JOE PATERNO dies at age 85
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Dboneesq
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in Sports Talk
EDITED: UPDATE:
His family released a statement Sunday morning to announce his death: "His loss leaves a void in our lives that will never be filled."
"He died as he lived," the statement said. "He fought hard until the end, stayed positive, thought only of others and constantly reminded everyone of how blessed his life had been. His ambitions were far reaching, but he never believed he had to leave this Happy Valley to achieve them. He was a man devoted to his family, his university, his players and his community."
2nd edit ... this one on 07/12/12 - I took out the words "RIP Mr. Paterno" from my above comments!
His family released a statement Sunday morning to announce his death: "His loss leaves a void in our lives that will never be filled."
"He died as he lived," the statement said. "He fought hard until the end, stayed positive, thought only of others and constantly reminded everyone of how blessed his life had been. His ambitions were far reaching, but he never believed he had to leave this Happy Valley to achieve them. He was a man devoted to his family, his university, his players and his community."
2nd edit ... this one on 07/12/12 - I took out the words "RIP Mr. Paterno" from my above comments!
STAY HEALTHY!
Doug
Liquidating my collection for the 3rd and final time. Time for others to enjoy what I have enjoyed over the last several decades. Money could be put to better use.
Doug
Liquidating my collection for the 3rd and final time. Time for others to enjoy what I have enjoyed over the last several decades. Money could be put to better use.
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Comments
hang in there Joe
<< <i>Is it wrong that im tearing up? >>
If you are being serious ... hell no! My daughters laugh at me sometimes ... I probably tear up almost everyday. Yup, sometimes even at commercials on TV!!!!
Doug
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<< <i>Is it wrong that im tearing up? >>
If you are being serious ... hell no! My daughters laugh at me sometimes ... I probably tear up almost everyday. Yup, sometimes even at commercials on TV!!!! >>
Yes i was being serious.
Doug
Liquidating my collection for the 3rd and final time. Time for others to enjoy what I have enjoyed over the last several decades. Money could be put to better use.
<< <i>Tearing up over JOE PATERNO?? Oh, hellz no! >>
One thing you need to realize, is Joe Pa has been a part of our lives since before I was born. Just like a young boy growing up watching/idolizing the likes of Mantle, Williams, Robinson to name a few. They become somewhat family if you will, you care for them and want them to do well on and off the field. I wonder how many people on these boards shead a tear when Mantle or Munson died ? I did when Mantle died and I never even got to see him play or meet the man. Maybe its just the way im wired, my love for sports,history and tradition. I care about my fellow man.
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<< <i>Tearing up over JOE PATERNO?? Oh, hellz no! >>
One thing you need to realize, is Joe Pa has been a part of our lives since before I was born. Just like a young boy growing up watching/idolizing the likes of Mantle, Williams, Robinson to name a few. They become somewhat family if you will, you care for them and want them to do well on and off the field. I wonder how many people on these boards shead a tear when Mantle or Munson died ? I did when Mantle died and I never even got to see him play or meet the man. Maybe its just the way im wired, my love for sports,history and tradition. I care about my fellow man. >>
+1
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<< <i>
<< <i>Tearing up over JOE PATERNO?? Oh, hellz no! >>
One thing you need to realize, is Joe Pa has been a part of our lives since before I was born. Just like a young boy growing up watching/idolizing the likes of Mantle, Williams, Robinson to name a few. They become somewhat family if you will, you care for them and want them to do well on and off the field. I wonder how many people on these boards shead a tear when Mantle or Munson died ? I did when Mantle died and I never even got to see him play or meet the man. Maybe its just the way im wired, my love for sports,history and tradition. I care about my fellow man. >>
+1 >>
+2 A man should be remembered by the sum total of his life's works, not solely by his human failings.
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<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Tearing up over JOE PATERNO?? Oh, hellz no! >>
One thing you need to realize, is Joe Pa has been a part of our lives since before I was born. Just like a young boy growing up watching/idolizing the likes of Mantle, Williams, Robinson to name a few. They become somewhat family if you will, you care for them and want them to do well on and off the field. I wonder how many people on these boards shead a tear when Mantle or Munson died ? I did when Mantle died and I never even got to see him play or meet the man. Maybe its just the way im wired, my love for sports,history and tradition. I care about my fellow man. >>
+1 >>
+2 A man should be remembered by the sum total of his life's works, not solely by his human failings. >>
+3
<< <i>Sad? Sure any time somebody dies it's sad but in this case he was 85, had lived a full life, and it was really time to put that Penn State story behind us. Plus, the fact will always remain though that he didn't do what he could have done to protect young children and thus I personally have no respect for the man. >>
BAM! Thank you....that is exactly what I meant. 85 is a long life. As for being sad that he passed, nope, not me. I feel for his kids and grandkids that they lost their grandfather, but that's about it. Next.....
<< <i>Sad? Sure any time somebody dies it's sad but in this case he was 85, had lived a full life, and it was really time to put that Penn State story behind us. Plus, the fact will always remain though that he didn't do what he could have done to protect young children and thus I personally have no respect for the man. >>
I think JoePa was a product of his generation. Many have said over the last few years that he should retire because his "old school" style no longer worked. But each time they called him finished after a bad season, the Lions rebounded back into the rankings.
As it turns out, his detractors were right: ultimately his failures *were* for being "old school" -- but not as it applies to X's and O's on the field. Let's not forget that the man was already 18 when WW2 was still being fought, and that generation had a different dynamic. Theirs was one of structure and order, one of devotion to the chain of command. If there's something that occurs in your workplace that you don't feel qualified to handle yourself -- or where organizational policy required it -- you report it to your superior.
So it turns out Joe's "old school" upbringing and experience *did* become his undoing. But not the "old school" on the field, but the "old school" in terms of how you handle off-field problems. A coach needs to adapt not only to changes in how the game is played, but to what social expectations are. Fifty years ago, if this had happened I don't think many would have held him largely responsible; he did his job in alerting those up the chain of command. But today the allegations that were made are considered so severe, so sensitive, some of the most heinously criminal acts in today's world... that "kicking it to superiors" or "following protocol" is no longer acceptable as the response. These days, a situation like this demands breaking protocol. To hell with the rules when THIS alleged crime is involved. Joe was applying 1952 standards to a 2002 incident with 2002 sensibilities. And 1952 responses to this incident are clearly not acceptable.
Joe screwed up. I don't think it was any attempt to "cover it up" but was his old school response to a situation where an old school response is no longer adequate. And it does bother me that people act like he is more responsible than anyone other than the perp himself. More responsible than the *superiors* he reported it to. More responsible than the guy who SAW the alleged incident and not only failed to intervene by calling 911 or confronting Sandusky, but ran to Daddy. THAT is wrong. VERY wrong. Some of JoePa's critics are putting almost all of the blame on him when there are at least, by my count, FOUR people more responsible (Sandusky, McQueary and the two superiors Paterno reported it to).
In the end, yes, his "old schoolness" DID bite him in the butt eventually. But that's no excuse. If you want to hold his position you have to know how social and cultural expectations have changed. It's not like you're going to have segregated locker rooms any more, so there is precedent for knowing how to adapt to the times. Joe didn't here. And paid with his life (there's no question in my mind that this incident took all the fight out of him).
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<< <i>It feels good to be surrounded by such perfect individuals... >>
+1
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It's a far cry from being "perfect" to allowing a sexual predator to pray on young boys as you didn't want to upset the football program. Come on now. Nobody here is suggesting they are perfect. However, I sure hope that any one of us would go straight to law enforcement if we heard about something like this happening at our place of employment.
Fortunately the Board of Trustees had the guts to overthrow the dictator.
Numerous times i had seen Joe just walking down the street like any other person. A few of those times i had the oppurtunity to stop and shake his hand and have a short conversation with him. He loved the students at PSU and the university as a whole.
I respect other peoples opinions on the situation, but there is no reason to post hateful and mean things about a man that just died.
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If there is a heaven and a h*ll, divine judgment will determine what his ultimate destination will be.
<< <i>Yet Paterno is the one getting "wished to hell" the most out of the whole group, even more than Sandusky himself. STILL I hear Paterno's name TEN TIMES more than Sandusky's!! Paterno didn't f**k any kids!! Don't you get that?? He wasn't even charged with anything, let alone found guilty of anything!! You people don't know s**t about what happened!! Get off your freaking high horse!! The dude is dead now, yet you people still aren't satisfied. I could give two craps about Penn State, but I think what you people are saying about him is completely ridiculous and it shows what type of people you really are. >>
I am not wishing him to hell so I am assume I am not one of "you people." I am just saying I don't think Paterno is nearly as great as so many people indicate. In terms of Sandusky he isn't being discussed here. This thread is about Paterno. If you want to start a thread about the Penn State scandel I am sure Sandusky will get his due. I think the reason people don't talk about him is because that's pretty open and shut. Sandusky is a scum bag who should rot in hell. Paterno is more up for debate which is why people are more interested in talking about him.
It dosen't matter how many football games Paterno won or how many pros he coached. Football is trivial compaired to the well being of children.
<< <i>People who are so sure he's an evil man who's more responsible than anyone else save perhaps for Sandusky himself had better hope this isn't another Duke Lacrosse or McMartin scandal here, or else they'll look really stupid. Last I checked these were still allegations, not proven beyond a reasonable doubt in court. Granted, the evidence *seems* stronger than in those incidents, but they still haven't been proven in court. I guess peeing on graves doesn't get the "innocent until proven guilty" treatment in the court of public opinion. >>
Read the court papers released so far. Multiple victim testimonies collaborated by multiple witnesses. The only innocents are the several kids, many of which happened after Penn State officials, and Paterno, turned a blind eye.
The injustice here is that Paterno didn't die in a shared jail cell.
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<< <i>Read the court papers released so far. Multiple victim testimonies collaborated by multiple witnesses. The only innocents are the several kids, many of which happened after Penn State officials, and Paterno, turned a blind eye. >>
I have read them.
But I stand by what I said -- there has been no trial yet. Maybe you want to live in a system where guilt is established before a fair trial, but I don't. And I sure as hell never said Paterno was "innocent" of complicity in anything -- just that (a) there hasn't been a trial of Sandusky yet and (b) people are acting like Paterno is the most responsible of all when I think there are at least FOUR individuals more responsible (Sandusky, the two superiors Paterno reported it to, and McQueary, who witnessed the alleged wrongdoing but went home to Daddy instead of intervening with either a 911 call or confronting Sandusky).
But to hear some of you foam at the mouth, you'd think Paterno actually committed the offense and no one else was involved.
<< <i>What it comes down to is Paterno looked the other way. He allowed young childern to be molested and said nothing because it would damge his program.
It dosen't matter how many football games Paterno won or how many pros he coached. Football is trivial compaired to the well being of children. >>
Precisely. His legacy is wholly tainted because he sacrificed the well being of vulnerable children to preserve his "pristine" reputation. All this adulation and well wishing of Joe Pa while ignoring the proverbial elephant in the room is nauseating.
<< <i>People who are so sure he's an evil man who's more responsible than anyone else save perhaps for Sandusky himself had better hope this isn't another Duke Lacrosse or McMartin scandal here, or else they'll look really stupid. Last I checked these were still allegations, not proven beyond a reasonable doubt in court. Granted, the evidence *seems* stronger than in those incidents, but they still haven't been proven in court. I guess peeing on graves doesn't get the "innocent until proven guilty" treatment in the court of public opinion. >>
Since O.J. is in jail, perhaps you can help him find the real killer.
<< <i>What it comes down to is Paterno looked the other way. He allowed young childern to be molested and said nothing because it would damge his program. >>
How the hell do you know his motivations? How do you know why he "said nothing"? (And he DIDN'T say nothing he just didn't say it enough or to the people he should have.)
Maybe you are right, but to state it like proven fact is pretty ridiculous. I'm not an apologist for this guy; his legacy is justifiably tainted. But some of you people think you have all the answers, and I think that's disgusting.
<< <i>Since O.J. is in jail, perhaps you can help him find the real killer. >>
Wow, you are witty and profound as hell. I stand humbled before your rhetorical greatness.
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<< <i>Since O.J. is in jail, perhaps you can help him find the real killer. >>
Wow, you are witty and profound as hell. I stand humbled before your rhetorical greatness. >>
Cmon, man, comparing Sandusky with the Duke scandal? Gimme a break. Get a sense of humor as well.
<< <i>Cmon, man, comparing Sandusky with the Duke scandal? Gimme a break. Get a sense of humor as well. >>
Never said (or intended to imply) they were identical in terms of evidence. But the OJ reference means little as well, given how many people (including some on death row) were convicted and later proven innocent. If some of the people on the board had their way, it feels like these folks (later proven innocent) would have been executed the moment the arrest was made.
Do I think these Sandusky incidents happened? Yes, at least some of them. Do I know it? No. Do I think a jury will hear and see things you and I never have access to? Yes.
I guess what bugs me isn't just the rush to judgment but also a loss in the sense of proportion in terms of who is to blame if everything *is* as it seems. For sure Joe screwed up; I think I've been abundantly clear on that point. Even if this WAS another Duke Lacrosse thing, he should be following up more than he did. I guess I just feel like people are using his fame and status as a reason to give him a gigantically oversized portion of the total blame for the incident. Like I said before, I think there are four people who are even *more* culpable in this, but some act like Joe himself raped children.
Some of you may think Paterno's fame and media presence gave him more responsibility to put it out there than McQueary or either of the two superiors Paterno reported it to (and thus make him more responsible than perhaps all but the perp himself). If that's the case, that's fine, I'll agree to disagree there. I can't see how someone who witnessed the alleged incident and ran home to Daddy, or the two "superiors" who didn't follow up (you want to talk about someone trying to cover a program's ass?)... are less contemptible if the facts prove to be what they appear to the casual observer through the lens of the media.
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<< <i>Read the court papers released so far. Multiple victim testimonies collaborated by multiple witnesses. The only innocents are the several kids, many of which happened after Penn State officials, and Paterno, turned a blind eye. >>
I have read them.
But I stand by what I said -- there has been no trial yet. Maybe you want to live in a system where guilt is established before a fair trial, but I don't. And I sure as hell never said Paterno was "innocent" of complicity in anything -- just that (a) there hasn't been a trial of Sandusky yet and (b) people are acting like Paterno is the most responsible of all when I think there are at least FOUR individuals more responsible (Sandusky, the two superiors Paterno reported it to, and McQueary, who witnessed the alleged wrongdoing but went home to Daddy instead of intervening with either a 911 call or confronting Sandusky).
But to hear some of you foam at the mouth, you'd think Paterno actually committed the offense and no one else was involved. >>
I am able to separate myself from the justice system, who's opinion on many things change every few years. I don't see how anyone can read the court papers and bring up Duke Lacrosse, which is far removed from this case in evidence.
Of course Paterno is not the only guilty party. I noted Penn State officials in my comment, and even put them before Paterno. Paterno is the bigger recognized name and the subject of the thread.
However, it was not the other officials that allowed, for many years, a known child molester continue to bring kids to games and set at the table with the team to eat meals. They, which includes Paterno, allowed him to run his child charity program on campus, and didn't just ignore red flags, ignored blazing fires.
We are....Penn State.
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<< <i>Of course Paterno is not the only guilty party. I noted Penn State officials in my comment, and even put them before Paterno. Paterno is the bigger recognized name and the subject of the thread. >>
Fair enough. I was speaking more generally, not to you specifically, in terms of what I thought the attitude was out there.
And in some sense, Paterno got off easy. He was almost 85 when forced out of his job; he had a good, long run to almost the end. McQueary? He's what, 37 or 38 now... and he's already finished -- AND has to live with this for many decades, most likely. Do you want your kids associating with anyone who allegedly witnessed child molestation and neither called 911 nor confronted the molester?
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<< <i> I guess I just feel like people are using his fame and status as a reason to give him a gigantically oversized portion of the total blame for the incident. Like I said before, I think there are four people who are even *more* culpable in this, but some act like Joe himself raped children. >>
First of all if you want to talk about the other parties involved then by all means start a thread about them and people will give you opinions on those subjects. The fact that this is a thread about Paterno is going to draw talk about Paterno. Secondly, your argument is double-sided because there are people that are using his past fame and status as a reason to give him a pass on his involvement. I have not read a single post here saying Paterno is *more* culpable in this then any other party involved.
Take all of Paterno's good deeds/works in his lifetime and call it a tall glass of pure spring water. Well this mistake he made is a giant turd in the glass of water. Forgive me for not drinking the water
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Sorry it had to end this way --- you deserved so much better.
Dave
It's a good thing that all of the members of these message boards are not measured by the lowest points of their lives (or by the mistakes we've made) - otherwise, none of us would be friends. Yes, Joe probably didn't pursue this with his best efforts, but he is not the GUILTY one. But somehow, the freakin (insert other 'F' word here) media has painted him as the pedophile and rapist. It is just flat out wrong how he is being portrayed.
RIP JO-PA; RIP.
Despite attending Penn State University Park for 4.5 years, I never had the opportunity to meet JoePa. I heard stories of friends that had - most memorably two friends who, while out riding their bikes, saw him driving home from practice on the eve of the 2005 Ohio State game. They decided to follow him all the way into his garage so that they could shake his hand and wish him luck. Instead of being weirded out (which would have been pretty understandable) he was very gracious and thanked them for the support.
The first weekend in this past December, I was visiting Penn State for a number of different reasons. While I was there, I wanted to show my support for Joe in light of his cancer diagnosis and how he had been mistreated by the University and the press (based on incomplete information and misinformation) in the last month. I decided to leave him a note expressing my support along with a blue & white bouquet of flowers. I felt awkward approaching the Paternos' home. I had heard stories of students and alumni that had walked right up, rung the doorbell, and been welcomed in by Joe and Sue - in some cases, even being fed by Sue - but having never met the Paternos, I didn't have the nerve. I left the note and bouquet on their doorstep and walked away. That was the afternoon of Sunday, Dec. 4.
On Wednesday, Dec. 7, I received a text from my Mom:
"Does Joe Pa live on McKee St? If so, you got a card from him."
I think my jaw must have dropped about five feet. I was absolutely stunned that Joe and Sue would take the time to send me a card. Later, when I read the card, I was even more humbled by what it contained. Joe and Sue thanked me for the flowers and the note, and said that Joe was drawing strength in his battle with cancer from all the support he had received from Penn Staters. They said that it was "good to be reminded of what we were trying to accomplish at Penn State." They said that after they finished "getting Joe healthy," they would work to remind people of the values that Joe had tried to impart during his time at Penn State. The card was signed, "Very fondly, Joe and Sue Paterno"
But here is the most amazing thing about all of this and what shocks me even to this day: I DIDN'T LEAVE ANY CONTACT INFORMATION WITH MY NOTE. I had signed the note with my name, and mentioned my graduation year, but had been very intentional about not leaving an address, email address, phone number, anything. This means that Sue (I have to think it was her, given Joe's health at the time), despite receiving hundreds of letters from alumni per day, took the time to look me up in the alumni directory (which still contained my parents' address at the time) and send me a card. The Paternos had never met me before; I'm not a huge donor to the school; I'm not someone important who can do anything for them; I'm just another alum. And they went way out of their way to send me a thank you card THE VERY NEXT DAY.
Recently, Penn Staters have been characterized as football-crazed idiots for supporting JoePa despite the allegations made against him in the press. I can tell you that Penn Staters' love for JoePa has almost nothing to do with football. Chris Grovich of Black Shoe Diaries may have put it best when he wrote, "[JoePa] believed in all of us [Penn Staters], whether we knew it or not." Penn Staters are the Paternos' life work and legacy. Joe never missed an opportunity to remind us that success is only valuable when it comes with honor, and that all of us - football players or not - were at college primarily to gain an education, broaden our horizons, and become better people. It is not an overstatement to say that a part of who I am today is directly because of Joe Paterno and his love for Penn State.
Simply put, Joe loved Penn State. That's the only kind of thing that could keep him at Penn State, where he was paid a salary 1/8 the size of other college coaches with half his wins and rejected multimillion dollar offers from NFL teams. That's the only kind of thing that could cause him to donate $100,000 to Penn State a month after the administration fired him over the phone. That's the only kind of thing that could make someone of Joe's stature take the time to send a thank you card to an anonymous alum despite dealing with immense personal trials himself. Joe loved Penn State.
And Penn State loves him back. Thank you, Coach.
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