Helmar Bad for the hobby?
addicted2ebay
Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭✭
Helmar "art" cards are always selling on ebay for hundreds of dollars in the same design as Goudy, t206,Cracker Jack,T3'S and other pre-war designs. These cards are NOT LICENSED and are using famous names, famous designs, and team names along with there logos. Is that not trademark infringement ? In there listings you have to scroll down to read that they are not original cards even though the seller gives them a fake "R319" with a vintage look in the gallery that comes across as a original pre-war card. What is the difference from someone making there own cards of current players that looks like a design from a modern card producer?
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It's kind of a grey area from what I can see.
Edit to add...
Each card is hand painted, they aren't printed. They come with a signed cert on the back verifying it is a painting.
I don't see how it would be any more of a LICENSING violation than paintings of Campbell's Soup cans. (I could never understand why those things were of such great significance)
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
This sold for $80,000,000.... Do you not believe a hand painted image of a player can sell for $300?
Even though a lot of people find them attractive, they are NOT pre-war cards, and they should be listed in the modern section.
I hated having to scroll through all of 'em, and finally had to exclude the sellers of those cards from my pre-1942 search.
The stamps from 1911 (T332) are the only actual Helmar issue; here's mine for example:
Collecting: Topps 1952-79, Bowman 1952-55, OPC 1965-71, and Pre-War White Sox cards
Im sure some of it is public domain by now so they can use the images etc. Much of the demand is the supply, many of these are said to be unique (one of a kind), so player collectors usually like them. I dont have any desire to ever pick up one, but they are nice looking. They seem to be branching out too much though, some designs are lame, and some player choices are lame as well. originally it was vintage 1910-40s players on the R319 looking cards. They even had round clear front padlocks with players images inside too, they were neat but still a modern piece so wouldnt fit my collection.
This is recent, hand made art by Helmar. Size is traditional for this design at about 11" x 8.25". Printed on paper stock consistent with the early 1900's, then distressed to give it that worn, well-loved look. You will feel as if you are holding a vintage card in your hands.
My comments: Would seem to cross the line. I don't know if it's trademark infringement or what. While they are clear in the listing, this listing will not always be with the card. If they were honest, the comment from the eBay listing would be printed on the back. They are unable to conceive original artwork so they simply ripoff someone else. These are garbage...
one of a kind artworks, but most of the cards you see on eBay are printed
versions, albeit in limited quantities.
As mentioned, an interesting discussion on these cards happened over at
Net54, and the owner offered some helpful info on his company.
Quoted from that thread:
Thank you. We make original paintings, usually with opaque watercolors.
Then the paintings are scanned and, in this case, the text and logos were
added in photoshop. Normally the backs are done in photoshop or photopaint.
They are made here, on the same 12 color press that the New York Metropolitan
Museum of Art uses to produce their high-end lithographs.
The cool thing about these cards, in my opinion, is that they are artificially
aged, which makes condition almost a non-factor and basically makes
grading irrelevant. Just a different way of approaching the hobby.
<< <i>Ok...
This sold for $80,000,000.... Do you not believe a hand painted image of a player can sell for $300?
WOW! 80 with seven 0's????? Looks like something my kid made in art class. Who made that?
<< <i> For those who sell original authentic pre-war cards isn't Helmar making the market a little more soft by sucking money out of collectors pockets who might otherwise buy the real deal? >>
That is certainly one way of looking at competition. To most of us we see it that the people buying these products value them more than anything else they could possibly do with the money, while people who buy original cards value those more than anything else they could do with that money. Definitely a good thing for all involved
some are too rich for my blood, but the public sets the price not the Helmar creators.
Here's an original art of local boy Eddie Plank alongside his 1933 Goudey looking card. Plank died in 1926, so I have no illusions that it is vintage.
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
<< <i>Welcome to the boards NVbaseball and addicted2ebay. How did you guys ever get interested in this Helmar stuff anyhow? Are you long-time collectors new to CU? Are you coming more from the art side of the collectible business? >>
Hello cards651
Collected cards for almost 20 years, but not in the past few years. Actually trying to get rid of everything I accumulated. Going through them all to see what to trash and what to sell led me here. Even if I never buy anything more, still would like to talk about it
Never heard of these cards before, but they do look really cool and capture a sense of history. And those are always primary factors in deciding what is worth collecting
Chapman/Mays
In many ways, they're a more true collectable than today's manufactured scarcity, as they are given out as a point of purchase inclusion. I like them a lot. Really want the Clemente...just not for the price.
Edited to add: I see these hand distressed copies aren't being offered with the beer or potato chips...that's a shame.
Good luck to him. I like his style.