Paypal chargeback

ekim2528

Hi all I sold a guy 2 low end autograph cards (non sport) that ended on November 12th. He paid on the 16th. I shipped and marked as shipped the same day. 2 hours later I get an email from Paypal that the buyer has put in for a credit card chargeback. Nice as I had just mailed out the cards. Are there not proper channels that the buyer has to go through first? Mike

grote15

Sounds like a stolen card and/or unauthorized charge as I don't believe you can even open an INR or SNAD claim for 7 days.

Wolfgang427

<< <i>Sounds like a stolen card and/or unauthorized charge as I don't believe you can even open an INR or SNAD claim for 7 days. >>


Agree, its a stolen CC.

ekim2528

The thing is I mailed the package to the rightful card owners address. Mike

ekim2528

These are the only 3 options that Paypal gives me How would you like to resolve this issue?

I can provide proof that the item was shipped through an approved shipper to the address on the Transaction Details page.What information can you provide?What information can you provide?I can provide online tracking information.I can upload or fax proof that the item was shipped.
I can provide proof that I refunded the payment for this transaction.
I will accept liability for this transaction.

brendanb438

You shipped it with a tracking # right? If not congrats your are out the money for these auctions. Always ship via DC for under $250 and SC for over.

ekim2528

No tracking on Canada to the US. You go on the honor system. The buyer is at 100% with over 300 positive feedback. I have had buyers claim that the item did not arrive before (Through proper Ebay & Paypal channels) This one was a paypal chargeback 2 hours after I marked it as shipped. I know that shipping between Canada and the States can be slow but you should give it more than 2 hours to arrive. Mike

Sean1125

I dont feel like explaining myself right now but i will say eith certainty you will lose the money and in short "you are screwed" a chargrback is a different animal than a claim.

grote15

The only way to protect yourself on ebay for packages from US to Canada is using Express Mail with tracking. No tracking=no hope of prevailing if a chargeback is filed.

Sean1125

You cant prevail if a chargrback is filed anyway... like i said... different beast than a clai

brendanb438

Yeah sucks but you lose since you have no tracking #. There is no honor system via eBay anymore.

If it is a cheap item you can chance it like you did here, but I wouldn't recommend doing this anymore.


EDIT: Chargebacks are a different beast yes Sean, but depending on the claimed reason for the chargeback you can win as a seller. Item not as described you are SOL. Chargeback claiming stolen ot not authorized transaction, you can win if you have the tracking info proving you shipped it to the verified Paypal Address. I have had this happen twice this year and I won both times through PayPal Seller Protection. Now the chargeback saying they didn't get the item they were suppose to I got robbed. I had no option to fight it at all.

grote15

Chargeback claiming stolen ot not authorized transaction, you can win if you have the tracking info proving you shipped it to the verified Paypal Address.

Correct. That was what I was referring to above.

Sean1125

A legitimate chargeback is won EVERY time. Because it means their card was used fraudulently and they started it through their credit card company (paypal can do nothing about it, I've had to do this once)

A credit card chargeback is filed for fraud not for SNAD (claim).





I just want to clarify, you can file an unauthorized claim, it is still different than a charge back (which is done through your credit card company) - I will take screenshots of paypal and put explainations on it if you need.

brendanb438

<< <i>A legitimate chargeback is won EVERY time. Because it means their card was used fraudulently and they started it through their credit card company (paypal can do nothing about it, I've had to do this once)

A credit card chargeback is filed for fraud not for SNAD (claim).





I just want to clarify, you can file an unauthorized claim, it is still different than a charge back (which is done through your credit card company) - I will take screenshots of paypal and put explainations on it if you need. >>



Sean we know what a chargeback is. We know it is done through the credit card company. Most companies give you around 16 different reasons for filing a chargeback including not receiving services or goods, receiving something completely different than ordered, or not authorizing the purchase or stolen CC.

Unless we are just dancing around what the definition of a chargeback is. If a purchase is claimed through the CC company to have been not authorized after the fact that the item was already shipped it is still handled as a chargeback in the eyes of PayPal and the CC company on the backend. When you have to fight this as a seller through PayPal it is handled like a chargeback.

If you ship to the verified address on file w/ DC or SC depending on the price of the item and then they claim it was not an authorized purchase or it was a stolen CC you will be protected through PayPal from said chargeback.

ekim2528

Thanks guys. The only piss off is I can not plead my case. Proof of shipping or you are screwed. It was only $11, but it was how fast after marking as shipped that the claim was made that gets under my skin. It is getting harder and harder to find US seller that will ship outside the States. I just received a $180 package from a US seller shipped for $6. No tracking or nothing. He just went with my feedback. All I have to do is claim that I did not receive it and poof! it's mine. That is not my style and it is not the style of most buyers. Mike

brendanb438

<< <i>Thanks guys. The only piss off is I can not plead my case. Proof of shipping or you are screwed. It was only $11, but it was how fast after marking as shipped that the claim was made that gets under my skin. It is getting harder and harder to find US seller that will ship outside the States. I just received a $180 package from a US seller shipped for $6. No tracking or nothing. He just went with my feedback. All I have to do is claim that I did not receive it and poof! it's mine. That is not my style and it is not the style of most buyers. Mike >>




Yeah, this is why as a US based seller I will not ship overseas unless it is to someone I know. Not worth the headache to deal with customs, deal with shipping in a manner to make sure item is tracked and finally hoping the foreign postal services deliver the item properly.


Sellers are crazy to ship items worth more than a few dollars abroad to people they don't know without tracking info.

brendanb438

Also Mike in the future if something like this was to happen and it was on a more expensive item, if they try to claim not authorized and in this case all you need is to prove delivery of a box or envelope to said address to get paid out you can always ship out another box this time with tracking info to the same address to have what you need for PayPal to give you back your money.


There are a lot of good ways to fight scammers when you think outside the box. Sometimes you have to fight shady with being shady yourself.

ekim2528

Wow Brendan that's a pretty cool way to do it, but not on a $11 deal. Years ago I sold a guy a $200 Star Trek autograph card. In a week he filed a claim and got his money back. 2 months latter I noticed that he bought another card off me. I picked up the tap and sent it registered. A week latter he emails me to say that he has not received the card and will start a claim. My email reply was only the word OK. Never heard from him again. My only regret is that I did not just mail him an empty envelope. Mike

NickM

Your buyer is a scumbag. I wouldn't be surprised if he has done the same thing to lots of other sellers - and is the kind who would claim not to have received domestic items if the seller didn't put DC on them (or if it never got scanned at delivery).
His ebay name would be a good one for BBLs.

Nick