Options
OK, so... what IS this?
lordmarcovan
Posts: 43,198 ✭✭✭✭✭
Won this in a giveaway from gummibear some time back (along with a nice print of his awesome artwork).
It's a very intriguing item. I'm wondering if it's a die trial. The Zvingli/Zwingli fellow on there was some kind of Protestant reformer from the 1500s, I believe.
As of this post, I have yet to do my homework on this one. I did a bit of Googling months back and could've sworn I found a largish Swiss (Zurich?) gold coin with a nearly identical design, from around 1801, if memory serves. That would seem consistent with the engraving style, which looks 18th or very early 19th century to me, despite the portrait of a 16th century person on it. But now, looking in the 17th/18th/19th century Krause volumes, I see no such coin. And my gawdforsaken satellite DSL connection is running slower than dialup at the moment, so it's all I can do to post this, let alone do more Googling. Maybe from work later, I'll be able to answer some of my own questions.
But in the meantime, if you've got any clues, I'd appreciate hearin' them.
It's a pretty good-sized piece; roughly silver dollar sized, but it's a little bit thin. In fact, with it having been struck in a soft, pewterish white metal, one could probably bend or break it if one were stupid enough and intent on an evil deed. But I suppose it's sturdy enough for normal display. It's weathered the centuries pretty well and is in high grade (choice AU, I'd say). There are traces of bright luster in the protected areas around the portrait and lettering (which naturally does not show in my scans).
Oh, and what's with the larger letters inserted seemingly at random in the legends? I've seen some 17th century thalers with "date in chronogram" like that. Maybe that's what we have here. A numerical code?
Let's see... there's M...I... VLD...ICV... VI...LI.
I'm not bad with Roman numerals, usually, but I confess I've never quite been able to figure out those chronograms or whatever they're called.
Under the portrait, there seems to be: "ÆT 48 AN 1531", so I suppose that means Zvingli was 48 years old in 1531?
It's a very intriguing item. I'm wondering if it's a die trial. The Zvingli/Zwingli fellow on there was some kind of Protestant reformer from the 1500s, I believe.
As of this post, I have yet to do my homework on this one. I did a bit of Googling months back and could've sworn I found a largish Swiss (Zurich?) gold coin with a nearly identical design, from around 1801, if memory serves. That would seem consistent with the engraving style, which looks 18th or very early 19th century to me, despite the portrait of a 16th century person on it. But now, looking in the 17th/18th/19th century Krause volumes, I see no such coin. And my gawdforsaken satellite DSL connection is running slower than dialup at the moment, so it's all I can do to post this, let alone do more Googling. Maybe from work later, I'll be able to answer some of my own questions.
But in the meantime, if you've got any clues, I'd appreciate hearin' them.
It's a pretty good-sized piece; roughly silver dollar sized, but it's a little bit thin. In fact, with it having been struck in a soft, pewterish white metal, one could probably bend or break it if one were stupid enough and intent on an evil deed. But I suppose it's sturdy enough for normal display. It's weathered the centuries pretty well and is in high grade (choice AU, I'd say). There are traces of bright luster in the protected areas around the portrait and lettering (which naturally does not show in my scans).
Oh, and what's with the larger letters inserted seemingly at random in the legends? I've seen some 17th century thalers with "date in chronogram" like that. Maybe that's what we have here. A numerical code?
Let's see... there's M...I... VLD...ICV... VI...LI.
I'm not bad with Roman numerals, usually, but I confess I've never quite been able to figure out those chronograms or whatever they're called.
Under the portrait, there seems to be: "ÆT 48 AN 1531", so I suppose that means Zvingli was 48 years old in 1531?
0
Comments
I am not to familiar with these Protestant type guys but I did find a similar medal. It seems this guy was the big gun in the Swiss Reformation in the late 15th century.
Look here,
Similar
At least it's a place to start.
Dang, that sold for $1.00? Huh? And it's SILVER? That's nuts. And not very encouraging.
Oh, wait... it says sold to "floor". Whazzat mean? What's a "floor bid"? I've heard the term but dunno what it means. Sort of like a reserve? Could that $1.00 just mean something like "reserve not met"?
But that fits in with the whole die trial thing, I reckon. They wouldn't go wasting good silver or gold on a trial strike, probably. I've seen similar uniface die trials in similar white metal. I sold a matched pair (uniface obverse and uniface reverse, two flans) for MrEureka a few years back. Those were from the early 1700s, and if I remember right, they went up into the three figures, pricewise.
Taler Custom Set
Ancient Custom Set
<< <i>Oh, wait... it says sold to "floor". Whazzat mean? What's a "floor bid"? I've heard the term but dunno what it means. Sort of like a reserve? Could that $1.00 just mean something like "reserve not met"? >>
It means it was a real-world auction, and somebody in the room - "on the floor" - won it for a dollar. Presumably because nobody else, neither on the floor nor absentee bidder, placed a bid on it.
Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations"
Apparently I have been awarded one DPOTD.
Would like to see a larger blow-up of the uniface reverse as I swear I'm seeing the outline of the St. Pauli Girl carrying jugs of
I=1
V=5
L=50
D=500
I=1
C=100
V=5
V=5
I=1
L=50
I=1
--------------------------
=1719 Date
<< <i>M=1000
I=1
V=5
L=50
D=500
I=1
C=100
V=5
V=5
I=1
L=50
I=1
--------------------------
=1719 Date >>
But that's not the format of roman dating.
1719 would be MDCCXIX.
1/2 Cents
U.S. Revenue Stamps
I wonder if this was part of a "Reformation Series" set, along with Martin Luther and John Calvin.
Neat piece. I like it!
8 Reales Madness Collection
As mentioned previously, those chronograms have always messed with my head, because, as CP noted, that's not the usual progression for Roman numerals.
<< <i>Looks like it was stuck on Pot metal...
Would like to see a larger blow-up of the uniface reverse as I swear I'm seeing the outline of the St. Pauli Girl carrying jugs of
Hm. Really? That's odd. I thought I saw a redneck gal in a beat up '73 Ford truck, with an RC cola, a Moon Pie, and a bag of Hot-N'-Spicy Pork Skins.
Pot metal. Yeah. Reckon that's it. But what exactly IS pot metal? I mean, I've seen it around, but what's it made of? It's kind of pewter-ish, ain't it? Bet there's lead and tin in the mix.
<< <i>Just noticed it has his birth an death years on the bottom (1484 - 1531). >>
Actually, I think it says "ÆT 48 AN 1531" (aged 48 years in the year 1531). But yeah, it does sort of look like 1484-1531, and he was indeed born in 1484, according to the Wikipedia article.
<< <i>Interesting piece. I wonder why the different sized font. >>
It's a "date in chronogram", as mentioned. You see this on thalers sometimes. DCH cracked the code. The bigger letters double as Roman numerals, which work out to the date: 1719. (I get it now- you have to add up all of the Roman numerals to get to 1719.)
So it's a bit older than I initially thought.