed and disgarded all the wax stained cards as well as any with creases or badly miscut cards when I opened the packs. So none of the sets I will build will have any of those flaws.
Each will come with:
1000 yd club glossy set
10 wax wrappers (Includes all variations)
10 cello wrappers
1 Empty cello Box (sent flat)
10 unbroken sticks of the original gum
KILLER SET ($55.00 delivered)
NM-MT / MINT SET ($42.50 delivered)
NM-MT SET ($35.00 delivered)
I will also be listing some of these sets, as well as singles in My Unisquare Online Store
John
I sent you a PM about the cards.
But its no big deal. Ive no problem discussing it here in the thread.
I can send ya the middle row for $6.00 delivered Pay-Pal gift.
My Pay-Pal address is: johnclayes@comcast.net
John
Bernie Kosar collector
Got the Colts Team up for review.
John
new to the boards, but I wanted to let you know that ive been following this thread for weeks. I think what youre doing is very cool. I've done that will a couple of sets before and havent ever met anyone else as obsessive (or in your case more) as I was.
looking forward to your next post
avan
love the thread John - thanks for sharing it.
there are others that are doing this too, or hoarding, or busting to submitt as BBCE prices on some of these years have gone up and inventory has gone down. should have bought more cases 2-3 years ago.
Collecting:
Brett Favre Master Set
Favre Ticket Stubs
Favre TD Reciever Autos
Football HOF Player/etc. Auto Set
Football HOF Rc's
I do agree that the prices on the unopened material is getting quite high and pricing most collectors out of the wax busting business of making a master set.
Ive been away to Disney World with the kids and Just got back and its been awhile since my last update. Putting up The Seahawks Cards now.
take Care
John
and why such a talented team couldn't make it over the hump.
It seems the hump was usually the Raiders or Broncos. Three Times from 1983 to 1987 The Seahawks lost the Divison Title to either the Broncos or Raiders
to settle for a Wild Card spot.
1983
9-7 Finish(2nd) Raiders 12-4(1st)
Season:
Krieg 60% 18 TD / 11 INT
Warner 1449 YDS / 13 TD
Largent 72 REC / 1074 YDS / 11 TD
A very solid season
Playoffs
Wild Card Game 31-7 win over the Broncos
Divisonal Game 27-20 win over the Dolphins
Championship game 30-14 Lost.... to you guessed it..... The Raiders
They would never make the Chamionship game again in the eighties.
1984
12-4 (2nd) Broncos 13-3 (1st)
Curt Warner is lost for the season with 10 att for 40 yds. Despite that lose the 12-4 record is their best of the decade.
Krieg 57% 3671 YDS / 32 TD / 24 INT and a Pro Bowl Selection. 24 INT's?
Largent 74 REC / 1164 YDS / 12 TD
Playoffs
Wild Card Game 13-7 win over the Raiders ( maybe this was the year, even with out Warner)
Divisonal Game 31-10 Lost to The Dolphins
I always assumed that Kreig threw a lot of untimely int's, but no int's here. Dan Marino was just to unstoppable for the defense.
1985
8-8 (3rd) Raiders 12-4(1st) Broncos 11-5 (2nd)
Season
Kreig 53% 3602 YDS 27 TD / 20 INT
Pretty decent again for Krieg, but with his % slipping and again 20 or more int's, it's tough to win the AFC West.
Curt Warner returned with another 1000 yd season
Largent was solid 79 REC / 1287 YDS / 6 TD
Missed the Playoffs
1986
10-6 (Tie for 2nd with Chiefs) Broncos 11-5 (1st)
Season
Kreig 60% 2921 YDS / 21 TD / 11 INT
His percentage was back up and his Int's were cut in half! One of his best seasons.
Curt Warner had the best year of his career 1481 YDS / 13 TD
Largent with his last 70 + catch year 70 REC / 1070 YDS / 9 TD
One of the best statistical years for the team and the best record they would post in eighties behind the 1984 12-4 season.
But the black cloud still hung over them as they were ousted from the playoffs in the tie-breaker system by the Chiefs and Jets.
1987
9-6 (2nd) Broncos 10-4-1 (1st)
Season
Kreig 60% / 23 TD / 15 INT / 2131 YDS
Warner 12 games / 985 YDS / 8 TD
Largent 58 REC / 912 YDS / 8 TD
Back in the Playoffs with yet another Wild card spot. No Curt Warner for that Game.
Playoffs
Wild Card 23-20 Overtime lose to the Oilers ( A heartbreaking lose)
1988
9-7 (1st) Raiders 8-8(2nd)
With down years by both the Broncos and Raiders the Seahawks capture their only divison Title of the decade.
Season
Krieg 9 games 58% / 1741 YDS / 18 TD / 8 INT
Warner Back in form with 1025 YDS / 10 TD
Largent 39 REC / 645 YDS / 2 TD Numbers way down and aging but still a clubhouse leader
Playoffs
Divisional Game 21-13 Lose to Bengals
Now you Know
John
How about an update to a great card related thread? Thanks!
Robert
I'll be updating soon. It is very time consuming going through this many cards with a critical eye.
I often only do a handful of cards at any one time, otherwise the eye starts to not be as critical.
I will be putting up The Minnesota Vikings Team next.
Im also in the process of putting together 5 absolutely stunning killer sets that rivial event the registry sets.
There are no shortages of "dealer Sets" out there so I don't see a reason to assemble the 40 or more sets I have cards for.
But 5 Super high grade sets that have not be cherry picked of all the top cards is something I don't thing you will see much of in todays hobby.
Rest assured I will have you an update soon.
Thank You for your interest and support in my thread!
John
<< <i>the man should start his own gading company - watch what happens to PSA prices
love the thread John - thanks for sharing it. >>
It's a very good idea. What you would need is a baseline to go by. The color of the back, for instance, that translucent blue he describes, versus the muddied version. Centered on both sides. No fisheyes anywhere, clean printing where registration is on key. Etc., etc. Those should all be earmarks of a "10". But as I said, one needs a base card for color, quality, and the sort. If you are just handed a card for the first time and determine its grade, then its purely guesswork. Which would also lead me to say that cards that are unique, like 1/1, should not be graded (or if so, graded on a different curve).
But I am making hypothetical rules to a hypothetical situation.