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Buyer or seller responsible for cards damaged in transit?
jwgators
Posts: 460 ✭✭
So who is the responsible party when a card arrives with a cracked slab? Should the seller refund the price and accept a refund? Or should the buyer be stuck with the cracked case?
Thanks.
Thanks.
Joel
0
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<< <i>So who is the responsible party when a card arrives with a cracked slab? Should the seller refund the price and accept a refund? Or should the buyer be stuck with the cracked case?
Thanks. >>
Sellers responsibility. the seller accepts a return and refunds the money upon receiving the cracked slab back.
I have had this happen twice, luckily both times it was only a 10-18 dollar card, both times I had the buyer send me a picture or scan of the cracked slab & card. Both times I told the buyer to keep the card and refunded the full amount + shipping.
if it is an expensive card & not damaged, offer the seller a full refund and get the card back or offer the cost of having the card reslabbed and let the buyer send it to psa to get reslabbed.
The buyer will win every time if he opens a Ebay or paypal claim, SNAD or damaged item. jmho
Little do they know....
TOS
Even though it's not required, we recommend that you purchase shipping insurance or use a shipping service that offers loss and damage protection. You can add the cost of the insurance to the handling fee or item price.
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<< <i>Why do people recommen insurance when doing group rips on the boards? Isn't this the same idea? >>
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In a private transaction - via contract - the buyer and seller
can agree to any kind of deal they choose to. Unfortunately,
with PayPal in the mix, such contracts are ALWAYS abrogated.
BST sellers that don't use insurance - paid for by whomever -
while accepting PayPal, run the same risk that EBAY sellers do
when they ship naked. The BST seller is obligated to deliver any
offered item as advertised; failing to do so, will result in a
decision in favor of the buyer in an INR-claim or a SNAD-claim
in the case of a cracked slab.
Paying with a "gift" payment obviates all "buyer protection" in
a PayPal transaction. The only claim that survives such payment
is "unauthorized use;" hard to prove, if it ain't true.
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In an INR claim where the DC shows the item was delivered, the
buyer will lose an INR claim. BUT, if USPS insurance was purchased,
the USPS will still accept for filing a "lost mail claim." Many such
claims are paid; the USPS knows that DC is not "proof of much."
That is the only circumstance in an EBAY/PayPal deal where the
purchase of insurance benefits the buyer.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
<< <i>how was the slab packed? >>
I'm guessing in a small sized bubble envelope, and the roller marks from the post office mail processing machine are evident on the envelope. It amazes me how many people are sending psa graded cards this way (what I would consider "big-time" sellers). I get at least one card a week like this, with the envelope punctured normally. Amazingly, most of the slabs survive. Most of them.
Thanks for all the help.
Some sellers still stupid.
File a SNAD claim. EBAY is prolly faster than PP.
You can send a scan of the broken item, too;
but you don't have to.
If the seller has written something like, "You can't
return the item to me," EBAY may let you keep the
item and give you a refund. Otherwise, you may
have to return the item; use DC on the package.
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<< <i>Seller still claims it is not his problem. Is the appropriate action to open an item not as described claim?
Thanks for all the help. >>
Yes, you should open the SNAD claim. Make sure to use DC when returning the package.
<< <i>If insurance is purchased, isn't an insurance claim the first route before a refund? >>
The seller purchases insurance when he ships to protect HIS interest and he is the one who files the claim. So it works like this:
1. Buyer returns the damaged card/slab to the seller (with delivery confirmation!)
2. Seller refunds the buyer
3. Seller takes the damaged card/slab to his post office with his insurance receipt and files a claim.
- John Wooden
<< <i>When you send cards to PSA to be reslabbed you have to send seperate from grading orders and you have to pay the postage and insurance to/from PSA. >>
They'll also review the card before putting it in a new slab, so it could come back with a different grade whether there's any apparent new damage or not. I wouldn't recommend this option unless the seller is paying for it.
File a SNAD claim, wait for them to decide in your favor and then ship the card back to the seller with DC. Once the item shows "delivered" on the usps website, you can call paypal and they'll usually refund you right away (I always call them because I don't like waiting around for the morons they have working for them to check the tracking status).
1. storage fee, since the seller has to store the item for the length of the auction. something like $ 1-5 dollars a day.
2. buyer should pay all Final value fees & listing fees
3. buyer should pay all shipping + insurance, gas , part of my utility bill for keeping the item warm or cold.paper,ink computer & my beer.
4. buyer should pay first & leave feedback first
5. any damage to item , the buyer should have to file the claim with the post office.
6. heck buyers shouldn't be allowed to leave nothing but positive feedback & 5 stars for the sellers.
7. buyers should have to pay a 1.00 for each bid that they place on my items whether they win or not.
8.everyone should paypal me (gift) at least 10.00 to 2000.00 dollars for having these ideas.
now start sending me some money.jmho
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>When you send cards to PSA to be reslabbed you have to send seperate from grading orders and you have to pay the postage and insurance to/from PSA. >>
They'll also review the card before putting it in a new slab, so it could come back with a different grade whether there's any apparent new damage or not. I wouldn't recommend this option unless the seller is paying for it.
File a SNAD claim, wait for them to decide in your favor and then ship the card back to the seller with DC. Once the item shows "delivered" on the usps website, you can call paypal and they'll usually refund you right away (I always call them because I don't like waiting around for the morons they have working for them to check the tracking status). >>
That's assuming the seller used USPS insurance. If they used the eBay alternative ShipCover insurance, the seller doesn't need to necessarily have the damaged item in hand ... the buyer need only corroborate the story. Obviously if one tries to abuse this system they'll get a timeout or something.
Since the seller is being so difficult then the SNAD claim is 100% the right thing to do. Sorry you had to deal with such an unprofessional seller but these people do exist and need to be avoided.
Once this whole thing is settled it would be useful if you could post the eBay user ID so we can all avoid and/or block it. >>
That's assuming the seller didn't use any insurance and is being uncooperative, which appears to be the case here.
<< <i>I had an issue w/ a buyer with a card and I told the buyer to put in the insurance claim, which apparently is now possible via USPS online. They can get their money back this way too, right? >>
Yeah, they should be able to get their money back from USPS as long as you insured it for the full amount. They're under no obligation to go that route, though, as safe delivery is the seller's resposibility.
1) If the item was carefully well packaged for transit by the seller, the post office is responsible
for any and all extraneous damage to the item due to rough handling above what's usual and customary.
2) If the item (say a PSA card) was just thrown into a padded mailer without any extra
protection for the item, the seller is 100% responsible for the damage and should
offer the buyer a full refund.
This type of lame packaging is unfortunately the way many, many sellers operate
on ebay. My estimate is 75% of sellers simply put a PSA card into a padded mailer expecting
the card to arrive safely. Most of the time it does, when it doesn't the seller should
be the one who pays for their own stupidity and laziness in packaging.
Ebay rules usually put the blame entirely on the seller.
So rule # 1 above rarely applies.
Cardboard and extra bubble wrap inside a padded mailer will usually prevent any
damage in transit. Or a 400 ct. box which cost 35 cents, should be used on all cards over
$200 in value. Shipping cost is only $2.09 (5 oz.) plus the box and bubble wrap inside.
So for under $2.60 the card will never be damaged in shipment.
Another thing, it's my opinion ALL cards/items should be packaged well. Not just
expensive ones. The buyer paid their good money to purchase something
they want, they should expect great service whether it's a $10 card or $500 card.
Just my opinion on the matter.
<< <i>I personally think the buyer should have to pay for everything starting with:
1. storage fee, since the seller has to store the item for the length of the auction. something like $ 1-5 dollars a day.
2. buyer should pay all Final value fees & listing fees
3. buyer should pay all shipping + insurance, gas , part of my utility bill for keeping the item warm or cold.paper,ink computer & my beer.
4. buyer should pay first & leave feedback first
5. any damage to item , the buyer should have to file the claim with the post office.
6. heck buyers shouldn't be allowed to leave nothing but positive feedback & 5 stars for the sellers.
7. buyers should have to pay a 1.00 for each bid that they place on my items whether they win or not.
8.everyone should paypal me (gift) at least 10.00 to 2000.00 dollars for having these ideas.
now start sending me some money.jmho
9. buyer should have to pay into a fund, a flat rate per month, to be split between me and diamondman for allowing them to peruse our listings at their leisure, while at home, and not have to spend money going to the Mall or the Local Card shop !!!
YeeHah
Neil
You all are so knowledgeable about the process, I appreciate all the help.
<< <i>So eBay has issued me a courtesy refund for the case and it has been marked as closed. Does this mean I am done with the case and do not have to ship the damaged card back? I ask because I do not have the seller's address as I threw out the envelope. I have been blocked by them and I don't think they are willing to talk to me anymore. I never wanted a free card from them but don't see how to return it at this point. >>
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If the seller gets the "courtesy refund" deducted from his account,
he may appeal and EBAY may direct you to return the item. They
will give you the addy; you can also get the addy thru the site map
link.
The modern practice at EBAY/PP is to look at the communication
twixt the buyer/seller. IF the seller is an angry idiot, he will mess
up and use words similar to "the buyer cannot return the item."
EBAY/PP interpret that to mean "buyer 'tried' to return the item,
seller said 'no,' and now buyer DOES NOT have to return the item."
On a legit SNAD claim, the ONLY correct seller response is: "Seller
will refund upon return of item."
.......
Sellers who do not pack their items to withstand an atomic blast
have no one to blame but themselves, when the PO busts the
items up. HINT: heavy cardboard + bubble mailer.
The seller was: mrpr020103