<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
Shane, I'm surprised by your comments...I don't sell very many toned coins, and I believe I only have 1 raw toner listed: a 1904 German 2 Mark. Perhaps you have my account confused with one of these jokers with the easybake ovens? >>
You sell a lot of nice foreign coins and plenty of nice slabbed US coins...but I have seen some raw stuff that was clearly AT and there was no notation so either you had no idea what you were selling or you choose to leave that part out....kinda like when I sold you that nice reverse toner Morgan and the obverse was harshly cleaned and you decided to not mention the cleaning until I sent you a note on Ebay? I know you have the stuff to make a good dealer....you have made a great turn around from some of your selling issue folks used to post about years ago. Just do the right thing all the time and you will have customers lining up for your coins for years to come.
The coin that started this looks 100% AT to me.....anybody else think it's NT and just happened to get stored so it would magically tone in a year?
<< <i>Personally, I don't think Hayden AT'd the coin. At least not deliberately. The color looks like it was caused by storage in something that reacted with the surfaces.
One thing I find interesting is the fact that the obverse toning has some pleasant color to it. This piece was struck over a Peace dollar, and Peace dollars typically develop monochromatic and/or blotchy toning over time due in part to preparation of the planchets. What I wonder more than the means of this item having become toned is whether the preparation of the coin to be overstruck and the overstriking changed the way that the coin would tone. Also, are the surfaces of these pieces less stable than those of a white 1922 Peace dollar? Will these coins, put into Dansco or Bookshelf albums always tone differently than the rest of a white Peace dollar collection?
This is exactly what TD was referring to when he wrote his letter to Coin World and then was ridiculed by another reader. This kind of alteration is going to wreak hovoc on unsuspecting buyers.
<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
If you’re going to libel someone on a public forum at least use intelligible English. >>
It was intelligible ...it was just a typo but I am sure you have never done that before...? By the way the truth is not libel genius Saying her wears green jump suits to bed would be libel since it's not true
<< <i>I don't know Hayden, but I've seen tons of great stuff on his Ebay listings. I'm not trying to stir up anything, but this has me wondering---
Quote from Ebay listing --
<< <i>The coin has developed light toning since its purchase last year. >>
Quote from Hayden on this thread --
<< <i>When I purchased the coin back in January it was already toned, so no, I didn't do it myself. >>
Just a little confused on this, that's all. >>
Per Moonlights production log, this Die Pair 5*, was produced in either Sept, or Oct. 2010, and per the OP was purchased in Jan already toned. Coins did not come out of Moonlight toned*, so the coin would have toned since it's original purchase last year from Moonlight. Per the OP it was toned when he purchased it in Jan. I don't know the OP, nor do I know if his statements that the coin was already toned are true or false. In fact I don't really care one way or another.
I find it funny though that people are giving the OP crap for selling a coin with artifically altered surfaces, when the coin series in question is one with already altered surfaces. It reminds me of the Monty Python scene where they try to determine if a girl is a witch.
*(as stated by DCarr on one of the two other threads related to this coin)
<< <i>I don't know Hayden, but I've seen tons of great stuff on his Ebay listings. I'm not trying to stir up anything, but this has me wondering---
Quote from Ebay listing --
<< <i>The coin has developed light toning since its purchase last year. >>
Quote from Hayden on this thread --
<< <i>When I purchased the coin back in January it was already toned, so no, I didn't do it myself. >>
Just a little confused on this, that's all. >>
Per Moonlights production log, this Die Pair 5*, was produced in either Sept, or Oct. 2010, and per the OP was purchased in Jan already toned. Coins did not come out of Moonlight toned*, so the coin would have toned since it's original purchase last year from Moonlight. Per the OP it was toned when he purchased it in Jan. I don't know the OP, nor do I know if his statements that the coin was already toned are true or false. In fact I don't really care one way or another.
I find it funny though that people are giving the OP crap for selling a coin with artifically altered surfaces, when the coin series in question is one with already altered surfaces. It reminds me of the Monty Python scene where they try to determine if a girl is a witch.
*(as stated by DCarr on one of the two other threads related to this coin) >>
I'm not trying to "give the OP crap", but his listing reads as though it toned since they purchased it, that's all. I take "Since it's purchase" to mean since they purchased it, not since it was initially purchased by another.
I don't care either way if it's AT or not, or if people think Hayden did it or not, but the contradiction was the reason for my post.
Sorry FilthyBroke, I wasn't implying you were with that sentence.
I tried to separate my response to you from my general thoughts on the matter and didn't do a very good job indicating which part was for whom. The first paragraph was in response to yours, the second is my general thoughts on the matter.
<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
Shane, I'm surprised by your comments...I don't sell very many toned coins, and I believe I only have 1 raw toner listed: a 1904 German 2 Mark. Perhaps you have my account confused with one of these jokers with the easybake ovens? >>
Hayden,
Your reputation with me stands on the deals we have done. I have always been happy with the nice coins I have purchased from you - although your prices are not 'cheap' the quality has always been well worth it. Also, you have good, friendly communications and good service.
Having said that, h*ll will freeze over before I every buy one of these POS Carr things, at any price, toned or not. They are total carp.
Anybody carry a working/filled zippo in the same pocket as change? I pocket piece a dcarr token (granted it's copper) and a zippo and a leather pocket wallet, toning started w/in a week....would that be considered AT'n?
<< <i>Anybody carry a working/filled zippo in the same pocket as change? I pocket piece a dcarr token (granted it's copper) and a zippo and a leather pocket wallet, toning started w/in a week....would that be considered AT'n? >>
The question of AT/NT is not a science, it is a subjective art of how coins were traditionally stored and thus impacted by their environment. Intent comes into play and whether the specific toning (market acceptability) makes sense for the coin. Perhaps you should post your results some time.
<< <i>Anybody carry a working/filled zippo in the same pocket as change? I pocket piece a dcarr token (granted it's copper) and a zippo and a leather pocket wallet, toning started w/in a week....would that be considered AT'n? >>
The question of AT/NT is not a science, it is a subjective art of how coins were traditionally stored and thus impacted by their environment. Intent comes into play and whether the specific toning (market acceptability) makes sense for the coin. Perhaps you should post your results some time. >>
I tried taking some pics last week but it was not in the camera cards at that time to show it with the lighting I had. At angles it's got several extra colors to it over when I got it: brown, purple, blue, turqoise. Not crazy morgan/rainbow style but it's there and you can see it in hand with your eye and it looks 100% different than when it was fresh, definitely aged. I'll try again and see if I can get some good ones to show the toning when I get a chance later tonight or tomorrow.
A fresh press silver coin would have a field day in my pocket too I imagine.
<< <i>it's got several extra colors to it over when I got it: brown, purple, blue, turqoise. Not crazy morgan/rainbow style but it's there and you can see it in hand with your eye and it looks 100% different than when it was fresh, definitely aged. I'll try again and see if I can get some good ones to show the toning when I get a chance later tonight or tomorrow.
A fresh press silver coin would have a field day in my pocket too I imagine. >>
Sounds like a favorable environment, your body heat is probably accelerating the process too.
I'm totally surprised no one has even mentioned the rim nicks/chunks at 1 and 2 o'clock on the reverse?!
Do your best to avoid circular arguments, as it will help you reason better, because better reasoning is often a result of avoiding circular arguments.
<< <i>it's got several extra colors to it over when I got it: brown, purple, blue, turqoise. Not crazy morgan/rainbow style but it's there and you can see it in hand with your eye and it looks 100% different than when it was fresh, definitely aged. I'll try again and see if I can get some good ones to show the toning when I get a chance later tonight or tomorrow.
A fresh press silver coin would have a field day in my pocket too I imagine. >>
Sounds like a favorable environment, your body heat is probably accelerating the process too. >>
Comments
<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
If you’re going to libel someone on a public forum at least use intelligible English.
<< <i>
<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
Shane, I'm surprised by your comments...I don't sell very many toned coins, and I believe I only have 1 raw toner listed: a 1904 German 2 Mark. Perhaps you have my account confused with one of these jokers with the easybake ovens?
You sell a lot of nice foreign coins and plenty of nice slabbed US coins...but I have seen some raw stuff that was clearly AT and there was no notation so either you had no idea what you were selling or you choose to leave that part out....kinda like when I sold you that nice reverse toner Morgan and the obverse was harshly cleaned and you decided to not mention the cleaning until I sent you a note on Ebay? I know you have the stuff to make a good dealer....you have made a great turn around from some of your selling issue folks used to post about years ago. Just do the right thing all the time and you will have customers lining up for your coins for years to come.
The coin that started this looks 100% AT to me.....anybody else think it's NT and just happened to get stored so it would magically tone in a year?
<< <i>Personally, I don't think Hayden AT'd the coin. At least not deliberately. The color looks like it was caused by storage in something that reacted with the surfaces.
Russ, NCNE >>
Like a taco bell napkin
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
I don't know Hayden, but I've seen tons of great stuff on his Ebay listings. I'm not trying to stir up anything, but this has me wondering---
Quote from Ebay listing --
<< <i>The coin has developed light toning since its purchase last year. >>
Quote from Hayden on this thread --
<< <i>When I purchased the coin back in January it was already toned, so no, I didn't do it myself.
Just a little confused on this, that's all.
This is exactly what TD was referring to when he wrote his letter to Coin World and then was ridiculed by another reader. This kind of alteration is going to wreak hovoc on unsuspecting buyers.
<< <i>
<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
If you’re going to libel someone on a public forum at least use intelligible English. >>
It was intelligible ...it was just a typo but I am sure you have never done that before...? By the way the truth is not libel genius
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>or introduced to chemicals. >>
Your obviously much smarter on this topic so can you please inform me how I was so blind to the fact that this coin was introduced to chemicals? >>
How do you think toning occurs in the environment? The only question is whether it was induced or from natural causes.
<< <i>I don't know Hayden, but I've seen tons of great stuff on his Ebay listings. I'm not trying to stir up anything, but this has me wondering---
Quote from Ebay listing --
<< <i>The coin has developed light toning since its purchase last year. >>
Quote from Hayden on this thread --
<< <i>When I purchased the coin back in January it was already toned, so no, I didn't do it myself.
Just a little confused on this, that's all. >>
Per Moonlights production log, this Die Pair 5*, was produced in either Sept, or Oct. 2010, and per the OP was purchased in Jan already toned. Coins did not come out of Moonlight toned*, so the coin would have toned since it's original purchase last year from Moonlight. Per the OP it was toned when he purchased it in Jan. I don't know the OP, nor do I know if his statements that the coin was already toned are true or false. In fact I don't really care one way or another.
I find it funny though that people are giving the OP crap for selling a coin with artifically altered surfaces, when the coin series in question is one with already altered surfaces.
It reminds me of the Monty Python scene where they try to determine if a girl is a witch.
*(as stated by DCarr on one of the two other threads related to this coin)
<< <i>
<< <i>I don't know Hayden, but I've seen tons of great stuff on his Ebay listings. I'm not trying to stir up anything, but this has me wondering---
Quote from Ebay listing --
<< <i>The coin has developed light toning since its purchase last year. >>
Quote from Hayden on this thread --
<< <i>When I purchased the coin back in January it was already toned, so no, I didn't do it myself.
Just a little confused on this, that's all. >>
Per Moonlights production log, this Die Pair 5*, was produced in either Sept, or Oct. 2010, and per the OP was purchased in Jan already toned. Coins did not come out of Moonlight toned*, so the coin would have toned since it's original purchase last year from Moonlight. Per the OP it was toned when he purchased it in Jan. I don't know the OP, nor do I know if his statements that the coin was already toned are true or false. In fact I don't really care one way or another.
I find it funny though that people are giving the OP crap for selling a coin with artifically altered surfaces, when the coin series in question is one with already altered surfaces.
It reminds me of the Monty Python scene where they try to determine if a girl is a witch.
*(as stated by DCarr on one of the two other threads related to this coin) >>
I'm not trying to "give the OP crap", but his listing reads as though it toned since they purchased it, that's all. I take "Since it's purchase" to mean since they purchased it, not since it was initially purchased by another.
I don't care either way if it's AT or not, or if people think Hayden did it or not, but the contradiction was the reason for my post.
Edit to add YaHa. He's in my buddylist, too.
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>I'm not trying to "give the OP crap", >>
Sorry FilthyBroke, I wasn't implying you were with that sentence.
I tried to separate my response to you from my general thoughts on the matter and didn't do a very good job indicating which part was for whom. The first paragraph was in response to yours, the second is my general thoughts on the matter.
<< <i>
<< <i>If your going to continue to sell a lot of raw AT coins folks are going to natural assume your a coin doctor...just sayin..... >>
Shane, I'm surprised by your comments...I don't sell very many toned coins, and I believe I only have 1 raw toner listed: a 1904 German 2 Mark. Perhaps you have my account confused with one of these jokers with the easybake ovens?
Hayden,
Your reputation with me stands on the deals we have done. I have always been happy with the nice coins I have purchased from you - although your prices are not 'cheap' the quality has always been well worth it. Also, you have good, friendly communications and good service.
Having said that, h*ll will freeze over before I every buy one of these POS Carr things, at any price, toned or not. They are total carp.
<< <i>Anybody carry a working/filled zippo in the same pocket as change? I pocket piece a dcarr token (granted it's copper) and a zippo and a leather pocket wallet, toning started w/in a week....would that be considered AT'n? >>
The question of AT/NT is not a science, it is a subjective art of how coins were traditionally stored and thus impacted by their environment. Intent comes into play and whether the specific toning (market acceptability) makes sense for the coin. Perhaps you should post your results some time.
<< <i>
<< <i>Anybody carry a working/filled zippo in the same pocket as change? I pocket piece a dcarr token (granted it's copper) and a zippo and a leather pocket wallet, toning started w/in a week....would that be considered AT'n? >>
The question of AT/NT is not a science, it is a subjective art of how coins were traditionally stored and thus impacted by their environment. Intent comes into play and whether the specific toning (market acceptability) makes sense for the coin. Perhaps you should post your results some time. >>
I tried taking some pics last week but it was not in the camera cards at that time to show it with the lighting I had. At angles it's got several extra colors to it over when I got it: brown, purple, blue, turqoise. Not crazy morgan/rainbow style but it's there and you can see it in hand with your eye and it looks 100% different than when it was fresh, definitely aged. I'll try again and see if I can get some good ones to show the toning when I get a chance later tonight or tomorrow.
A fresh press silver coin would have a field day in my pocket too I imagine.
<< <i>it's got several extra colors to it over when I got it: brown, purple, blue, turqoise. Not crazy morgan/rainbow style but it's there and you can see it in hand with your eye and it looks 100% different than when it was fresh, definitely aged. I'll try again and see if I can get some good ones to show the toning when I get a chance later tonight or tomorrow.
A fresh press silver coin would have a field day in my pocket too I imagine. >>
Sounds like a favorable environment, your body heat is probably accelerating the process too.
<< <i>I'm totally surprised no one has even mentioned the rim nicks/chunks at 1 and 2 o'clock on the reverse?!
I mentioned it in one of the other three threads about this coin.
<< <i>
<< <i>it's got several extra colors to it over when I got it: brown, purple, blue, turqoise. Not crazy morgan/rainbow style but it's there and you can see it in hand with your eye and it looks 100% different than when it was fresh, definitely aged. I'll try again and see if I can get some good ones to show the toning when I get a chance later tonight or tomorrow.
A fresh press silver coin would have a field day in my pocket too I imagine. >>
Sounds like a favorable environment, your body heat is probably accelerating the process too. >>
The wife does say I got hot pants.