1859 Great Britain Penny proof or circulated? Help please ~~Pic's are posted~~

coinsarefun

How do you tell the difference?
Any markers to look for?


OK, did some searching on Heritage and the have one proof and one Unc.

They claim the proof's have no W.W. on the truncation. Do I assume this is the initials at the lower bottom of the portrait?
If that's the case, bot at Heritage are proof's so I must be getting something wrong

Also, the toning on the coin........will it grade?
Looks natural to me, but.......you tell me.

Also there seams to be some doubling in the date and on the reverse, with some also on the obverse.


Help please


I placed a new nicer image. The hits on the neck are there but my camera makes them look worse.

7Jaguars

May or may not have cameo. Proofs with some degree of field reflectivity and very square edges. Detail should be phenomenal...Some of the currency strikes can be VERY attractive as well. Hard to describe & the pictures will be vital.

coinsarefun

<< <i>May or may not have cameo. Proofs with some degree of field reflectivity and very square edges. Detail should be phenomenal...Some of the currency strikes can be VERY attractive as well. Hard to describe & the pictures will be vital. >>





Posted

7Jaguars

Currency strike definately. Look on the Heritage auction site archives of past auctions for pics of proof 1839 and 1853 pennies.

JCMhouston

I vote for currency strike also. This is a 1/2d but note the rims.

coinsarefun

Thanks,


The pic's make the hits look worse but can you guestimate the grade?
and what is is value?

I looked on Heritage and only found one proof and one Unc.
So nothing really to get a value

seanq

Sure is pretty - is the 8 in the date repunched?


Sean Reynolds

MacCrimmon

<< <i>Sure is pretty - is the 8 in the date repunched?


Sean Reynolds >>





Looks like a different obv. die/punch from my old example...

coinsarefun

<< <i>

<< <i>Sure is pretty - is the 8 in the date repunched?


Sean Reynolds >>





Looks like a different obv. die/punch from my old example...


>>






Yes, mine looks re punched, but then again most of the obverse and some of the reverse is doubled

coinsarefun

btw I paid $250 for this coin, did I over pay? under pay?....just right?

Will PCGS Slab it and give its blessings with the toning?

IloiloKano

In my opinion, PCGS has been very hard on colored bronzes lately. I feel they've been much too hard, not allowing for the fact that natural processes can actually produce quite colorful bronzes. However, I recognize there are a whole lot of coin doctors with ovens out there. They've also been embarrassed a few times when coins that were determined to be artificially toned by another TPG were submitted to them and got graded. I remember seeing one such case posted on this very forum. So maybe they're body bagging anything if there is any doubt whatsoever in order to not be burned again.

As far as grade, I'd guess MS63, due primarily to the number of bag marks on Vicki's neck.

jessecarlk

the date is repunched. but it is not a doubled die, it is machine-doubled, which doesn't take away from a coin's value, but doesn't raise it either.

coinsarefun

<< <i>the date is repunched. but it is not a doubled die, it is machine-doubled, which doesn't take away from a coin's value, but doesn't raise it either. >>




Thanks, I thought the rest was shelf doubling.


So I haven;t had an answer from anyone yet......was this coin worth the $250 I paid out?

JCMhouston

I don't think there will be a problem with the toning keeping it from grading, and $250 sounds like a fair price. To get much more than that though it probably needs to be slabbed.

7Jaguars

Colors look legitimate, and that is not an issue IMO but not enough red for RB. However that coin would be lucky to get an MS62 BN, IMO 58 because of the amount of chatter and relatively large "sawmarks" at the neck & also eyebrow and ear action, plus look at hand on spear (rev.) and knee. Soft struck as per usual at breast. As stated some soft strike, some baggy wear, and maybe some cabinet friction will limit the grading.

250 sounds about right though not a bargain, I bought not long ago for 150 pounds a more brown specimen & sl. better struck with less wear. Not sure if I would bother to slab though.

coinsarefun

Thanks guy's, I appreciate the help greatly

coinkat

Attractive coin- I like the overall look, but I think 61-62 is as good as it gets. The 1859 and earlier1d coins really vary in price and condition and the forum in which offered is everything. I recently sold a better date in a high grade- thought it could have gone higher

RobP

$250 seems too high for this. I can't see it past EF and the heavy marks on the obverse are a no-no. There should be cheaper and better out there. As to whether it is a currency or a proof - unquestionably currency. As far as I am aware, you can count the number of proofs on one hand. Many people think they have proofs, usually as a result of picking up a previously polished coin without giving consideration to the absolute rarity of the proof coin, but the first question to be asked should be "Do I win the lottery?".