Another perspective on the 25th Anniversary set--dealers should up their buy prices, even if they ha
RYK
Posts: 35,797 ✭✭✭✭✭
(Ricko do not look here 
)
There is a thread on the ethics of backing out of pre-sale deal if, hypothetically, the market price for the set is $1000 when you have made a commitment to sell the product on the day of release at, hypothetically, $375. Given that there is somewhat of a poker game going on, would it be wise for a major seller like MCM to, privately or publicly, adjust the price upward in order to encourage folks to complete the deal? A deal is a deal, but it really only works if both parties feel that they are benefiting from it.
On the other hand, as a promoter, if MCM does not get enough product, will the demand for it vaporize?
It will be an interesting market to watch from the sidelines. There will be no shortage of whining, frustration, ethical quandaries, and greed displayed on the forum.
PS One extremely honorable forumite saw that I was shut out (my 79 year old father is in the penalty box ) and offered me one of his at cost. There are some really cool folks here on the forum! 
)There is a thread on the ethics of backing out of pre-sale deal if, hypothetically, the market price for the set is $1000 when you have made a commitment to sell the product on the day of release at, hypothetically, $375. Given that there is somewhat of a poker game going on, would it be wise for a major seller like MCM to, privately or publicly, adjust the price upward in order to encourage folks to complete the deal? A deal is a deal, but it really only works if both parties feel that they are benefiting from it.
On the other hand, as a promoter, if MCM does not get enough product, will the demand for it vaporize?
It will be an interesting market to watch from the sidelines. There will be no shortage of whining, frustration, ethical quandaries, and greed displayed on the forum.
PS One extremely honorable forumite saw that I was shut out (my 79 year old father is in the penalty box
) and offered me one of his at cost. There are some really cool folks here on the forum! 0
Comments
That's a damn nice friend! Friends like that are usually well earned, however, so I'm sure good deeds have flowed both ways in the past. Congratulations to both of you!
Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum
Hoard the keys.
I made a "commitment" to a fellow board member to sell my 5 sets for $2050, I told him if I got them, they where his.
(I got in early so I should at least get my/his 5 coins
However, I have 3 friends, not even into coins that ordered 5, 2, & 1 (very high numbers) so I may never see them but plan to flip the 5 & 2 and keep one for myself.
(at a little more that I made on the first sale I'm sure
Again, I'm sorry for the people that did not get any, the HHL should have been 2 max. I would think!
BLESSINGS
<< <i>At what point does it become a firm commitment? >>
I'd say when money changes hands.
<< <i>There will be no shortage of whining, frustration, ethical quandaries, and greed displayed on the forum. >>
Ya think?
Russ, NCNE
And if they mark up a coin more they get called all sorts of names. Now, all these "collectors" on the board are wringing their hands with sweat dripping down their foreheads and don't even have anything to sell yet. And, no doubt they will want Paypal gift for their huge mark-ups.
I don't think any of us realized "how, off the chart" this would go!!
But, a deal is a deal . . . I don't have much but my word or handshake means a lot to me!
Now, if the buyer wanted to give/send more, or even a gift card, to go out to dinner to show appreciated to the seller that would be a nice touch also. (but not required!!!!)
BLESSINGS
<< <i>I don't think any of us realized "how, off the chart" this would go!!
But, a deal is a deal . . . I don't have much but my word or handshake means a lot to me!
Now, if the buyer wanted to give/send more, or even a gift card, to go out to dinner to show appreciated to the seller that would be a nice touch also. (but not required!!!!)
BLESSINGS >>
That would be an honorable gesture for an honorable forum member.
Exit bunker, enter Matrix. LOL
Just to add another layer of analysis to this unfolding drama, let me state that the "legality" or "illegality" of the deals that are going on [and the legal consequences flowing from an "illegal" deal] would be determined by applying Article 2 of the Uniform Commercial Code governing the sales of "goods" [or applying the state law version of the UCC adopted by the state(s) in question in the deal.
No need for me to explain further. For those who have an interest in looking deeply into the UCC Article 2 statutes [who in their right mind would have such an interest
When I have looked into the UCC in the past, I have envisioned that the drafters of the code did so over numerous libations, good food and other indulgences; and the drafters intentionally decided to put some "Alice In Wonderland" strangeness into the code.
<< <i>I know one large online marketer of coins emailed me with a buy offer of $400 per set, but yet they had a disclosure that they willl buy at this price up until they fill their quota. So basically someone sends them an email saying I want to take you up on your offer and put me down for 5 sets sold. Now suppose the prices had sucked and were hanging around $350 right now or the Mint makes a drastic move and ups the production limit to 200,000. Now I can only imagine this, "thank you for your offer, but we''ve met our quota and don't need your sets at this time." Now, of course the sets go up to $700 like they are now and they are knocking on your door step where are my sets for $400 tha tyou committed to. My point is you don't know if they would have really honored their end of the bargain if the sets plumeted, so I see many sellers that have committed to $400 and now seeing these being sold for $700 saying the same thing to themselves, would they really have honored their end of the bargain if prices had plumeted. I highly doubt any national dealer or company will see anyone send them sets for $400 with the aftermarket already approaching $700 a set. Furthermore, anyone who sold these sets for $400 must not have been around to long to know the power of an anniversary set with 1 million plus collectors and only 1 to go around for every 10 collectors. >>
In some ways, it is a game of chicken. My argument would be that the downside for the dealer is a lot less buying at $400 on 10/27 than it is for the collector selling at $400 on 10/27, even if the market price is only $350, on the day the coins are offered for sale.
Even if it comes down to this tediousness, do you think that MCM or any similar firm is going to track down and sue all of the individuals who promised $1000 coin sets for $385? This would be loaded with issues, not the least of which is where are you going to a jury (if you could wrap them all up in one suit) that is going to find in favor of a big company trying to squeeze grannies and college students? Many of the suppliers of these firms are also the customers. Do they want to sue their retail customers? How is that good for business?
Ultimately, I see this as a gentleman's agreement, and it only works if neither party is getting hosed. Gentlemen do not let their business partners get hosed, and that is why I expect the buyers to voluntarily up their offers, even where they already have a commitment, a gentleman's agreement in place, if there is great disparity between the original buy price and the market value.
<< <i>Just to add another layer of analysis to this unfolding drama, let me state that the "legality" or "illegality" of the deals that are going on [and the legal consequences flowing from an "illegal" deal] would be determined by applying Article 2 of the Uniform Commercial Code governing the sales of "goods" [or applying the state law version of the UCC adopted by the state(s) in question in the deal.
Even if it comes down to this tediousness, do you think that MCM or any similar firm is going to track down and sue all of the individuals who promised $1000 coin sets for $385? This would be loaded with issues, not the least of which is where are you going to a jury (if you could wrap them all up in one suit) that is going to find in favor of a big company trying to squeeze grannies and college students? Many of the suppliers of these firms are also the customers. Do they want to sue their retail customers? How is that good for business?
Ultimately, I see this as a gentleman's agreement, and it only works if neither party is getting hosed. Gentlemen do not let their business partners get hosed, and that is why I expect the buyers to voluntarily up their offers, even where they already have a commitment, a gentleman's agreement in place, if there is great disparity between the original buy price and the market value. >>
Kinda sounds akin to winning a judgment as to actually collecting on it. As far as future deals it will probably lead to more specific agreements about what each party will and will not be accountable for.
No.
<< <i>No.
No. >>
Is this Jeopardy? Am I supposed to guess the questions?
(Haha!)
<< <i>
<< <i>No.
No. >>
Is this Jeopardy? Am I supposed to guess the questions?
(Haha!) >>
Why would you guess the questions? You asked them.
Keep up sharing stories like this. Not enough warm fuzzy feelings coming out of the latest mint offering.
That's awesome...and grats!
-Keith
When prices go up, they benefit (and, they took the risk, so that is cool). When prices skyrocket, well, should they toss a bit more out to the folks or take the full benefit? I think it would be great if they did (I have no dog in this fight as I have only semi-committed 1 set, if I receive what I am expecting and if the person so wants it) but I wouldn't expect a dealer to do so.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>When I have looked into the UCC in the past, I have envisioned that the drafters of the code did so over numerous libations, good food and other indulgences; and the drafters intentionally decided to put some "Alice In Wonderland" strangeness into the code. >>
I thought it may have been written by "Nucky" and his business associates on Boardwalk Empire.
<< <i> One extremely honorable forumite saw that I was shut out and offered me one of his at cost
That's a damn nice friend! Friends like that are usually well earned, however, so I'm sure good deeds have flowed both ways in the past. Congratulations to both of you! >>
Fred, Las Vegas, NV
Question for the dealers who bought early at what is now a low price: Would you have held it against me if any of the sets I promised you had been purchased by another party that is not a member of the forum and all I could deliver was my five sets?
Exit bunker, enter Matrix. LOL