Putting coins on "Consignment"

Bochiman

I haven't done that, and am not immediately thinking of it, but was wondering how folks handle it (both from dealer and collector sides).

Do you have a form you use? What are the general expectations (time/commission/etc?)?

Is it different for using an internet dealer vs someone with a B&M? B&Ms around me don't have online presences (that I am aware of at least).


I hear stories about people losing their coins from having them on consignment (generally older stories) but would proper paperwork had helped? What needs to be in there? Do dealers take offense if asked to sign anything stating they have the coin (worth $xxxx) and are responsible for it at that price if anything happens while in their possession?


Just curious and hope some folks chime in.

joebb21

Consigned many times- generally good to do it with someone you have a relationship with.
They should have no problem signing some paper.

Genrally Ive seen many dealers pay out 30 days after the item sells.
Some may give earlier.

Also depending on the type of coin, consider someone whos a specialist and has the same inventory.
that way those people who buy that material will be going to the right person

RYK

I have consigned to dealers, ebay resellers, and two auction houses with a variety of different arrangements and results.

In my experience, the consignment with auction houses is the most formal, with legal documents to sign and payment usually delayed 30-45 days after the auction is completed, unless other arrangements are made. If you deal directly, you can expect 100% hammer, unless you are a whale like Longacre. If you go through a dealer or have a large consignment, you can do better than that, maybe even up to 107%.

Consignment with dealers may or may not include a receipt and may have varying degrees of formailty of the terms and process. Terms are generally negotiable, but I would expect to have funds within two weeks after a sale is complete and expect to pay 10% or so (depending on the size of consignment and value of the coin).

Consignment to ebay resellers (like Russ and Jeremy) can to be rather informal, but they generally provide a spreadsheet with the gross payments, expenses, commission charged, and net proceeds after the sale. I also expect the proceeds within a couple weeks after the sale is completed.

kryptonitecomics

<< <i>Consignment to ebay resellers (like Russ and Jeremy) can to be rather informal, but they generally provide a spreadsheet with the gross payments, expenses, commission charged, and net proceeds after the sale. I also expect the proceeds within a couple weeks after the sale is completed. >>




This is exactly how I do it

ArizonaJack

I have consigned with Carl Wolforth and found him incredibly easy to work with. Fast, super professional and very honest.

Teva

I have tried about everything and I feel like if you need to market your coin to realize its full value consignment can be a good option.

TomB

I pay in full for all consignments immediately upon sale even if I accept payment over time (lay-a-way) from the buyer. I also provide high quality images that the consignor may keep for later use in the event that the item does not sell. Additionally, I will do extensive research on an item if the value is unknown or for any other reason. Lastly, all my plans for the item are given to the consignor in advance in the event that the consignor does not want me to take certain steps and the consignment is ended at any time the consignor requests that it be ended. If you consign to someone, make certain they are fully insured, they may be trusted completely and that they give you a receipt.

pennyannie

I would only consign to a B&M or online dealer if i thought i would recieve quite a bit more than going the Heritage auction route. If the projected difference is only a few hundred dollars i would chose a safer way. Online dealers, B&M's can change overnight in this economy and your coins may have made his house payment and no funds left to send you. Sorry i did not intend for that to happen does not pad your wallet.

If i sent them to Heritage i would probably take a draw on them as well unless that draw comes at a steep price. If they front you 1/2 the expected bid then the worst case is you would only lose 50 percent if they decided to go belly up.

I have never consigned coins but i did lose out on a consignment of furniture. They sold my furniture and took off. I had a plasma TV in for service and 2 months later they were gone. Never got the broken TV back. lol

Paper is worthless if there are no funds to cover it. What would you do if a dealer went out of business and failed to send you your check? Short answer, very little. At best a repayment agreement where he makes 1 or 2 payments at best and then you never see another dime.

airplanenut

I think the key is that the buyer and seller should both be comfortable with the arrangement. For example, there are some dealers with whom I have a long-standing relationship and whom I trust in every way. With them, I'm happy to pass something along and know that even lacking a written receipt, we're fine (though often there will be something in an email). With others I trust but may not know as well, I'd want a written receipt.

When I take consignments, I like a record of what I'm getting so that I can ensure the package came without anything missing, and so the consignor can have a record of what was sent. For some, this is a quick hand-written list or an email, and for others, it's a highly detailed spreadsheet printed from their records. Once the sales are completed, then it's up to me to put all the numbers in a presentable format for the consignor so they get back a full inventory list, along with fees/prices realized.

From either side, I think the real key is that no one wants a coin lost or misplaced, so some level of record-keeping should be used to ensure that doesn't happen. The details are up to what keeps both parties comfortable.

airplanenut

<< <i>Do dealers take offense if asked to sign anything stating they have the coin (worth $xxxx) and are responsible for it at that price if anything happens while in their possession? >>

This seems perfectly reasonable, and I would think any reputable dealer would expect to be held responsible. This is, of course, what insurance policies are for.

coinguy1

Here are a some things that I think are important for any consignment......

The consignor should get a receipt for the consigned items.

Make sure that the person to whom you are consigning has an insurance policy that will cover your consigned items.

There should be an agreement as to the minimum price that the consignor will net if the item sells.

The consignor should know in advance, at what price the item will be listed for sale and thus, how much the dealer will mark it up over the consigned price. I witnessed a situation where a consignor consigned at a reasonable price level, but the dealer he consigned to made his asking price double that amount. There was no way the coin was going to sell at that price, so the coin was tied up, needlessly.

The consignor should know how soon after a sale he will get paid.

The consignor should be able to get his item back at any time, upon request, as long as it is not out to a potential buyer or already sold.

The consignor should not bear any costs, unless mutually agreed upon.

The consignor should try to ensure that the dealer or collector he is working with is reputable and in good financial shape.



Below is an old post of mine on the subject of the fine line that a dealer must walk when items are consigned to him:

<<A recent thread on another forum highlighted, what, for me, at least, can be a difficult/interesting /tricky/treacherous/pertinent/delicate type of situation :

What price/level should one accept coins on consignment at and what level to offer them at?

The answers might be easy in the case of a common, generic type of coin. When dealing with a particularly rare and/or esoteric and/or low pop item, however, the right price might be very difficult, if not impossible, to come by.

And, (I think) one needs to consider factors such as : 1) a fair price for the consignor; 2) a fair price for the potential buyer/client; 3) the effect that the list price might have on the reputation of the seller who lists the consigned coin for sale.

I occasionally see coins listed for sale on Ebay or in someone's inventory, where I think to myself, something along the lines of "The guy who is offering this coin is either REALLY greedy and/or he has no clue what he's doing".

I believe that there are certain situations, where it is best to say no to a consignor who wants an "absurd" price for a given coin. Even in saying that, I realize that what is "absurd" to one person, is not necessarily "absurd" to another. In some instances, the money that might be made in selling a consigned item, might be more than offset by the potential harm to the reputation of the seller, if current or potential clients think or know that the seller's prices are out of line.

There have been several occasions where we have said no to would-be consignors, because we didn't feel that we could accept their consignments at their requested prices and then offer the coins to others at realistic levels. There have also been times when we have consigned our coins or clients' coins to public auctions, because we suspected that the coins might bring more than we would dare ask, in good conscience.

I think it is important that both the consignor and the person/company to whom he is consigning a coin, are aware of the intricacies involved in accepting coins on consignment and the potential consequences (both good and bad) to all parties.>>

RYK

Oh, and make sure your ebay reseller is not a pilot wannabe who takes risky flights on the day that your auction is expiring.

roadrunner

The a number of cases where I tried consignments it turned out that the dealer was "placing a home run" price on the item, almost ensuring it would not sell, become overexposed and stale. It's your item, you should have a say in what the ask price is, especially if selling it quickly is important to you. In my particular examples, the dealers were just greedy looking to make 20-30% rather than a simple 10% or so for getting it done quickly.

Another time I consigned the dealer sold my coins, never paid up, and then went bankrupt. In another instance the FEDs came in and shut the business down for money laundering and who knows what else. I ended up getting about 80% on the dollar. With the coin market down and dealers looking for ways to make money, take extra precautions to safeguard your assets. Just because dealer X belongs to the ANA or PNG, doesn't mean they can't go belly up. You'll be the last to know as well. In both of these cases the dealers had a previous excellent track record with plenty of trade references....doesn't necessarily mean you should have no worries. Knowing who you are dealing with rather than taking other people's word is probably more important than anything. Don't be afraid to start small and then add more later. Let them earn you trust.

roadrunner

Bochiman

Thanks guys, especially Mark and Roadrunner.
Jeremy, for the online stuff w/ ebay and such, I like the way you do it as well.

I have sold on my own, and I have had Russ sell a coin for me back in '06, but I am not sure how much I always want to sell on my own (for instance, now that my son is older, I spend much more time with him and homework/sports, so I don't always like to spend time on ebay auctions). I have things like Abe Lincoln silver commems and other things. Not sure if that is worthy and the price hit I would take from the commish.

I was also wondering how dealers who own B&Ms might go about it. I haven't asked the locals, but one of them has a bid board and may be up to it, not sure. I would think that, if it is something a local B&M may not always have, and if the item is worth it, it may be worth trying...not sure. I could imagine a few things that they B&M wouldn't necessarily carry themselves (modern commems are usually one of those for some of these guys...particularly "hot" ones). But, with what Roadrunner states...I am also concerned that things may happen and not sure how to protect myself; particulaly without appearing pushy or rude.

sonofagunk

I consigned a bunch of Lincolns with Wayne Herdon a few yeras back. Very good experience. Better than a "big" auction house unless you have coins that are $10K each. If not, you cannot control how it is auctioned or the quality of the pictures and things like that (a bad picture can kill the price of a coin). When a dealer with a good rep has them, people will believe him when he correctly describes a coin. Wayne took the coins, kept me updated when anything sold, and very couple of months sent me a check (would send them sooner if something big sold).

jdillane

Given your last comments, Bochiman, perhaps the b/s/t is the place to be....

roadrunner

One can certainly can have a say in the writeup of the coin and even the photos. I had a situation where I provided much of the copy for lots I consigned as well as having them reshoot a photo that was not up to quality. No doubt the lots would have realized less if I didn't contribute. And not only that they tried to put them into a different auction time slot and venue after I had it written into the terms of what auctions I would agree to. You can discuss any potential alternatives up front to ensure you get what you want. They do want consignments.

If possible try to work with a dealer that has some leverage in your favor (ie BBB, chamber of commerce, ANA member, trade organization members, etc.). The ANA member thing only has a chance of working if you're an ANA member as well. It probably helps too if the business is in your own state where you could get local law enforcement and/or state consumer protection/attorney general's office assisting you, rather than ignoring you as they do for out-of-staters.

roadrunner

airplanenut

<< <i>Given your last comments, Bochiman, perhaps the b/s/t is the place to be.... >>

I'd agree. For generic material where photos aren't important, you wouldn't need much more than an inventory list. If there's a buyer on the boards, you save the time of waiting for a dealer to sell it and you maximize your take. You could even price it between what you'd net consigning and what the dealer would sell for, which makes the price more attractive for your buyers, and you still make more than your next option.

joecopper

I divested my silver via consignment and could not have been happier - I used a three tier commission (Low-Target-High) and it worked well. Obviously you need to know and have confidence in the dealer. It did take a little time but the return was worth it - I netted 87-88% of retail and these were collector grade coins for the most part. My opinion is that some paperwork is needed but if it gets too much, you got the wrong guy.

Bochiman

<< <i>Given your last comments, Bochiman, perhaps the b/s/t is the place to be.... >>



Could be. I just don't get much into the time spent for the sub $100 or sub $200 things. I still love coins and learning, and spend a lot of time on it, but for selling, I put that at a lower priority and do other things, particularly with my son, or even just reading/posting here.

Maybe I should prioritize selling some of the items over posting?
(many of the smaller items, I think, may do better to walk in types than forum types that are either after a screaming deal (some of the internet dealers that frequent the BST and always try to cut one's price way down because they only want it to sell) or the fact that so many on the boards already have the generic material (which is what a lot of this is.....the non-generic stuff I don't feel like selling...that is for my son to grow with)