1964 Topps Set

HammeringHank

Hi everyone...I'm thinking of getting out of my baseball card collecting hobby. The impact of the down-turned economy has effected me greatly. Debts are mounting. So one answer is to liquidate my assets - my baseball card collection. I'm not really in a hurry to do this...just thinking about it.

See this set... http://www.psacard.com/PSASETREGISTRY/alltimeset.aspx?s=3865

The issue is that as you can see there are quite a few 10's in this set...in fact...I put this set together from scratch...and the cost has been exorbitant...it's really a one of a kind set...the question is how to sell it? I think it should be sold as a set...because it is a one of a kind...the problem is what it would take to buy this set as there is no book for guidance. If I sell it individually, placing a hundred and fifty 10's on the market might not be good idea either.

So those that have some knowledge...what do you think this set is worth? Throw SMR out...because it's way over SMR!! Anyone reading this interested in buying the set as is? (you should email me at enuber@aol.com as I do not frequent this site often enough).

Thanks for your input.

MiniDuff

pm sent

ahkmedbinladen

Henry,
I hate to say this but a major auction house might be the way to go with this caliber of set. But if you need money quicker ...than a guy like Steve Novella or even Probstein doing a set break would be the way to go. Selling all those 10s together could be problematic no matter how you sell them unless you could broker something privately with a collector like Don Spence.
Good luck whatever you do....you are good guy and compiled an amazing collection.

jay0791

Henri

Your set is a work of art.

Basically you are probably out of the reach of most to nearly all the collectors out there.
Those that could afford such a set probably want a deal as so few can buy it.
Pure investors probably want to concentrate on just one card or several rc of hofers that would be tons easier to liqudate.
It will be a lot of work to break up this set. But thats how I would do it.

Consign as a whole set to a major auction house probably would be disaster. Lets just give your set a value of 200K.
That's 40K buyers premium. Unless money is no object...and yes there are some out there I would think thats far more than a collector wants to put in a set.
maybe on a very rare rc.

Breaking up is the way to go...but not all at once.
I like many collectors only have so much to spend. But over time that might add up.

Steve Novella or Probstein are 2 excellent choices. Every card in the set is sellable but maybe start on the boards.
sell what u can. those 2 guys wouldn't look at the rest as sloppy seconds. but do it over time (months).

good luck.

If u break up I'm a looking at yankees

btw: the 200k was not an estimate on set worth. I have no access to the smr. just for an example.

HammeringHank

For those of you that really want to get sick...the set exceeds the $200K mentioned...I have receipts for every sale to validate that...

gemint

Sorry to see that you are considering exiting the hobby Henri. I know you're very proud of that set but sometimes life has other ideas for our collections. I echo what others said. If you try to sell it as a set, you will likely not get close to the breakup value of the set. Anyone looking to spend that amount of coin on a set will likely be looking at break-up value. I bought the number 4 ranked 1971 set last year. At the price I paid, the consignor got about 50% of VCP value after fees were taken out, maybe a little more if he negotiated zero seller premium with the auction house. What you may want to do is contact Don Spence and see if you can work out a direct deal for some of the 10s. I'm sure he'd have interest in them. Do you need to sell the whole set or just raise some cash to offset short term debt? Maybe you can sell a handful of the cards to generate the needed funds without completely liquidating it. That would mitigate the concern of flooding the market with low pop cards. The 1971s fell in value last year after many of the top sets were broken up. So that is a legitimate concern.

gemint

Also, targeting a value of this set will be tough. VCP is probably the best tool but I'm sure many of the PSA 10s don't have a value assigned. Value of 1 of 1s are also volatile. I'd add up your receipts to get the best ballpark estimate.

ahkmedbinladen

I hope he doesnt think he is going to get what he put into it. My guess is that is never going to happen.

gemint

Another option is to sell some of the 10s to generate funds and replace them with 9s. That could result in significant cash generation while still retaining a PSA 9+ set.

HammeringHank

I don't have to sell anything...if I could get my money out...I would...rather I will...and that is my problem...I really need another fool like me...

I offered all my 10's to Spence a year or so ago...in fact I have some very low pop 9's as well...put together he would have a set that could only be called incredible...he wasn't interested...

Also I have sets in 58, 59, 60, 61 and 63...and sets of ungraded cards in those years...

I'm 65 years young...the economy sort of destroyed my home value...business went south...I still can manage....just not sure my interest is still there...I really wanted this set to make the Hall of Fame...as this is the oldest vintage set that is completely 9 or better...even Spence's great set has many 8's in it...unfortunately we cannot see what he has as he hides most of his sets...which personally I think is a shame considering how much ado was made in PSA's magazine about how he likes to share the hobby...I just cannot separate myself from his set (the Mantle weighs to much that he has)...so instead of competing with him...I thought some day this set will go...I just need to find the right person...

This is a one of a kind set...that would be extremely difficult to duplicate...if at all...I need to find the right person...I don't expect this to happen over night...in the meantime I will add what I can and wait it out...but it is for sale...for someone that wants one of the best set out there...a one of a kind...

1960toppsguy

best colabaration of cards I've ever seen: frankly priceless and you've got a boatload of other great sets, I'd shop the other stuff first!

gemint

One other option would be to contact Memory Lane to see what they can do. I'm not a big fan but they do have a network of collectors and recently unloaded Soloway's collection.

halosfan

nice sets man

bbuckner22

<< <i>One other option would be to contact Memory Lane to see what they can do. I'm not a big fan but they do have a network of collectors and recently unloaded Soloway's collection. >>


If you want $.50 on the dollar, Memory Lane would be a great place to start.

mariner

Incredible set, Henri.....I hope it all works out.

leadoff4

Any update on this set?

JoeBanzai

Wow! Simply amazing set.

Even though you have the best of the best here, your challenge to get the best price is really no different than selling any complete set. With the possible exception of a collector like Charlie Sheen wanting to get the finest set available all at once.

If you have the time to get your set in front of some high rollers, you could sell it all at once for a very good price. As someone who was in sales for ten years, this would be a fun product to offer. I would assume there are investors out there that might want to put their money into cards, interest rates are pretty low. Otherwise, you are going to run into people who want a few cards at a time, or lowball you on this set's value.

Breaking up the set on eBay would be the quickest way to get the best return on your investment. That's going to be time consuming as well.

Good luck with whatever you decide. My hope is you can sell it to someone who will keep it together.

Joe

macboube

I put this set together in the last few years, finally completed and stand at # 8 current finest. I truly can appreciate your 9.28 effort, as my 8.15 pales by comparison. I know Spence has 9.31, but you and he are on a different planet with your 64's. Hard to believe you do not have a single card below 9............that in itself is Hall of Fame worthy, considering these are almost 50 year old cards, and there are some cards that are just impossible in high grade. How did you ever find leader cards # 2, 3, 4 and 8 in grade 9, let alone many other low pops?

I would love to know when you started putting this remarkable set together, and some of the stories about the acquistions. Hoping you will share that info.

MCMLVTopps

Henri,

I would HIGHLY recommend you contact Steve Novella (www.stevenovella.com). Steve sold a very high grade 1955 Topps set for me this past November, his rate was very fare, he is efficient, knows the market and has many, many contacts. I think so highly of him that I'm going to send him an email myself for him to contact you. Steve is considered one of the premiere sellers in the biz, you simply cannot do better than him.

GL with your sale, you have a fantastic set.

Al

Robby

<< <i>I put this set together in the last few years, finally completed and stand at # 8 current finest. I truly can appreciate your 9.28 effort, as my 8.15 pales by comparison. I know Spence has 9.31, but you and he are on a different planet with your 64's. Hard to believe you do not have a single card below 9............that in itself is Hall of Fame worthy, considering these are almost 50 year old cards, and there are some cards that are just impossible in high grade. How did you ever find leader cards # 2, 3, 4 and 8 in grade 9, let alone many other low pops?

I would love to know when you started putting this remarkable set together, and some of the stories about the acquistions. Hoping you will share that info. >>



I am at #6 current finest set ( Robbie's 1964 Topps Set ) with a 8.32 GPA ........... I have scans of all the cards in my set ! With Henri retiring his set , we moved up one spot temporarily ! When Dave Cryer stormed onto the card scene a few years back and started buying every thing in sight ( he amassed a huge high quality collection in a matter of a few years ) ........I watched in amazement as he and Henri bid against each other for the 1964 Psa 10's that came up on E-Bay ! I kept track of Psa 10 prices for that time period , so I can attest to the fact that lots of money was spent ! Early examples of Dave Cryer's purchase's ( his E-Bay handle back then was VMF ) .....#300 Aaron $3,560.00...........#21 Berra $2,727.44 .......etc. ...............common 10's and mid range semi stars and team cards went for anywhere between $200.00 to upwards of a $1000.00 or more ! Back then Cryer won the majority of the 10's ! And just as quickly as he blazed on the horizon , he sold it all off ( and I believe he sold his set to the current # 1 guy , Spence ) ! Not just the 1964 set , but all of them ! After Cryer left , I believe Henri stepped up and took over buying the majority of the 10's ! Darcy and Lmayer and Bdodge .....cnotes.......cbailey......AA.....Picked up some along the way ! Prices were to rich for my blood , so I just settled for the 9's to upgrade my set after I reached 100% completion ! Correct me if I'm wrong Henri .........but I think you were 14h1967 on E-Bay back then ! I hate the way they hide everyone's identity now !
Good luck selling your set !
Robbie

GDM67

Dave also used to have the top Phil Niekro Master set. I won several of the cards he had then when Memory Lane auctioned them off.

tribefan4ever

I too wish Henri the best of luck in selling his amazing set.

Over the past few years I had the pleasure of dealing with Henri more than a few times and always found him to be one of the fairest people I've encountered.

Best of luck Henri.

HammeringHank

In April of 2012 I began this thread with the announcement that I was thinking of selling my Topps 1964 set...I was frustrated as I had worked so hard to claim the #1 spot and how easily Don Spence was able to pass me by...I'd forgotten that I did the same thing to Don when I passed him...as I stated selling was not a "must" do project and I was not just selling to sell...just something that I was thinking about...I still bought here and there cards to improve the set...like a "drug" junkie I just kept at it...for what reason I have no idea...last year in 2013 I was actually ahead of Don and forgot to push the button on time before May 30th deadline on the Registry as I was out of town in Washington participating in a Major Softball event...took my laptop and just simply forgot...just another frustration...I really wanted the #1 spot! Again!

Still PSA 10's were coming my way via auctions and eBay and some dealers contacting me directly...I was now at 9.32...then 9.35...and then 9.38...during this time Spence retired all of his sets...I heard that the buyer was locking the cards away and they would not see the light of day for some time...then just as suddenly the cards crept into auctions and even eBay...I could not believe my luck (not sure that's the right word...because how does spending tens of thousands of dollars equate to good luck?)...I bought twenty-two 1 of 1 PSA 10's from Steve Novella which bumped my set to 9.50...I'd say an inappropriate expletive right here...but I won't...I never thought this would be possible...and it can only go up as I know where 19 PSA 10's are right now that would help the set get even better...this could not have happened if not meeting and being helped by one of the most generous collectors it has been my pleasure to have met (I really haven't met him in person...only via email)...however Mike Nicodema has done trades with me and allowed me to purchase cards that he bought for his set to help me upgrade this set into a truly astonishing collection...and he has done that without profit to himself...truly a one of a kind person!!!

So here is it...an almost perfect set...maybe as close as it will ever get... Henri Nuber 1964 Topps Collection

There are 295 PSA 10's in this set!!! That more than half the entire set...I'm sure to reach 300 soon...as I just made a deal with Mike for 3 more cards...

It's been two years as I stated in the beginning of this reply since I went from...getting rid of this set...to a really remarkable achievement (costly one I must admit...but that was not what this was about for me)...

ashabby

Awesome set. The year before I was born

TheDudeAbides

Speech ... less ...

bishop

I do not collect graded cards and because have collected all the Topps sets, I have not sought the kind of perfection in my sets that you have achieved in yours. Amazing.

What made you focus on 1964 ? This set has very few recognized variations-- Check List 7 and The AL Pitching Leaders card only--right ? Is the Pitching Leader card with no apostrophe hard to find in high grade ?

There are actually true variations for each checklist in the 1964 set ( this is true of all checklist in every Topps set from the 60s). If you have any interest in hearing about or seeing them, let me know. Here are some other print defects I have found for my set. The Toth and Cimoli are recurring

Robby

Amazing set Henri................Congratulations ! I started this set in 2002 in the Registry ( been active collecting this set raw since 1987 .........started buying Psa cards off of E-Bay in 1999 ) ...........REACHED 100% a few years back ( Robbie's 1964 Topps Set ) ! I love this set for its clean , simple colorful design , loved the scratched off trivia questions on the back ( which makes 64's unique in itself ) ! Plus it was the year my beloved St. Louis Cardinals won the pennant on the last day of the season and when on to beat the hated Yankee's in the World Series in 7 games ! As a 13 year boy , it was my first triumph as a baseball fan to experience the ultimate ' Dream Season ' ! Listened to every game and Harry Carey and Buck on the radio ..............even late at night when they traveled to the West Coast , I would get my transitor radio out and plug it into my ear , and stay up until I couldn't stay awake ! So collecting all those guys from that year in 1964 was a major goal for me at that time !
I don't know about Henri , but as a collector , that is my reason for collecting 1964 and why it is my all time favorite set ! Good luck Henri on your continued quest for 10's and perfection on this set !
Dave ' Robbie ' Robinson

bobsbbcards

Very impressive! Since it will be awhile before you're going to find any cards that would upgrade your set, why not spend your free time scanning the rest of your cards? I'm sure there are many (myself included) that would love to see them.

GDM67

Nearly impossible to overstate what an amazing accomplishment that set is.

HammeringHank

why not spend your free time scanning the rest of your cards?

All the scans you see in this set came with cards when I bought them...I've tried over the year to scan cards and have never been able to produce them with any quality...I have an EpsonCX7800 if you have any tips I'd love to scan them...but my scans do not come out as nearly well as those shown now...HELP? LOL....

gemint

Congrats Henry! That's some accomplishment. Do you track the PSA 10 population? If so, how many new 10s typically show up per year?

HammeringHank

What made you focus on 1964 ?

I really had no interest in the 64 set...I did not collect it in 64 either...I graduated from high school in 64 and was more interested in getting a car...I had stopped collecting baseball cards after the 1st series in 1963...

I restarted collecting cards again around 10 years ago when I tried to dump some of my cards that I still had from 1961 and 1962 to a collector named Tom Meilander...I was actually trying to upgrade my US Stamp collection and contacted him to see if he want to buy some of them...as it turns out next thing I know I'm trading with him my dupes and he sends me an EXMT set of 1960 baseball cards...I'm back collecting...

I started with ungraded cards as I really was not interested in paying top dollar...then I got tired of paying for top dollar to dealers that thought that their card was a 7-8 or 9 only to find out that it graded as a 6...I was only interested in creating a 7 looking set...I actually broke 7's and 8's out so I could put them in my binder...the story segues now...to answer the question why 1964...by this time I'm collecting 7-8's in fact I own the Tom Meilander 1960 and 1961 sets that he "retired" years ago when he was the "man" when it came to both those sets...

I was collecting sets from 1958 though 1963...did not have one 1964 card...

I was running through Registry online, like many collectors, and spotted this a 1964 set which was compromised of all PSA 9's and around a dozen PSA 10's in it...I wrote the collector and told him what a great set he had and if ever he was interested in selling it...to contact me...around 3-4 years later...he did!!

Next thing you know I bought his set (around 70% of the set)...well only the PSA 9's and the few 10's he had...I figured that I'd try to finish it off all in 9's that was my goal...I just never figured out that I'd be lucky enough to find 10's....I started buying 9's...and then 10's started showing up and wow...I bought some...next thing you know...I'm a 10 buyer...why? I have not the slightest idea why? It makes no sense to me...

I got carried away once I was determined to build the "best ever" set...and it just happened to be 1964...no reason...no rhyme...just did it...!!???

Is the Pitching Leader card with no apostrophe hard to find in high grade ?

Actually #4 Pitching Leader card that I have is a PSA 9 card...I just have not had it re-graded...I'm having trouble finding a high grade with apostrophe card to date...still looking...

bishop

Thanks for the background Henri. I am glad I did not get into graded cards. My "sickness" was deciding I needed every Topps set with variations and all associated inserts or test issues( I stopped doing inserts and test issues after 1994 due to the great proliferation in 1995). Once you get the bug, whatever course it takes, a cure seems illusory

HammeringHank

Well it's now 2016...wow...cannot believe how time flies. PSA finally selected my 1964 set for their Hall of Fame! Never did I imagine when I started collecting this set that this would happen. NEVER!

In 2010 my set earned Best Vintage Set of the year...it was graded at 9.17...if I could put all the 10's into it the set would be around 9.28 for a perfect set. Six years later the set is at 9.57 with a best set available at 11.007 (with bonuses...never understood what the bonuses meant)...regardless 10's are coming out of the woodwork (LOL)...I was sorry to see Dave Cryer sell his set...he was extremely helpful to me pointing out 10's to me when he found them. He offered me 32 of his cards that I did not have to upgrade my set even more...I just did not have the funds to take him up on it...

The closest I came to a perfect set was when I was about .102 away from a complete perfect set...now I'm 1.437 away from that happening...the set now contains over 300 PSA 10's...I do not think that it can be duplicated...it's a crazy set...still every day another PSA 1 of 1 10 shows up...I have mixed feelings about it all...cards that I paid $1500-$2000 for are now selling for $250 as instead of there being only 1 of 1 they now are 1 of 5...6 years ago I had some 9's that there were only 1 of 2 9's...today there are 5 PSA 10's of the same card...I do not believe any other vintage set is having that same experience...amazing all of a sudden every card that is graded seems to be a 10...LOL...well not really, but sure is odd...

Now I'm try to finish my 1963 Topps set...I have around 29 cards that I need...it will not be like the 64 set...but it does contain 30 PSA 10's in it...also playing around finishing my 62 set...which is really sort of my favorite set...I do not think I will be creating any more PSA 9 or above sets...I do have all my 61, 62 and 63 cards that I opened in those years when I was a kid...yes saved them all...so I have binder sets of those years that are cards that I opened in my childhood...takes me back to a gentler time...collecting cards for me is a hobby...I enjoy putting the sets together just like when I was a boy in the 60's...nothing has changed...well actually lot's have changed...I'm now grey-headed...

DanBessette

Henri, simply put, your 64 set is card porn! I'm collecting the 64's now, but the Venezuelan versions. Anyway, thanks for sharing.

bishop

Amazing set Henri. Good luck on the 63, 62...and 61. Keep us updated on then

GDM67

My admiration for this astonishing set has only grown.

HammeringHank

I do have a kicker for my 61, 62 and 63 sets...yes I'm putting them together in a lower rating however the cards have to be 50/50 center...top and bottom...those that I have are incredibly beautiful...particularly in the 61 and 62 sets...I picked up 2 new 63 cards...so down to 28 missing cards...I also bought 7 62 cards...that set has a way to go before it becomes a blimp on the screen...

I have 117 1963 PSA 8 and 12 PSA 9 cards that I need to sell...all dupes that I've upgraded...

gemint

It looks like Henri decided to part with his amazing 1964 set. Good luck with the auctions!

JRR300

i just saw the email announcing his set is coming soon. good luck. I'm sure it will do extremely well

mariner

It will be fun to watch on Heritage.