Offer on ebay was retracted within two hours by buyer....
wrestlingcardking
Posts: 4,555 ✭✭✭✭
I looked under the history and the reason was "cannot contact the seller". I suppose it is best not to deal with this buyer but found the rationale quite odd.
BUYING Frank Gotch T229 Kopec
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
0
Comments
I have said this before. There is absolutely no reason to retract a bid, and eBay is TOTALLY wrong in allowing such a cowardly act. You are asked to "confirm" your bid, once you do.......that should be it.
For all you people that are going to get on the "made a mistake" bandwagon, FINE give someone one and only one retraction and any after that are denied.
Joe
Eventually the practice could be reduced if not eliminated, instead of ignored. EBay seems to figure out all kinds of ways to make money off of sellers, how about a $10.00 retraction fee? Second time $20.00 and so on.
EBAY ARE YOU LISTENING? MONEY TO BE MADE!!!!
Happy Holidays all.
Joe
Looking to BUY n332 1889 SF Hess cards and high grade cards from 19th century especially. "Once you have wrestled everything else in life is easy" Dan Gable
<< <i>i was just surprised since it was a "best offer" instead of a auction bid....... had not had that happen to me before..... >>
You know what probably happened, he saw something else he wanted and decided to cancel his BO with you. But I agree, if you commit to buying something, you should buy it. Unfortunately, there are people out there that don't think that way. I also agree that you should be limited to one bid retraction a year and that is still being generous.
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep."
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
Collecting:
Any unopened Baseball cello and rack packs and boxes from the 1970's and early 1980s.
<< <i>The offer is only good for as long as the buyer chooses to have it on the table. If the seller doesn't reply in the time frame the buyer needs he remove the offer and shop elsewhere. This time of the year some people wait until the last minute for gifts and may need a decision quickly. He had no idea if the offer was going to be replied to quickly, in a couple hours, or if the seller was going to reply at all. The opportunity for the seller to make a sale was up there for two hours and then it was removed. If the offer was accepted then the buyer would have bought the item. >>
I totally agree with you Kb if the buyer stated that in the comment section of his offer which I have done myself before. What I don't agree with is if the buyer makes a BO knowing that the seller has 48 hours to accept it or not, but then decides he does want to buy it. By submitting a BO, you as the buyer have committed to buying it at that price unless you stipulate otherwise in the comment section. JMHO.
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep."
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
Collecting:
Any unopened Baseball cello and rack packs and boxes from the 1970's and early 1980s.
Any a$$hole that would offer (for example) $50.00 on a $75.00 item and then decline when the seller accepts is actually WORSE than a bid retract-er, who "pulls" his bid before the end of the auction, never actually winning the item.
The excuse "cannot contact seller" is also a lie.
As I stated before, eBay should do SOMETHING to protect the sellers from this behavior. Looks to me that sellers are punished if they "change their minds" on an item that sells for lower than they are willing to accept. Doesn't seem like too much to ask for the same to be true of buyers.
Merry Christmas everyone!
Joe
however you already have an offer with the other seller who will not ackknowledge your offer.I think that if a seller has a buy it now the seller should acknowledge all offers.
I agree but that's not the scenario the OP posted. OP didn't respond to buyer's offer in 2 hours so buyer took offer off the table. 48 hours is a ridiculous length of time to wait to see if seller will accept your offer or not. It's like walking into a store, making an offer, and being told to come back in a day or two for a decision.
That's just it. You don't have to wait around. The original seller took too long to get back to you or maybe had no intention of replying at all. So if another buying opportunity comes by you don't have to wait for 48 hours to pass. You retract the offer and go elsewhere.
<< <i>I disagree, submitting an offer IS a commitment to buy.....absolutely. >>
That is complete BS. Submitting an offer and having it accepted--then sure, that is a commitment.
Submitting an offer, getting no reply, and therefore retracting it is completely ethical and used in all aspects of life--not just eBay.
<< <i>The excuse "cannot contact seller" is also a lie. >>
Also, complete BS. If you have heard nothing back from seller in the time frame you need an answer--then that is no communication from seller--and from the options eBay gives a potential buyer to retract an offer or a bid, "cannot contact seller" is exactly what happened--especially in the case this thread is about.
Overall, I hate "bid" retractions, as many of them are abusing the system (like trying to find another bidders top bid, or a reserve price, and then retracting).
But there are legitimate reasons a bidder can retract, that's why eBay allows them. Even I have had to retract a bid during my 11 years on eBay. And mine was completely legit--and it happened to be a "cannot contact seller" reason. It was about 4 years ago. I bid on an obscure baseball card--so happens the eBay seller was a board member here, too. Within a day of my bid, a thread was started about the cards he was selling, including the one I had placed a bid on. The thread was saying the seller had submitted these same cards already to PSA and they had been REJECTED and sent back. He was selling the cards rejected by PSA already, but describing them in the auction as PSA worthy of grading.
I sent the seller a question through ebay message system asking him, what would happen if I send the card I was bidding on to PSA and it gets rejected--would he honor a return/refund. I waited over 24 hours with no answer. That same person also never responded to the thread's accusations, even though he was logging in each day. When it got down to the deadline for officially retracting a bid, I still had not heard any reply from seller--so I did retract that bid. How should I be "committed" to honoring a bid, when new information comes to light that the seller may be shady or pulling a scam--and that seller also will not respond or answer any questions? "Cannot contact seller" was the correct and legit reason for my bid retraction.
Merry Christmas to all!
I don't like the way ebay sticks it to sellers, but I have to accept it.
If you want to argue that 48 hours is to long, that might be true, but it doesn't give you the right to change the "rules" because you don't like them. Sellers, following eBays (wrongheaded?) policy are merely waiting the allowed time for higher offers. Sellers on the other hand are always crying because buyers have too much time to send payment, that can be frustrating, but that's the RULES, you knew them when you signed on to eBay.
And yes an offer is a commitment, if you don't understand that, there's no reason to discuss.
Anyone who buys raw on eBay, or anywhere else, is taking the risk that cards were altered and possibly rejected from one grading company or another. Doesn't always mean cards were bad either, many times reading these threads, I have seen where cards have been submitted fresh out of packs and come back "min size" or "evid of trim" and been then re submitted and found to be worthy of a grade.
In your case AkbarClone you obviously heard a rumor that might have (or might not have) been true, and when you tried to contact seller he refused to reply. This is why some people only buy cards graded by a company they trust. You just found out four years ago that raw cards aren't always good?
I recently got a rookie card back from PSA that should have been worth $5,000.00 bought it in an auction 15 years ago and never sent it in. Came back "altered". As much as I was very angry about it, I knew the risks when I bought it, even though this was the first stages of graded cards becoming popular in the hobby.
It really is simply a matter if buyers and sellers having integrity. I am willing to bet that most of these problems occur when a seller doesn't get what he wants for a card (that's why sellers can decide on an opening bid), or a buyer tries to get a deal that's too good to be true.
Don't list if you don't intend to sell at auction determined final bid. Don't bid if you aren't willing to pay. It's really easy. There are bullies on the playground though!
No BS, just the truth.
Joe
<< <i>ASSUMING the OP is telling it like it is there is, there's no valid reason in this example to retract the bid. He says bidder retracted bid within two hours of offering it. I am also going to assume there was no communication from buyer during this time as he states reason for cancelling/retracting is he could not do so.
If you want to argue that 48 hours is to long, that might be true, but it doesn't give you the right to change the "rules" because you don't like them. Sellers, following eBays (wrongheaded?) policy are merely waiting the allowed time for higher offers. Sellers on the other hand are always crying because buyers have too much time to send payment, that can be frustrating, but that's the RULES, you knew them when you signed on to eBay.
And yes an offer is a commitment, if you don't understand that, there's no reason to discuss.
Anyone who buys raw on eBay, or anywhere else, is taking the risk that cards were altered and possibly rejected from one grading company or another. Doesn't always mean cards were bad either, many times reading these threads, I have seen where cards have been submitted fresh out of packs and come back "min size" or "evid of trim" and been then re submitted and found to be worthy of a grade.
In your case AkbarClone you obviously heard a rumor that might have (or might not have) been true, and when you tried to contact seller he refused to reply. This is why some people only buy cards graded by a company they trust. You just found out four years ago that raw cards aren't always good?
I recently got a rookie card back from PSA that should have been worth $5,000.00 bought it in an auction 15 years ago and never sent it in. Came back "altered". As much as I was very angry about it, I knew the risks when I bought it, even though this was the first stages of graded cards becoming popular in the hobby.
It really is simply a matter if buyers and sellers having integrity. I am willing to bet that most of these problems occur when a seller doesn't get what he wants for a card (that's why sellers can decide on an opening bid), or a buyer tries to get a deal that's too good to be true.
Don't list if you don't intend to sell at auction determined final bid. Don't bid if you aren't willing to pay. It's really easy. There are bullies on the playground though!
No BS, just the truth.
Joe >>
I think I stayed awake long enough in a few of my business law classes that allowed me to remember that to have a contract (or a sale) you must have an offer and acceptance of that offer for their to be a contract or a sale. If the offer is recinded there is nothing for the seller to accept therfore......no sale. The offer is not a committment until the offer is accepted. I assume any lawyer on the board can back me up on that or tell me I am full of it!!
http://www.unisquare.com/store/brick/
Ralph
mccardguy1, I am not a lawyer, nor have I studied law. Does not apply in this case.
This is an auction site that has it's own set of rules that are agreed to when you join. Referred to as "terms and conditions". All the rules do not make sense. Buyers and sellers both have gripes. If a seller is willing to accept "best offers" exactly how much time should he have to wait? EBay says 48hrs, (if what is written in this thread is correct). Buyer made an offer and should have to honor that offer for the time period, unless seller agrees to let him out of his commitment. Buyer apparently did not even ask, just made up (in my opinion) a lie to back out. Apparently there is no "I changed my mind option".
I for one am tired of hearing people, both sellers and buyers, insist that they "made a mistake" and shouldn't have any consequences. Most of the time they were either being stupid or greedy and it didn't work out. Now they don't want to pay for the item, or sell it at that price. When people make their mistakes it effects other people as well, so MAN UP.
I have been on eBay13 years and have never felt the need to retract a bid. Have always honored the price on the few things I have sold and some have gone too cheap!
It's not that tough to do the right thing.
Hope everyone has a safe and joyous Holiday Season!
Joe
Here is possibly a case where the buyer tried to do the right thing.
For what ever reason (the reason does not matter) he withdrew his offer.
(Which since Ebay allows must be in their Terms and conditions).
By doing so he did not cost the seller any time, money or exposure of the sellers item.
IMO, just like a seller can reject the offer, a buyer can retract it, up and until the seller accepts it.
Another quirk is how a seller can end an auction early and sell to the high bidder.
<< <i>The thing that really irks me is when you make an offer and the seller will just let it expire.In the mean time another simalar item is offered by another seller however you already have an offer with the other seller who will not ackknowledge your offer.I think that if a seller has a buy it now the seller should acknowledge all offers.
That's just it. You don't have to wait around. The original seller took too long to get back to you or maybe had no intention of replying at all. So if another buying opportunity comes by you don't have to wait for 48 hours to pass. You retract the offer and go elsewhere. >>
exactly
was it a common item? Maybe he's Christmas shopping and needed to know an answer pretty quick or he'd just get it somewhere else.
How many reasons does Ebay offer for a bid retraction - probably not many and his was the closest that made sense. Not having the seller respond to an offer can easily be interpreted as unable to contact seller. He tried to contact when he made the offer.
Too many variables to condemn the buyer but I understand getting pissed off about it.
<< <i>You guys sound like (bad) lawyers. >>
<< <i>mccardguy1, I am not a lawyer, nor have I studied law. Does not apply in this case. >>
You're funny and stuff.
According to ebay's "terms and conditions" the following are the only reasons that make it ok to retract a best offer, I just cut and pasted it so as to not sumarize in my own words:
"It's OK to retract a Best Offer if:
You accidentally enter a wrong offer amount (for example, you submitted an offer for $9.50 instead of $99.95).
The description of an item you have placed an offer on has changed significantly.
You cannot get in touch with your trading partner by email or telephone."
That's it. Anything other than those reasons is an abuse of the feature. Notice that the third reason does not say "you cannot get in touch with your trading partner through the ebay system and your initial offer is considered an effort to get in touch with them". It states "by email or telephone". I don't know and it's only conjecture on my part, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the person that made the wrestlingcardking an offer more than likely never even attempted to contact him by email or telephone.
I had a buyer retract a best offer today of $1,000 in only 23 minutes. LOL, I was about to counter their offer with $1,200, but they retracted before I even had that chance. (I saw it on my mobile phone, and by the time I made it to a PC to counter, it was redacted. When I later queried the offerer as to why the redacted, they wrote this:
"I'm so sorry. i just can't afford it right now. it was stupid of me to put in a bid. please accept my apologies"
That's basically an abuse of the system, but it seems like most here think that's ok.
Can you even get a phone number or an email address simply by
making a best offer? All the person had to do was try.
lets discuss what constitutes 'trying' now.
<< <i>actually - ebay's "terms and conditions" can lick my hairy sack >>
I'm sure most of us enjoy receiving a good sack lick.
There are some of ebay's t and c's, that I don't particularly agree with as well, and I do occasionally go outside of them such as using the ebay system to make contact and making an offer outside of ebay (which could lead to getting booted). However, there are consequences for this if I get caught and I know it and choose my action anyway.
However, with best offer retraction, there isn't a "consequence" and that basically encourages that type of behavior. It's my personal opinion that I agree with Joe Bonzai and ebay needs to put some potential consequences with it.
You agree with only certain rules and regulations? The ones that
only benefit you?
C'mon Mike, it's all rules or no rules, one can't pick and choose.
<< <i>Huh??
You agree with only certain rules and regulations? The ones that
only benefit you?
C'mon Mike, it's all rules or no rules, one can't pick and choose. >>
That's certainly a stretch of what I typed, OR perhaps I didn't type it wel so let me try again:
1) Ebay has rules
2) IMO, violation of those rules should have the potential for some sort of consequence, otherwise don't have the rule
If one chooses to not abide by the rules, they should do so at their own potential peril.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Off to consume tacos now.
Miguel
<< <i>Off to consume tacos now.
Miguel >>
I like tacos.
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep."
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
Collecting:
Any unopened Baseball cello and rack packs and boxes from the 1970's and early 1980s.
http://www.unisquare.com/store/brick/
Ralph
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>Just a question. Not trying to irritate my friends. Those who feel it is wrong to withdraw an offer made to you, do you ever ask for payment PayPal "gift" when it clearly is a sale? >>
Yes I do. There are potentially negative consequences that I accept for doing that as well that are imposed by the entity that makes the rules (paypal).
Not sure I fully follow your logic, you are saying it's wrong to retract a BO bid
if you do not follow the specific criteria (allowed by ebay) because a person making the retraction can suffer
no consequences?
<< <i>There are some of ebay's t and c's, that I don't particularly agree with as well, and I do occasionally go outside of them such as using the ebay system to make contact and making an offer outside of ebay (which could lead to getting booted). However, there are consequences for this if I get caught and I know it and choose my action anyway. >>
The above is what I was referring to. I did so only because at the end of your earlier post you said:
<< <i>That's basically an abuse of the system, but it seems like most here think that's ok. >>
I don't think I stretched anything.
Enjoy your tacos.
Not sure I fully follow your logic
I reply:
Since when does logic have much of a place around here, LOL. I just type, I don't necessarily intend for it to follow a true logic type outline.
Steve :
you are saying it's wrong to retract a BO bid
I reply:
I did not say it was "wrong". To me, "wrong" means that something is unethical or immoral or goes against the norms of whatever society one is a part of. I said that the action is an abuse of the system, and if it does not follow the criteria the system provides, then I stand behind that belief.
I did reply to Brick's post where he asked something along the lines of for those of you that think it's "wrong", but I didn't literally mean that it's "wrong" using my definition above, I just wanted to answer his general question.
Steve:
if you do not follow the specific criteria (allowed by ebay) because a person making the retraction can suffer
no consequences?
I reply:
yep. If ebay is not going to provide any enforcement, then they shouldn't have the rule, as the rule has no deterrent to compel someone not to abuse it.
Steve , quoting me:
[here are some of ebay's t and c's, that I don't particularly agree with as well, and I do occasionally go outside of them such as using the ebay system to make contact and making an offer outside of ebay (which could lead to getting booted). However, there are consequences for this if I get caught and I know it and choose my action anyway.
I reply:
You used this to write "C'mon Mike, it's all rules or no rules, one can't pick and choose"
Sure I can pick and choose, as can everyone else. Most rules have some sort of consequence attached to them. You can choose to ignore or not follow those rules, and you are free to weigh the cost/benefit of doing such, and make whatever decision you choose to make. However, if the rules have no enforcement or consequence, there will not be alot of deterrent from that action, and therefore, why have the rule?
Steve:
I don't think I stretched anything.
I replied:
That's cool, you can think what you want.
Steve:
Enjoy your tacos.
I replied:
Thanks, they were good. I had some homemade salsa that my sister sent for Christmas that was yummy.
<< <i>actually - ebay's "terms and conditions" can lick my hairy sack >>
I don't think I would give them the chance to lick mine, maybe a rim job but nothing more.
When I look at eBay's terms and conditions for sellers I see something along the lines of........
eBay reserves the right to rape a seller in any way, shape or form without even giving a reacharound. As a seller you can cry if you want to but what are you going to do, go to another auction site with 1% of the buyers that eBay has as members.....
Hence I enjoy as a Powerseller/Top Rated Seller trying to move as many sales off eBay as possible in an attempt to screw them. They have done nothing over the years to benefit sellers from scammers, hell they have only made it easier to get ripped off. So I am all for people doing whatever it takes to maybe one day put eBay under. Then maybe someone else can step in and take over eBay's marketshare.
<< <i>Simple solution: eBay should allow a selection of time limits on Best Offers. Example: 1. 6 Hours, 2. 12 Hours, 3. 24 Hours, 4. 48 Hours. This would afford the potential buyer the opportunity to seek the item elsewhere in a shorter period of time if the Seller does not respond to the Best Offer. But then again, this makes too much sense and if anyone brought it up at an eBay brainstorming session, they'd probably get fired for having a sane and rational idea that would benefit BOTH the buyer and the seller. >>
That's a great solution that I would welcome as both a buyer and seller.
Mike
<< <i>
<< <i>Simple solution: eBay should allow a selection of time limits on Best Offers. Example: 1. 6 Hours, 2. 12 Hours, 3. 24 Hours, 4. 48 Hours. This would afford the potential buyer the opportunity to seek the item elsewhere in a shorter period of time if the Seller does not respond to the Best Offer. But then again, this makes too much sense and if anyone brought it up at an eBay brainstorming session, they'd probably get fired for having a sane and rational idea that would benefit BOTH the buyer and the seller. >>
That's a great solution that I would welcome as both a buyer and seller.
Mike >>
Don't worry, there are some on here that will find fault with it. Bank on it!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Simple solution: eBay should allow a selection of time limits on Best Offers. Example: 1. 6 Hours, 2. 12 Hours, 3. 24 Hours, 4. 48 Hours. This would afford the potential buyer the opportunity to seek the item elsewhere in a shorter period of time if the Seller does not respond to the Best Offer. But then again, this makes too much sense and if anyone brought it up at an eBay brainstorming session, they'd probably get fired for having a sane and rational idea that would benefit BOTH the buyer and the seller. >>
That's a great solution that I would welcome as both a buyer and seller.
Mike >>
Don't worry, there are some on here that will find fault with it. Bank on it! >>
If only eBay would listen to recommendations from sellers like they would 6 to 10 years ago. I really don't understand the upper management of eBay over the last 6 years or so when it comes to a large amount of choices they have made when it comes to alienating the sellers. You are either a huge high volume seller to get some special treatment or you just get shiat on.
lol.
John