Retiring Clemente's #21 in perpetuity

halfcentman

Although I do not think it will ever happen, Roberto Clemente's contribution to the culture of Latin ballplayers, racism he endured, HOF career, two WS winners, and incredible humanitarian efforts, I was wondering if there was ever a discussion with regards to this topic.

Don't get me wrong, I am putting him on the level of Jackie Robinson (he's on another plane). However, the way I see it, Roberto Clemente is on the plane just below it.

Your thoughts?

Greg

Boopotts

<< <i>Although I do not think it will ever happen, Roberto Clemente's contribution to the culture of Latin ballplayers, racism he endured, HOF career, two WS winners, and incredible humanitarian efforts, I was wondering if there was ever a discussion with regards to this topic.

Don't get me wrong, I am putting him on the level of Jackie Robinson (he's on another plane). However, the way I see it, Roberto Clemente is on the plane just below it.

Your thoughts?

Greg >>



I think the best way to honor someone's number is to allow future great players to wear it.

mcadams

<< <i>Although I do not think it will ever happen, Roberto Clemente's contribution to the culture of Latin ballplayers, racism he endured, HOF career, two WS winners, and incredible humanitarian efforts, I was wondering if there was ever a discussion with regards to this topic.

Don't get me wrong, I am putting him on the level of Jackie Robinson (he's on another plane). However, the way I see it, Roberto Clemente is on the plane just below it.

Your thoughts?

Greg >>



There are better players than Clemente who haven't had that honor bestowed on them. There are also better players than Jackie Robinson who haven't had the honor either.

WeekendHacker

Although it may have never been debated on these boards, it was certainly a topic among MLB shortly after Bud retired #42. It was discussed, debated and talked about again. Then the topic just kinda faded away - it was definitely talked about - but I never heard an outcome. It probably had something to do the the political correctness of minimizing the retirement of Jackie (I can't argue with this opinion)instead of recognizing the accomplishments of Roberto.

itzagoner

<< <i>

Don't get me wrong, I am putting him on the level of Jackie Robinson (he's on another plane). However, the way I see it, Roberto Clemente is on the plane just below it.

Your thoughts?

Greg >>



*plain. you meant to spell it that way, right? sure you did.

Barndog

<< <i>

<< <i>

Don't get me wrong, I am putting him on the level of Jackie Robinson (he's on another plane). However, the way I see it, Roberto Clemente is on the plane just below it.

Your thoughts?

Greg >>



*plain. you meant to spell it that way, right? sure you did. >>



plane was correct. Think geometry.

Brick

In truth Roberto is not with us today because he was on the wrong plane.

Tabe

<< <i>

<< <i>

Don't get me wrong, I am putting him on the level of Jackie Robinson (he's on another plane). However, the way I see it, Roberto Clemente is on the plane just below it.

Your thoughts?

Greg >>



*plain. you meant to spell it that way, right? sure you did. >>


Never good to "correct" someone's spelling when the original is correct

As mentioned above, "plane" was correct here.

Tabe

itzagoner

thanks Ralph. at least YOU interpreteded it the way i meanted it.

Tabe

To get back to the original topic, I don't agree with retiring Clemente's #21. While he certainly was a trailblazer, he wasn't the first Latin player. While he was a great player, he wasn't the best player. While he was a hero for his humanitarian work, how is that all that much different than all the guys who served in WW2? Or Ted Williams, who signed up TWICE?

So, in short, let Pittsburgh have it retired. And let Clemens use it again when he comes back to the Red Sox

Tabe

twiley

<< <i>I think the best way to honor someone's number is to allow future great players to wear it. >>

halfcentman

<< <i>To get back to the original topic, I don't agree with retiring Clemente's #21. While he certainly was a trailblazer, he wasn't the first Latin player. While he was a great player, he wasn't the best player. While he was a hero for his humanitarian work, how is that all that much different than all the guys who served in WW2? Or Ted Williams, who signed up TWICE?

So, in short, let Pittsburgh have it retired. And let Clemens use it again when he comes back to the Red Sox

Tabe >>



I started this because I was more concerned what all of you thought than what I thought.

I am in agreement with you. MLB has an award named after him, and it is highly regarded.

Mickey71

Retire the #. A legendary player and man. Why not celebrate someone who was world wide admired? I love talking about him. Or a better option.....Designate a day (every season) to be Roberto Clemente day and all of the league wear his #. I think it would be cool. I can tell the difference between Jeter and Posada if they wore the same #.

keets

is Clemente held with such high regard because of his baseball status, his off-field efforts or because he was killed in a plane crash at a young age?? i think that because he was killed in a plane crash returning from a humanitarian effort and he happened to be a professional athlete of some noteriety all came toegether to form the Legend.

it should be left at that.

Estil

I think some in this topic are missing the point. They didn't retire Mr. Robinson's number in perpetuity out of his greatness as a ballplayer. They did so out of his contribution to the history of the game, to the history of the civil rights movement (Mr. Robinson helped integrate MLB almost 20 years before most of the rest of the country integrated), and to the history of America in general. Trust me, NO ONE besides maybe Mr. Clemente has even come close to having that big an impact on the game and on history.

Estil

Now that I think about it, Babe Ruth (like Wayne Gretzky in NHL) is indeed very much qualified to have his number retired throughout MLB because he made just as much (if not MORE) a historical impact on the game as did Mr. Robinson and Mr. Gretzky. While Ruth/Gretzky didn't do so out of the cause out of racial equality or anything like that, Ruth very much saved baseball from the Black Sox Scandal and Gretzky is what made hockey into a true international sensation (before hardly anyone outside Canada and maybe Detroit/Boston even cared about hockey).

KalineFan

I just got done reading the book by David Maranis "CLEMENTE"last week. I HIGHLY recommend it
to anyone that is not only interested in Baseball and/or Clemente in general, but, the last
chapter in regards to the plane, the crash and ALL the bizarre things that shaped that
awful New Years eve in 1972, will shock you. Not to mention, it should NEVER have happened.

Sorry if I got off the subject, but, this book was probably one of the best Baseball type
of books I have ever read.

Tony
KalineFan

ALSO R.I.P. #3 Harmon Killebrew - All of Minnesota and the world will miss you!

pbyco

Why not just retire 1-99 and start again from 100. After 10 years, retire 100-199 and start at 200, this way no one hets their feelings hurt.

Mario Lemieux's #66 isn't retired league wide, but who would actually be that bold to wear it? You better be damn good...

illinifan912

<< <i>To get back to the original topic, I don't agree with retiring Clemente's #21. While he certainly was a trailblazer, he wasn't the first Latin player. While he was a great player, he wasn't the best player. While he was a hero for his humanitarian work, how is that all that much different than all the guys who served in WW2? Or Ted Williams, who signed up TWICE?

So, in short, let Pittsburgh have it retired. And let Clemens use it again when he comes back to the Red Sox

Tabe >>



jackie wasnt the best player nor did the humanitarian work clemente did also btw he wasnt the first african american player in the mlb that belongs to Moses Fleetwood Walker

Tabe

<< <i>jackie wasnt the best player nor did the humanitarian work clemente did also btw he wasnt the first african american player in the mlb that belongs to Moses Fleetwood Walker >>


Sure, Jackie wasn't the first. He was just the first after the formal color barrier had been implemented (unless you believe the rumors/questions about Babe Ruth).

Still, do you put Clemente above a guy like Ted Williams, who was a hero in 2 different wars - both of which he volunteered for rather than being drafted - and was a better player to boot?

Tabe