Ebay pushing folks out the door

silverstreak

The May 1 increase of FV fees max from $100 to $250 will push me out the door for good. Other attractive options are out there including the BST. See ya flee bay

cladking

I'm just about to get started and am seriously considering avoiding eBay altogether. I used to
play around on it a little and in those days you could buy stuff and have no fees at all. The seller
was responsible for the little bit of cost levied. Now there are fees everywhere. It always seemed
they were undercharging a little in those days but now they're charging several times as much.

When customers start leaving there's no point in sellers sticking around.

LindeDad

So your willing to give up about twenty eye balls to one on the few items that hits that price level?

Ahrensdad

I think this is good for GreatCollections.

silverstreak

<< <i>I think this is good for GreatCollections. >>



Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gaining traction.

291fifth

So far this year I have sold exactly one item on eBay. Results were disappointing and my attempt to garner interest by offering free shipping was a disaster.

Their attempt to get sellers to offer free shipping appears to be a failure. If anything, sellers seem to be raising their shipping charge to cover the added eBay/PayPal fees.

DennisH

<< <i>I think this is good for GreatCollections. >>

I'm heading there myself. They may need to add staff if eBay keeps going this path.

19Lyds

That stupid Final Value Fee on Shipping is what irks me.

I guess it only takes a couple of crooked and devious sellers to screw it up for everyone else.

I only offer Free Shipping on items where the profit will support free shipping. Other than that, it's all basic costs where I still lose .50 - .75 per package.

It's frustrating for numismatic sellers since profit margins are so low to begin with.

19Lyds

<< <i>

<< <i>I think this is good for GreatCollections. >>



Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gaining traction. >>

For sellers, it's good. For Buyers, maybe not so good since when I buy on eBay, I don't pay a "buyer's fee".

robertpr

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>I think this is good for GreatCollections. >>



Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gaining traction. >>

For sellers, it's good. For Buyers, maybe not so good since when I buy on eBay, I don't pay a "buyer's fee". >>



Yet.

AMRC

Not sure I would sell too many big ticket items with that new FV Fee.

ziggy29

<< <i>For sellers, it's good. For Buyers, maybe not so good since when I buy on eBay, I don't pay a "buyer's fee". >>

For buyers, it's not so good when sellers leave, because (a) they might not find what they want and (b) with fewer sellers comes reduced supply of items for sale, which in a supply-and-demand economy means higher prices for buyers.

Wolf359

I agree, eBay has jumped the shark.

GreatCollections looks pretty good.

For the el cheapo people out there, webstore.com is free. I've sold 10 coins there since March 1.

blu62vette

<< <i>I think this is good for GreatCollections. >>



Bingo.

19Lyds

<< <i>

<< <i>For sellers, it's good. For Buyers, maybe not so good since when I buy on eBay, I don't pay a "buyer's fee". >>

For buyers, it's not so good when sellers leave, because (a) they might not find what they want and (b) with fewer sellers comes reduced supply of items for sale, which in a supply-and-demand economy means higher prices for buyers. >>

I suppose you could look at it that way but if I have the choice of confidently buying a $1,000 coin on eBay from a respected seller vs buying the same coin on either Teletrade (at 15%), Heritage (at 15%), Stacks (at 17.5%) or Great Collections (at 10%), guess where I'm gonna shop at?

Maybe the thread totle should read: Ebay pushing High Value sellers out the door"?

tydye

Today I ran into two friends that use to sell vintage toys on ebay. Both have since quit selling there and are back on the show circuit.

ziggy29

<< <i>I suppose you could look at it that way but if I have the choice of confidently buying a $1,000 coin on eBay from a respected seller vs buying the same coin on either Teletrade (at 15%), Heritage (at 15%), Stacks (at 17.5%) or Great Collections (at 10%), guess where I'm gonna shop at?

Maybe the thread totle should read: Ebay pushing High Value sellers out the door"? >>

If a coin is worth a $1000 bid with no buyer's fee, it should be worth an $870 bid at Teletrade and Heritage, an $851 bid at Stack's or a $909 bid at Great Collections.

The interesting thing is that the traditional auction houses bend over backwards for the seller (sometimes paying more than 100% of hammer) even it means stratospheric buyer's fees... and eBay shafts the sellers and sucks up to the buyers.

blu62vette

<< <i>For sellers, it's good. For Buyers, maybe not so good since when I buy on eBay, I don't pay a "buyer's fee". >>

For buyers, it's not so good when sellers leave, because (a) they might not find what they want and (b) with fewer sellers comes reduced supply of items for sale, which in a supply-and-demand economy means higher prices for buyers. >>

I suppose you could look at it that way but if I have the choice of confidently buying a $1,000 coin on eBay from a respected seller vs buying the same coin on either Teletrade (at 15%), Heritage (at 15%), Stacks (at 17.5%) or Great Collections (at 10%), guess where I'm gonna shop at? >>



Don't most buyers factor the fee into the bid? If I am wiling to spend $200 on a coin, that is how much I would spend. I may bid 200 on ebay, but at stacks I would be bidding about 170.

stevkc

<< <i>...in those days you could buy stuff and have no fees at all. >>



There's fees for buying now? I don't think so.

cladking

<< <i>

<< <i>...in those days you could buy stuff and have no fees at all. >>



There's fees for buying now? I don't think so. >>



I thought you had to use payPal.

Absolution

Instead of putting winner agrees to pay for all shipping costs I am now putting winner agrees to pay for all eBay fees lol

shorecoll

Because of it's business model, eBay must constantly prove to wall street that it can keep raising costs, unless enough people leave to actually hurt them (as opposed to talking about leaving), they must keep at it. They have probably modelled the number of sellers they expect to leave...and if fewer than that leave, they might increase them again. They might not even care if the entire coin category leaves as long as the increases from other categories makes up the difference. In spite of all the b$%%ing about eBay, in the last 10 years, the only company that has actually increased prices and trashed themselves is Netflix.

mingot

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>...in those days you could buy stuff and have no fees at all. >>



There's fees for buying now? I don't think so. >>



I thought you had to use payPal. >>



Even if you do use paypal the seller eats all of the fees.

ziggy29

<< <i>Because of it's business model, eBay must constantly prove to wall street that it can keep raising costs, unless enough people leave to actually hurt them (as opposed to talking about leaving), they must keep at it. >>

I think eBay's business model -- as the first to really execute in this space -- provides them with a HUGE moat, a "natural monopoly", a huge barrier to meaningful competition. And they have not been shy about exploiting that. Like it or not, to a point that's good business (and being responsible to shareholders) if you can keep increasing your take without losing many customers.

Having said that, a huge moat is still not an infinitely deep and wide one. It is possible to get so big for your britches that even a humongous moat can't contain the desire to escape it. It remains to be seen when eBay gets there, but at the rate they keep increasing their pound of flesh, it could happen. And if it does, look out below, since eBay is priced with a "natural monopoly premium", losing a near-monopoly status in their space would be a huge hit.

TwoSides2aCoin

Seems I'm required to meet their criteria yet they're not too good at meeting mine. I could understand the fee structure if they were doing something besides dictating to me whether I meet some rule they keep changing. Between them and government, I don't know who's more dictatorial.

ziggy29

<< <i>There's fees for buying now? I don't think so. >>

Technically no, not directly. But the cost of eBay and PayPal fees are often "baked in" to the BIN price, the opening bid or the reserve.

19Lyds

<< <i>

<< <i>I suppose you could look at it that way but if I have the choice of confidently buying a $1,000 coin on eBay from a respected seller vs buying the same coin on either Teletrade (at 15%), Heritage (at 15%), Stacks (at 17.5%) or Great Collections (at 10%), guess where I'm gonna shop at?

Maybe the thread totle should read: Ebay pushing High Value sellers out the door"? >>

If a coin is worth a $1000 bid with no buyer's fee, it should be worth an $870 bid at Teletrade and Heritage, an $851 bid at Stack's or a $909 bid at Great Collections.

The interesting thing is that the traditional auction houses bend over backwards for the seller (sometimes paying more than 100% of hammer) even it means stratospheric buyer's fees... and eBay shafts the sellers and sucks up to the buyers. >>

I don't think it works that way except in a "perfect" world and this one's far from perfect.
There may be some folks that do factor the buyers premium into their bids, but those folks usually lose more than they win.

airplanenut

<< <i>That stupid Final Value Fee on Shipping is what irks me.

I guess it only takes a couple of crooked and devious sellers to screw it up for everyone else.

I only offer Free Shipping on items where the profit will support free shipping. Other than that, it's all basic costs where I still lose .50 - .75 per package.

It's frustrating for numismatic sellers since profit margins are so low to begin with. >>

At least if you have a store, the fees DROPPED when they started collecting a fee on shipping. Unless you have seriously expensive shipping, this change meant overall LOWER fees.

19Lyds

<< <i>

<< <i>There's fees for buying now? I don't think so. >>

Technically no, not directly. But the cost of eBay and PayPal fees are often "baked in" to the BIN price, the opening bid or the reserve. >>

This is true for ANY selling venue.

19Lyds

<< <i>

<< <i>Because of it's business model, eBay must constantly prove to wall street that it can keep raising costs, unless enough people leave to actually hurt them (as opposed to talking about leaving), they must keep at it. >>

I think eBay's business model -- as the first to really execute in this space -- provides them with a HUGE moat, a "natural monopoly", a huge barrier to meaningful competition. And they have not been shy about exploiting that. Like it or not, to a point that's good business (and being responsible to shareholders) if you can keep increasing your take without losing many customers.

Having said that, a huge moat is still not an infinitely deep and wide one. It is possible to get so big for your britches that even a humongous moat can't contain the desire to escape it. It remains to be seen when eBay gets there, but at the rate they keep increasing their pound of flesh, it could happen. And if it does, look out below, since eBay is priced with a "natural monopoly premium", losing a near-monopoly status in their space would be a huge hit. >>

I agree with you. eBay has a monopoly which will eventually crumble once the competition gets rid of the buyers fee's. Thats a huge obstacle that needs to be overcome.

GreateCollections and Teletrade are really good venues except for the buyers fee's and the shipping costs. On eBay, no buyers fee's and sometimes low or even free shipping. Us simpleton's see this at "face value" and it's the primary basis for making the decision to buy. Once folks have to start calculating the "true" costs, the usually lose interest.

Remember the fella that was surprised when Teletrade charged him a "buyers fee"? He tried to email them telling them he changed his mind and didn't want to pay for the item he'd won. This is the typical eBay mentality which enables eBay to stay on the top of the online buying heap.

Of course, we all know that they're not an "auction house" even though they continue to move in that direction.

Perhaps their "brainiacs" will look at the Auction Houses and start thinking about the money they are leaving on the table by not charging buyer's fee's?
I think the end would follow very shortly after that.

Spooly

No buyer fees / No seller fees


Webstore Auctions

Tiny

<< <i>I think this is good for GreatCollections. >>




I gave up on eBay months ago and use Great Collections. I hate jacking the price of a coin up on eBay to cover their
fees, Pay Pal fees and then postage.

derryb

as Russ pointed out in an earlier thread, opening a store will be a big savings for high dollar item sellers. I believe the raise in FVF was done just to do that, shift big sellers over to a store front.

coinhunters

EBAY is no longer a viable service for the occasional " Seller ". Their services are now geared toward those seller's that can justify having EBAY-Stores. The hand writing was on the wall a few years ago and prompted my departure from use of those services. Now even some large volume sellers are feeling the crunch. Either way, EBAY , IMHO is loosing ground and customers fast. They are going to have to reinvent this wheel to make it continue to spin in their long term favor. I'll continue to depend upon my relationships at my local coin club and shows , to either buy or sell. Hey , NO SELLER"S FEE"S and....NO BUYERS FEE"S. NO S & H Cost's ! That my friends is a no brainer for me.

amwldcoin

IMHO Ebay is trying to overtake Amazon. What their stupid corperate idiots don't realize is all the smaller sellers are what make ebay successful! Run off the minions and the bigger sellers might as well put up with all the sh*t Amazon throws on their sellers!

pf70collector

ebay is charging buyer's fees only they are making the seller's pay them.

LindeDad

A quick check on eBay right now for Coins US gives this "481,142 results found in Coins: US." How many are on the BST and Great Collections combined this week might yield 10% of that.

All the gripping in the world not changing the fact it's still the biggest show in town.

bronzemat

<< <i>A quick check on eBay right now for Coins US gives this "481,142 results found in Coins: US." How many are on the BST and Great Collections combined this week might yield 10% of that.

All the gripping in the world not changing the fact it's still the biggest show in town.

>>



Indeed, and despite it all I still find good deals to be had among the world and ancient coin sections. Its just patience.

Batman23

<< <i>

<< <i>I suppose you could look at it that way but if I have the choice of confidently buying a $1,000 coin on eBay from a respected seller vs buying the same coin on either Teletrade (at 15%), Heritage (at 15%), Stacks (at 17.5%) or Great Collections (at 10%), guess where I'm gonna shop at?

Maybe the thread totle should read: Ebay pushing High Value sellers out the door"? >>

If a coin is worth a $1000 bid with no buyer's fee, it should be worth an $870 bid at Teletrade and Heritage, an $851 bid at Stack's or a $909 bid at Great Collections.

The interesting thing is that the traditional auction houses bend over backwards for the seller (sometimes paying more than 100% of hammer) even it means stratospheric buyer's fees... and eBay shafts the sellers and sucks up to the buyers. >>




Looking at the ebay fee calculator, a coin ending at $1000 bid will cost the seller $120 in ebay/paypal fees plus any shipping. Sell gets less than $880. You can save $30 in fees by using a $1000 BIN.

Russ

<< <i>No buyer fees / No seller fees


Webstore Auctions >>



And no traffic.

Russ, NCNE

Russ

<< <i>Looking at the ebay fee calculator, a coin ending at $1000 bid will cost the seller $120 in ebay/paypal fees plus any shipping. >>



With a store, the total fees would be $71.05 and that's before any discounts earned. You think you can get a fee deal that's only 7.1% with any other venue that has the traffic eBay does?

Russ, NCNE

madax425

<< <i>So your willing to give up about twenty eye balls to one on the few items that hits that price level? I looked at your store on e-bay, the same quality is readily available for much less,at least on the generic items $99.00 for a common 64 morgan,you have to love e-bay if it enables you to sell for such high markups.
>>

jdimmick

I had been selling a lot on there the past couple of years, over 225k in 2010 , and 1/4 milion in 2011.

The fee's are tough, but I can stand that cause its really hard to find a competitor that gets the market share and viewers that ebay gets.

However, some other things have come up as of recent that really have ticked me off:

Got into it with two buyers over the past 6 months, 1st guy calling me at all hours of the night for weeks and hanging up the phone and acting childish about a transaction we had it out on, course e-bay did nothing. Recently, Guy threatened me with negative feedback, and of course ebay does nothing and he slams me.(buyer is smart, knows how to play the system.) The I try and re-taliate , and ebay removes it and then slaps me with a policy violation. That coupled with the 14 day return, and so many scams that happen on a daily basis(that I read on here) that leaves me scared to put on anything significant , I have quit listing as of Apr 1.

I too have herd great things about great collections, and will probably look into possibly doing some business with them in the future on 1k plus items , and to be honest, saving up items that come in to carry too the larger shows liek Baltimore / ANA to sell to the national dealers. I have had great transactions with Harry Laibstain, the boys from Reeded edge as well as did some business with Harlan Berk and David Kahn this time around.
jim

Russ

<< <i>That coupled with the 14 day return >>



When eBay announced this change last summer, I screamed bloody murder. But I went ahead and switched from my 3 day policy to 14 days last fall. Guess what? It's had no impact at all. No increase in returns, in fact no returns.



<< <i>and so many scams that happen on a daily basis(that I read on here) >>



For every scam you hear about, there were 100,000 perfectly fine transactions. Don't let the fear-mongering make your decisions for you.

Russ, NCNE

Kove

<< <i>If a coin is worth a $1000 bid with no buyer's fee, it should be worth an $870 bid at Teletrade and Heritage, an $851 bid at Stack's or a $909 bid at Great Collections. >>




Aside from my own website, I sell through Teletrade, GreatCollections, and eBay. While each 3rd party venue has its place, eBay nets me more money as a seller, hands-down. With my eBay store, the $1000 coin discussed above nets me $928 as a Buy It Now, after eBay+PayPal get their cut.

Considering the outrageous shipping that TT and Heritage now charge, and it makes factored-in free shipping on eBay look even better. Add the fact that TT charges 5% restocking on returns, and SB and Heritage don't even allow returns on Signature auctions, and the eBay Buyer Protection looks even better.

There's been a lot of emotion over eBay for the past few years--and I do agree the fees are high--but it's still the best venue around for eyeballs-on-coins, earnings-after-fees, and vast selection of coins. Great Collections is my favored bet for traditional auctions, but sellers will still usually get more money on eBay, and more control of their coins during the process.

derryb

don't forget, your ebay/paypal fees include "insurance."

Raufus

No matter how bad Ebay gets, they always seem to find a way be worse on sellers. More demands, more fees. What a disaster.

TwoSides2aCoin

<< <i>No matter how bad Ebay gets, they always seem to find a way be worse on sellers. More demands, more fees. What a disaster. >>



I would agree, because as a dealer, if I collectively and objectively look at all of the negative threads about "COIN DEALERS" , it appears to me that "WE" need the greatest demands put on us

In light of this, it's become a better venue for buyers.

Raufus

This policy also pushes sellers to fixed priced formats for higher dollar items.

This pushes high-dollar auctions to over 14% including PP fees. Good lord.

Edited to add... I love how Ebay delivers the great news with an email touting free pics. Great, free pics and MASSIVE new FVFs.

Was it not that long ago when the max FVF was $50?

silverstreak

The other point is that with Great Collections I don't have to worry about the crazy buyers on Ebay. For instance I sold a NGC MS69 2011 W GAE. Buyer returns it because it had a rim ding? Duhhhhhh it was not graded 70 for a reason igit. And I sure could not find a rim ding. Had to be microscopic.

g048406

<< <i>don't forget, your ebay/paypal fees include "insurance." >>



Does that mean if I send a coin out with just signature confirmation/tracking and the coin is lost in the mail, that ebay will cover it? If so, than I need to stop sending via the expensive USPS Registered mail.